Author Topic: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long  (Read 1845 times)

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Offline molynekl

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4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« on: March 08, 2006, 19:32:24 pm »
Hi!  I have a 4 1/2 month-old BF boy.  I only just read BW solves all your problems, but my son does always have activity after eating, puts himself to sleep, and has become a good napper.   I observed for the past 2 days but have not yet worked to institute strict EASY because he had dr's appt. yesterday and just got 4 month shots, making him very fussy and drowsy.  He was a fairly good night sleeper (8-2, feed, 2:30-6) until about 6 weeks ago when he had a growth spurt.  Not knowing I was engaging in accidental parenting, I fed him at night more than usual.  He has continued to wake every 3-4 hours since then.  Since I read the book, I have started the DF the last 2 nights, and now he only wakes once, but I can't tell if it is out of habit or hunger.  It's around the same time (3 a.m.- give or take a 1/2 hr.).  When I have fed him, he eats well, but a couple of times, he has woken at that time because he's wet through his clothes, and once changed and rocked by my husband (it doesn't work for me; he must smell me), he will go back to sleep for 3 hours w/o the feeding.  Now, I'm working to stretch his feedings consistently to 4 hours during the day and make sure I offer both sides even when he seems content w/just the one. 

Typical Day:
8 a.m. wake and feed (he never eats for more than 15 mins. combined both sides)
8:20 change diaper, A of some sort (he's never been able to stay awake long in a.m.--have been trying to stretch)
9:00-11 nap
11-11:30 or 12 A
12 E
12:20-1:45 A
1:45-3 S
3 E
3:20-4 A
4-4:45 or 5 S
5-6:30 A
6:30 E
7-7:30 bedtime ritual, including bath
7:30 S

Sorry that this is so long, but my questions are:  We want to start PU/PD this weekend (when husband can help), but how do we do it if ds is actually hungry and not just getting up out of habit?  I don't want to starve him.  Should we wait to start until he's on a consistent 4-hr. EASY routine during the day?  My lactation consultant suggested giving lo a bottle of water before offering breast to get him out of the habit.  What do you think about this?

Thanks so much in advance for the help--sorry so long.

 
Kristen, mom to


Offline Kimberly®

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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2006, 22:18:56 pm »
I would start with PU/PD with the earlier feeding first. By now you know your LO's cries and you should be able to tell if he's hungry, if not thats ok :)
You have a pretty good routine in the works. I would worry to much at this point about making him stay awake longer in the AM. He's doing good with it.
I would suggest you introduce a dreamfeed, expressed breastmilk if you like, at about 10:30 a bottle is a little easier.
Also when you start PU/PD have dad start it, if your breastfeed your LO will only get more frustrated because he can smell the breastmilk and you, since he has that assosiation right now it might be a good idea to let daddy go in at night. I know its hard, for both of you but it is for the best.
When he wakes though what does he do exactly?? is he crying? fussing? or just kinds of making noise?
Kimberly

Offline molynekl

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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2006, 02:29:40 am »
He wakes a couple of times a night fussing for 5 minutes or less and goes back to sleep.  This wake up that makes me get up, though, starts out as fussing and continues to escalate in volume not to the point of crying though.  I don't know if I should be going in to him at this point or not.  I've tried calming in his crib, but that just seems to make him madder. 
Kristen, mom to


Offline Kimberly®

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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2006, 03:05:07 am »
at this point if he's still takeing a full feed then I say go and feed him at that feed, if not then try waiting just a little longer and see where that takes you.
Kimberly

Offline ~Angie~

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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2006, 03:17:01 am »
I hope you don't mind me jumping in here.  :) We are going through the same thing right now. My daughter always wakes around the same time and takes a full feed in the middle of the night. My concern is that because of this middle of the night feed, she doesn't take much of her morning bottle. Then because this bottle is not very much, she wants to snack all day. I am not sure what to do here. I want to feed her if she is hungry, but at the same time, I don't want it affecting her day time bottles. We have tried letting her resettle herself and patt/shh. Both make her cry harder. We do cluster feed at 6 and 8 (she does this on her own-always wants two bottles right before bed), but no dream feed (doesn't work for us).

Thanks,
Angie
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Offline Kimberly®

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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2006, 04:53:47 am »
for your situation I would suggest that you reduce the amount of her middle night feed a little at a time.
I'm not sure if she is bottle fed or breastfed
if she's bottle fed you can water it down an oz at a time
for breastfed I believe you shorten each feed slowly. I'm not 100% sure for breastfed because we bottle feed but I'm sure if you asked at the breastfeeding bored they'd help you out, or even one of the breastfeeding MOD's on this bored could help you.
Kimberly

Offline teezee

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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2006, 04:58:22 am »
angie - i am all for feeding through the night if the lo NEEDS that feeding.  if it is affecting daytime feedings then i would say it isn't necessary...not saying to stop that feeding cold turkey.  just curious - why does the df not work? when was the last time you tried it??  there are techniques you can use to wean night feeding, watering down or reducing minutes if bf is a great one, worked like a charm for us... what is your daily routine?? it seems she has replaced one of her daytime feeds with the nighttime one and i would like to take a look at her routine before offering any suggestions.
Tawnya
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June 11, 2005




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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2006, 14:39:32 pm »
Thanks to both of you for your quick reply.  :)
Teezee-I am also for feeding in the night as long as she needs it. We cut the feeding down to 4 oz. last night, (instead of the usual 6) so we'll see how today goes. She is bottle fed. I didn't like the df for several reasons: 1. When we have tried it, she will eat, but then is extremely hard to resettle and then ends up waking two hours before waketime. She won't go back to sleep here, so throughs our entire day off. When she wakes on her own, she consistently gets up at the same time. 2.  I like to go to bed early (not a night owl :) ). So, with the df, I would have to get up to feed her. Then wake at 4 or 5 with her again. Once is OK, but 2 I would rather not do. 3. She has had several 8 and 9 hour nights, so I feel that  weaning her from this one feed will be better for us.

Here is our schedule. We are trying to transition to 4 hour, so feed time and sleep are sometimes al little different, but this is generally how the day goes.
7:30 wake
8:00 E
9:00-9:45 Sleep
11:30 E and quick A
11:45-2:15 Sleep
3:00 E
4:15-5:15 Sleep
6:00 E
8:00 E/bed
2:00 am 4oz.


Her bottles range anywhere from 4-6 oz. (less in the morning, more towards bedtime. The 6 and 8 bottles are usualyy 6oz and then 5 oz. )she always gets anywhere from 30-35 oz. in the day. I have tried upping the oz, but she won't take anymore at a feed. She is also a happy spitter (not sure if that is relevant here.  :) ).

We reduced her bottle last night from 6 oz. to 4 oz and she did take a little more this morning at 8:00.

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Offline teezee

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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2006, 16:49:41 pm »
i would feed lo at soon as she wakes at 7am, maybe lengthen her morning A time by 15 min if she can handle it, and then hopefully being a little bit more tired will sleep a little bit longer and then be ready for the 4 hr interval and to eat a 11:30. just try to keep things at 4 hrs even if it means adjusting the routine to look a little like aeasy or whatever works. the 3 pm feeding i would try to push slowly to 3:30 and then not feed again until right before bed at 7:30 or so.  i do think most of the problem is that she is getting some of her calories at night and is expecting that feeding. keep reducing/water down feedings every couple days an ounce at a time or if bf reducing a min or two at a time and as you do this she will naturally take more calories during the day and hopefully not see a need to wake at night. i know from experience if a lo isn't hungry you are not going to get them to take more than they want, just keep offering more during the day and as the nights are reduced it should all fall into place for you guys!  i too got in the habit of feeding at night b/c my dd was a horrible refluxer and the dr said smaller meals more often - i should have stopped when her meds kicked in and reflux was under control - but i felt guilty and felt like i should feed her that way - a few xtra months of sleepless nights really didn't help any of us and i wish i would have started sooner! good luck!
Tawnya
Mommy to Alecksandria
June 11, 2005




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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2006, 17:10:52 pm »
Thanks Tawnya
Our morning A time (1.5 hrs.) is the stretched out time.  ;) This was our first day to of 1.5 hrs. As a result, she slept 2 hrs for her first nap-a first for us!!  :D Which will put her next bottle exactly at 4 hrs. You are right, she does depend on that night bottle. We reduced last night and she took a ltitle more this morning. We'll keep doing that and hopefully everything will straigten out over the next few weeks.

Thanks again to both of you for your replys!!  ;D
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Offline molynekl

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Re: 4.5 mo. old waking out of hunger or habit?--sorry so long
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2006, 21:09:12 pm »
Karita,
In reference to the original post, I will try waiting longer and then feeding if he doesn't calm down.  I will have dh to help now for a while consistently, something I haven't had in the past as he is in the military, which will hopefully help with feeling obligated to feed ds in the night.

Thanks so much for your help!
Kristen
Kristen, mom to