anyone want to chat about the 2-1 nap switch?

[debo620]

ok, so what is up with playing in the middle of the night?

yesterday:
wake 6:30
nap 1 10:20-10:40
nap 2 2-3:30 (probabably started a bit late but that was DH as I was at work and he does not watch the clock)
bed and asleep by 7:15/7:30
played from 5am-6:15 am laughing, talking, banging the crib rails,
back to sleep 6:15-7:30

so with the late start today, couldn't fit a morning nap in before 11, went through a bit of a fussy stage at 11 but we played outside and he is happy again, and we will do nap at 12:30pm or so.

[corrina01]

May I just add, that when we were switching to 1 nap, I always went for a walk when the nap time should be, so at least they have a rest.

[babyre33]

Is this ever going to get better???

We did nap #1 after 2.75 hrs (it took a bit to get her to sleep here) only 30-woke on her own
then #2 after 3hrsA time.  She only slept 66 min.  Now it's just after 2pm and it will be a long way to get to bedtime.  I will try a cat nap of course, but i won't hold my breath.

What am I doing wrong?

[debo620]

babyre33,
I said it before but I really think that  you need a little longer A time in the morning, she shouldn't fight you in the morning if she is ready and waking after 30min on her own could be not tired enough.

so try 3.25hrs and 30min nap
and then longer nap 3hrs later

[Layla]

Babyre33 - I was able to extend J's A time to 3hrs at 9 months otherwise she was also "fighting" it so I totally agree with pp.

This will get better but I do think that your lo (just like mine) is still way too young. I agree with Natasha in that some can go comfotably to 1 nap by 12 months but tbh, I still think that the older the better to avoid OT. I sooo remember wanting it all to be over with Isabella at 13months cause she was doing my head in with the naps. Then I found a happy medioum which was 30min morning nap and 1hr+ afternoon nap. It was for AGES until come 15months when she actually started playing instead of sleeping in the morning. That was my cue that she was ready and I went to 1 nap then. She did though have catch up days every 3-4 days where she still needed 2 naps but that went away in about 2 weeks as well.

Ok, my little munchkin BOMBED yeaterday after 2 days of 1 nap (not doing that again for a LONG time) and took a 1hr15min nap ONLY. Bedtime was 5pm, she fell asleep straight away and thankfully no NW. Woke up this morning at 4:47 and I fed her cause she couldn;t be bothered eating at dinner (too tired I say) and she went back to bed till 6am. So I am pretty optimistic this morning. NOt keeping her up for 5 hours again. Too much for her and I think luck was just on my side that she slept 2hrs for 2 days in a row.....

Will keep posting
Layla

[rinajack]

I absolutely, completely agree about consistancy.  100% and just had this chat with DH last night.  We are always home for her naps when we are in town.  It is only when we have to go out of town (min 2.5 hrs each way) that she isn't home for naps.  We used to do this often in a day trip, but honestly, with this pregnancy, (and things are starting to be a problem), I simply cannot manage that stamina wise, so now we stay overnight.  We dont' go out much when we are in town...I maybe take her out to play with other kids 1-2 times a week, and the odd quick trip to the convenience store for something I ran out of. It has been many months since we did anything really good like go to the movies.

Re the co sleeping...this I am finding tough.  I am going to try to push through and not do this, but honestly am finding that choice difficult since I am very very very tired.  We usually only cosleep for naps, not nights, and I feel she is capable of making that distinction, but something sure isn't working here. Also with the cosleeping - I could happily do it 100%, DH would prefer not.

With one nap - her nights haven't actually shrunk if we do one nap...but some times we have NW - and everyone keeps saying this is OT, but it doesn't happen every time we do one nap, and it still happens sometimes when we do two naps.  When we do two naps, her nights HAVE shrunk - because you are right, whilst I can usually get two naps if I try hard enough, after two naps, we have loads of bedtime issues, and that is the one consistant problem I CAN pinpoint.

I guess we will muddle through eventually.

[babyre33]

Deborah, I did try a longer A time in the morning like you suggested a while ago.  It didn't seem to make a difference, except that she would sleep the total amount of time for #2 uninterrupted rather than waking and me putting her back down.

She has been doing that the past few days with me putting her down earlier rather than more A time.  So it's like I'm getting the same "better" results with two completely different approaches.  The thing is I will get a bit longer naps when I shorten the A time, she seems happier, but it's a longer time until bed and she will not do a catnap almost all of the time.

I am not trying to go to 1 nap.  Before she did do it a few times and was alright, so I know we're in the process of transitioning.

We're having a very tough night.  She is tired, and won't go to sleep I did what i did last night and it worked, then when I put her in the crib she woke and was VERY upset.  Now nothing I do is working. Why has she all of a sudden stopped being able to do bedtime?  This has typically been the easiest time of day?

Must go, crying terribly, and I don't know what to do to help.  whne I pick her up she cries when I leave her alone she cries...

[debo620]

babyre....
I'm sorry to hear you are having a tough time tonight, is she overtired?
I still think that in terms of spreading out the total amount of wake time t/o the day, a little longer A time in the morning will leave a little less A time before bed,

what happens to the pm nap with 40min am naps, does she fight sleep in the afternoon or does she only sleep 40min. thats what happened to us 40min am =40min pm, 30min am and we get 90min pm, and if we d0 20min am naps we still only get 90min pm so I would rather do a 30min am KWIM?

so I think offer 40min am 3hrs after waking, if this allows for a better 1.5hr pm and a little less time till bed. If you get no nap or a short nap with 40min am naps, then try 30min.

so
wake 7
nap 10-10:30
nap asleep by 1:30-3
bed 7

Rina, I hear what you are saying about 2 naps. I had also read in one of your posts that you don't wake her from the am nap. So definately, you can't do 2 naps that are 1.5hrs long, but could you fit in a 30min am nap(you wake her) and a 90min pm nap? and then of course as you said, you sort of have to be consistant with the timing/amount of A time to help set her body clock and go from there. Its amazing how being consistant can really help them settle to sleep at those times so much easier.

Noah slept 12:45-2:45, I go him to bed by 7:30 and then he played til 8pm anyhow, so maybe he can handle 1 nap for a few days but then needs a catch up...

[babyre33]

Deborah, you may be right.  It's just hit and miss with the longer A times in the am.  I'm afraid it will exasperate the OT...but maybe not.  We'll see.  Thanks again.  She did go to sleep after I left the room.  She mantra'ed for a min or two.  then she woke after 40 min...it took an hr for her to get to sleep to begin with so she's even more OT now

[binxyboo]

As regards the cosleeping...

We have coslept since birth. Nights have never been an issue for us at all, except on a few occassions where he was teething or whatnot. Naps, we had the usual blips along the way. I love it and would do it again if I had another lo, if it suited us all at the time.

I think sleep  issues tend to be more prevalent among people who are reactive cosleepers, instead of those who are early cosleepers. Meaning, someone who only began cosleeping because sleep issues arose and it seemed the best solution at the time.

I would sit down and think carefully about what your long term goals are  re: cosleeping. Is it something you intend to do when the baby gets here, which of course is do-able?

How does she go to sleep at nighttime? Is she fine then at going into her crib?

[*Kimberly*]

So today was a disaster.  He slept for a grand total of about 15 minutes because we were out all day.  It made for a disaster of an evening.  So, tomorrow we will try again.   

[binxyboo]

Yep, gotta keep looking at the brightside.

[*Kimberly*]

I keep trying.   

[rinajack]

hmmm...it sure has got me thinking anyway....thanks for your help Stacy and Binxyboo.

Independant sleep/Co-sleep- I was thinking about what you wrote this morning...Zara coslept for the 1st 4 months of her life.  We only stopped because I notices she slept so much better the nights DH wasn't there - I think he must sleep in such a way that is disruptive to her.  We have, since then, been fairly reactive - but whenever she had sleep issues, there was a reason - illness, teething etc.  Illness being a big one, she was sick HEAPS (9 ear infections, 2 throat infections, 4x conjuctivitis, 3 viruses, the usual colds of winter) between 5-10 months.  But always slept fine when she was well. So apart, from a couple good months from 10-12 months (hmm and even that might be a stretch), we have helped her whenever she needed it.  So I am thinking our "inependant sleep" might have been a bit tenuous anyway. We started learning to cosleep for naps again when I got pregnant.  I am a high risk pregnancy, and I really really need the rest time (drs orders)...and I am still very at risk of bedrest too.

Zara sleeps with her door shut, so she cannot come into our room if she gets out of the big bed...and she still sleeps much better with me if DH isn't there, so she will need to stay in her room.  I have yet to decide wether I will join her in her bed if needed when she wakes...on the mattress on the floor this hasn't really been a problem.

Zara is having two naps again today...her 1st one didn't even start until 11 and she woke on her own at 11:30- I don't wake her from naps, but she naturally shortens the first one on her own most of the time.  I will be sure to shorten it from now (if tonight goes OK). We coslept for naps today.  She seems to require a long period of rolling and sitting up and laying down to go to sleep.  A good 1/2 hr.  Her afternoon nap started at about 2:30 (not sure exactly when, I fell asleep ), and she has woken herself at 3:45.  I am going to aim for a 7:30 bedtime tonight (unless she seems tired earlier, but after last nights effort, I think it would be a better idea, since she woke from her nap at 2 something yesterday). It will mean a slightly shorter night, but really not much shorter than we are getting in reality anyway, and may be worth it simply to spread the sleep more evenly througout her day.

Right now, she is going to sleep with me (or DH) sitting near her feet (at night that is).  And staying asleep all night after that (mostly anway, and the nights she hasn't, she hasn't settled until after pain meds).  We have been doing this for nearly 2 weeks...I don't mind it if she settles to sleep in a reasonable period of time- if it is taking an hour or more, I think it is a routine issue. This is happening on a mattress on the floor, and she is staying there for the night. When she does wake up, be it morning, or NW, she doesn't even get off the mattress, just cries/yells for me to come and get her. I think the reason we BW instead of cosleep was simply because her and DH disrupt each other.  So 100% cosleep is not an option.

Do you think it is possible to have her sleep in her own room, but have me lay with her to fall asleep each night?

Sorry for such long posts, and taking up all your time....

[*Natasha*]

Rina if you are happy to stay with her till she falls asleep then that is fine. You may find after a while she may not need you anymore especially if she is going through SA and is use to you co sleeping with her.