Help! My baby doesnt sleep at night

[snowdrop27]

** I have posted this on two different boards, but for some reason Karita locks the board and i dont get a response. I hope I get some response here  **

hi ...
I'm new to this website but i have read Tracy hog's books and watched her show on television

I have been having sleep problems wit my son since he was born. He could not sleep for more than an hour at a stretch.

First lemme answer your questions -

How old is your child? - 9 months and 3 weeks

What’s his/her daily routine?
6.30-7am - wakes up and breast feeds
and then plays .. he normally goes for a walk outside or sits & plays wit his blocks/ball
7.30-8am - has fruit, banana/payaya cut into small pieces
plays again

8.30-9am - has bath which includes atleast half hr of massage
9.30am - has cereal - about 5/6 scoops
plays

10am - goes to sleep (he skipped his morning nap today for the first time) for abt 1 to 1.5 hr
11.30-Noon - normally gets up
then plays .. normally walks/runs around the house, follows ppl around the house or sits & plays wit his toys

12.30-1pm - has lunch - vegetables, pulses with rice, followed by curd
plays for abt 2 hrs again
3-3.30pm - sleeps for abt an hr. He drinks formula feed abt 3 ounces before sleeping.

he used to sleep earlier before, but has now stopped. Getting him to sleep has become very difficult. All he wants to do is play. Even when i put him in his crib, he stands & plays for as long as i allow it & talks nine to a dozen.

4-4.30pm - hes up .. Sometimes he wants to be breastfed after he is up.
plays for a while

4.30-5pm - has cereal - around 5 scoops
5.30 pm - goes out to play, comes back in an hr
6.30 pm - has juice (normally orange, sweetlime, grape or carrot) abt 2-3 ounces. He drinks his juice & water from a tumbler (has done so from his 7th month)
7 pm - has his dinner - similar to his lunch
7.30-7.45pm - has a quick bath (yes, i use johnson bedtime bath soap)
plays for a while
8.30pm - gets into his crib, he then sleeps anywhere between 9-9.30pm. He normally again has formula feed about 3 ounces before sleeping. As we are Indians, our supper/dinner is little late. He does have finger foods - husks & all kinds of fruits.

he is a very active, playful boy during the day. Doesnt cry & is a  happy boy

What’s nap routine? - 1 nap in the morning around 9.30-10.30am ..
another nap in the afternoon around 3pm

How long are naps?
naps vary between 1 to 2 hours. He however gets up atleast once during the nap. He then needs to be picked up & put back to sleep. Most often i need to rock him gently & sing to him

What's bedtime routine? Time?
well, he has his dinner around 7pm, followed by a bath, he sometime has milk (between 3-4 ounces) .. then i put him in his crib & i either read or sing to him. he rolls around in his crib & falls asleep between 15-30 mins. He normally sleeps around 9pm

Do you bottle or breastfed??
I was exclusively breastfeeding till 2 weeks ago .. I have now started formula feed, he has it twice a day .. plannin to wean him away in a months time.

How much? or how long?
he now feeds between 2/3 times during the day for about 15 mins. and about 1/2 times during the night

If breastfed.. one side or both?? (at each feed)
i feed him one side at a time. Have done this since birth

How many wakes per night?
he wakes up on a average atleast 5 times.

What’s your LO like when waking at night? How long is he/she up?
his eyes are shut and he is crying. He settles down as soon as i pick him up & put him on my shoulder, then i put him back in his crib. Normally he wakes up around 11pm, then 12pm, then 1am. Around this time he cries more .. doesnt get consoled .. pushes me away wen i pick him up .. cries if i put him down .. calms down only if i start to walk around the room & sing or I have to breastfeed (which i now try to avoid).

He will then get up again .. 3am & so on. There are no fixed times for his wakings

I must mention that he never slept for long. during the first 3 months, he used to wake up almost every hour & feed. He used to get disturbed by the slightest of noises & so he was a very light sleeper. I started solids in his fourth month with fruits as milk alone was not sufficient .. he used to sometimes feed for an hour at night!

And he is not colic ..

When you go to him/her is she fussing or crying? Or is it a mantra cry?
answered above

What have you tried to settle??
I have tried ignoring his cries for a few min.. they just get worse. Sometimes however, he settles back to sleep on his own (i now know tat by the way he cries .. its a short waaah) Many a time he also wakes up but goes back to sleep on his own without crying.

He is a very restless sleeper .. he tosses & turns all thro the night .. he normally sleeps on his side and his legs are almost at a 90 degree angle .. sometimes he rolls over in his sleep and wakes up crying and other times wakes up because he wrapped up in his blanket & cant toss & turn or he wants to move 90 degree & cant in his crib or coz he wants to roll over but cant.  I have even brought him into the bed with me & give him all the space he needs to roll .. while tat helps him a bit, he still wakes up cryin sometimes!

What do you do for A time and how long is it?
He plays all thro the day ... hes normally walking/running holding someones fingers, he kicks balls around the place or follows ppl around the house. He sits and plays with his blocks & toys. He is an extremely active kid

Are there developmental issues such as teething or milestones?
He has got 6 teeth so far. He doesnt crawl, never has.. however he can sit, pull himself up & stand and walks/runs while holding our fingers. He can also cruise holding furniture

Have you introduced cereal? Why, how much, and how many times a day? (for LO’s under 6 months)
yes, introduced cereal in his fifth month .. he now has it twice  a day (5 scoops)

Do they have a prop? If so what is it?
Any of his blankets will do for him. he pulls it from his waist with his hand & puts it in his mouth & sleeps. Because of this he gets stuck in his blanket

I have never used a pacifier.

Do they have a lovie?
no.

Please help! I am sure there is something that we are missing here. Any advise on how to get him to sleep longer will be really appreciated.

[Kimberly®]

Sorry about that its to hard to follow posts in there. I was trying to figure out how to move your post here, but you did it for me. I've been trying to figure out how to help you. Unfortunately I only have a 7 month old so I'm not really clear on older babies yet. I havn't any experience with them I think one of the other MODS with an older child may be better to help you.

One thing I can recommend though if your finding that he's waking because of being tangled with blankets is to maybe get him a sleeping bag, its cozy, warm and he wont get tangled like with the blankets, then get a smaller blanket or a stuffed toy for him to use as a comfort item.

I'm only sorry I can't be of more help...

[teezee]

a few things caught my eye although i don't think i can get to everything right now...how many bfs does your lo get in a day?  i still have my lo on 4 and i think it will be that way for the next few months. could your lo be waking due to hunger at night?  i always offer bf as soon as she gets up and then give solids about an hr later.

if he is waking at 6:30-7am and not going to sleep until 9pm that definately doesn't seem like enough sleep to me. have u tried putting him to bed around 7pm? my lo naps aren't nearly as long as they used to be and if i want her to sleep well at night i generally don't let her total daytime naps to exceed about 2 1/2hrs...3 hrs is just too much for her.  but she does get a total of about 13-14 hours of sleep day/night altogether.

it seems that your lo has substituted a couple of his daytime feeds for nightime feedings and that is surely causing the night feedings - not getting enough calories during the day.  what i did to correct this problem (pain in the butt i may add...) was started eliminating the number of minutes i fed every few nights (bf that is..) and within a little over a month she stopped waking for night feedings and just kept waking out of habit...he may be upset if they are cut a little short...but if u use a paci - that worked great for me - if not just soothe lo the best you can...it may be hard it may be easy all lo's are different but if u are consistant with this it will definately work!  by slowly decreasing nighttime calorie intake he will naturally take more bm during the day when he is supposed to. here is the link if you would like to take a closer look for yourself though!
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=46907.0

i would also try settling lo in the crib by any means necessary rather than taking him out.  whether that means shhhing, light patting (both may be too stimulating - it is for my lo) i usually just go in and put my hand on her back/belly until she is calm.  if u have to sing and/or walk around that is accidental parenting and hey if it works and u don't mind and want to continue doing it - go for it if it works for you - but as tracy says 'start as u mean to go'...remember that u may have to do this for the next couple of years and make sure u are prepared to do that...

have u tried a humidifier in his room for white noise to block out some of the everyday noises?? works wonders for my lo!

and also just for additional comfort u may want to try a lovie.  my lo has a 'blanket' with my scent on it (actually an old shirt of mine) and a teddy bear that i alternate with a teddy giraffe (for sanity's sake in case one gets forgotten somewhere or lost...) and she loves to hold her blanket but also cuddles with the soft plush toys...just an idea. i think / i hope i touched on the main issues.  didn't think i would get to them all today but i surpried myself!!  if u have any further questions pls let me know i am around most days!  good luck...

[snowdrop27]

hi ...

Thanks Karita & tawnya for your replies. lemme try answering the points you raised.

Milk - I'd agree with you, I dont think he is having enuff.. but he doesnt seem to want it much. For eg, his morning BF is not more than 5-10min & then he is ready to play; his noon BF is sometimes longer. He is still gettin used to FF or so I think & with great difficulty I get his to have 3 ounces. he too has abt 4 feeds but it wont amount to much.

Nighttime BF- he doesnt need it thesedays .. for the past few days he is not wakin up to feed .. as I said he goes back to sleep as soon as i pick up ( i pick him up only after i try patting him, singing, sshhhin..).& yes, i do mind walking abt but that the only thing that works & I give in after hes been howling for 10 min or more. Sometimes he getts up to have water & then he settles back to sleep. and yes, i'll stil try wat u suggested.

Lovie - I've tried a lovie - he doesnt want any .. i've tried the toys tat he seems to like more, but he throws them away wen he wants to sleep. The only thing he needs is his blanket (as i said any blanket wud do)

Early to bed - ha! I've tried to put him earlier, but he doesnt want to sleep .. as i said he plays in his crib, pulls himself up & cruises around in his crib & babbles & claps with glee  he'll howl when I make him lie down .. roll over & start playing.

For the past two days hes sleeping at 10pm (horrooorrr!) and wakes up 8-8.30am! hes skipping his morning naps too .. goes to sleep at 1pm after his lunch. Earlier his morning nap used to be the best, he used to fall asleep in 2 min after his bath & cereal

so wat am i missing??
hes been this way since birth!!

[teezee]

let me think about this for a bit...here is my routine in the meantime if it will help at all.

8am bf
9am solids and finger foods
10:45 nap
12ish bf
1pm solids and finger foods
3:15 nap
4:30ish bf
5:30 solids and finger foods
7:15 bath
7:45 bf and then bed

your routine should be based roughly upon a 12 hr day...i will keep thinking about things though.

[snowdrop27]

hi ..

his routine is for abt 12 hrs .. he wakes up (nowadays) at 7.30.. hes finished his bath by 8pm .. its jus that he doesnt want to sleep. HE IS NOT FEEDIN AT NIGHT. so why does he get up?

[teezee]

is your lo maybe getting too much solids? i may try eliminating a little from each feeding and see if it helps the milk intake. if it does just find a balance that is good for both of you.

as long as you have eliminated all other causes for the night wakings - hunger, pain, discomfort, temperature etc...have u tried pu/pd? maybe that is what you need to do break this night waking habit.  they have lots of great advice on that issue in the pu/pd board - i know it is hard in the night when you are tired too - but in the long run it will pay off.

[snowdrop27]

yes thanks, i have decided to try the pu/pd method, will start this weekend .. he is sleeping better tho nowadays *touchwood*, but still wakes up abt 3 times at night out of which atleast once he drinks water (is this common?) and then settles back to sleep on his own.

I have cut back on solids but his intake of milk has not increased. Infact for the past few days he doesnt want his morning BF .. he's impatient to get up & start playin. What do i do?

[teezee]

before i had the humidifier in my lo's room she used to wake up and take a drink of water as it was very dry in our house, now that we have it she doesn't.

i am not too sure about the morning feed if you are not feeding at night though...are his feeds the rest of the day good feeds?

good luck with the pu/pd.  it is hard but so worth it for you and lo in the end!

[snowdrop27]

nope .. he doesnt feed well durin the day either ..

after his morning nap, he drinks abt 3 ounces (formula feed).. & tats with a lot of difficulty
then he drinks after he noon nap .. which is decent (abt 15 min BF)
sometime drinks before bedtime .. not more than 3 ounces of FF
early morning BF - he is not interested anymore .. 5 min max

No night feeds either. Can it be bcoz i started FF?

[teezee]

maybe just kind of self weaning? has he always been feeding this way or is it just a new thing?? if it has been this way have you spoken to a dr about it and what does he say?  my lo is about a month behind yours, but i do think that that amount doesn't seem HORRIBLY low...although my lo take about 5 - 7 oz breastmilk at a feeding now so i really don't know wish i could be of more help.

[snowdrop27]

Thanks for replyin so patiently to all my queries    its nice to be able to talk to someone

nope, the less feeding is recent phenomenon .. noticed it from the time i started formula feed .. he doesnt seem to want either now! he did have BF twice today tho.

I guess i'll tackle one thing at a time .. preparing for pu/pd & hope he starts sleeping thro the night. Will keep you posted & how we fare.

thanks again.

[teezee]

well it could be that he doesn't need quite as much formula as when he was getting bm b/c formula isn't digested as quickly. if he is gaining weight normally and definately not losing weight i wouldn't worry about it too much though, just one more baby phenomenon to drive yourself crazy about . 

when you are at your wits end and don't have any other remedies yourself - it is wonderful being able to come to bw to get some advice!  on too many occasions than i could even try to mention it has been my only piece of sanity...glad i could help you get some sanity too...hope things go well with pu/pd - will be thinking of you and good luck and pls do keep me posted!

[teezee]

how are thing going?