Author Topic: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep  (Read 11408 times)

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Offline M and N's Mom

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #60 on: August 03, 2007, 16:37:00 pm »
Wow!  I'm really sorry to hear that things are so stressful in your household.

I know that people with more expertise will jump in here, but two things I noticed in your post that may contribute are Overtiredness, and food.

Firstly, if he isn't napping most days I'm sure at 21 months he is chronically overtired.  Most LOs at this age are napping at least 1.5h in the afternoon.

Secondly, I notice that his snack at 2:00 is chocolate or chips/crisps.  Have you thought about offering fruits/vegetables or something healthier as he may be hyped up on sugar which contributes to having trouble sleeping.  Just a thought.

Could you put the baby somewhere else for a week or so and do some serious sleep-training in his own bed?  If he has been allowed to come into your bed, he will keep trying until you consistently teach him that it is not an option.

Anyway, hugs to you and your family!


Offline aisling

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #61 on: August 03, 2007, 17:08:36 pm »
Completely agree with M & N's Mum. 

What about teeth?  How many through so far, is he teething at the moment?  Poor thing re: hospital  :(.  I would guess for sure that would effect his sleeping and bring on a case of Sep Anx, not to mention a new baby and a new bed a lot going on with him.  The training will be tough and may take a while, but it will be worth it.

Firstly, I think you really need to tackle getting him to nap in his bed at a set time everyday with a long wind down.  It may take several days and it will be tough, but then you can sort out the nights. I hope some other Mums on here can help out more as well, the mods of this board are amazing and Stacy is excellent and she hopefully can help you out.   

Is your wife into the sleep training as well?  Or will this be up to you whilst she takes care of the baby?  It is just that it is really important that you both remain committed and consistant.  It is going to be hard, but like you say what is the alternative?  You have to get more rest as a family or somethings going to give and hopefully not your marriage, your health or your job.  You seem like you are a great Dad and I hope it all turns out OK, it has to get better, it just has to.  I'll be here too.   :)

Aisling x

Offline LucyA

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #62 on: August 03, 2007, 20:11:08 pm »
Just some thoughts on amounts of sleep - my ds is 23 months, and a few weeks back we had some trouble getting him to nap. He's never been a great sleeper, or needed a lot of sleep. I find he will sleep 12 hours out of 24 on average, this being either 12 at night, or 11 at night and 1 during the day. He is ok to miss the nap from time to time, but I do think if he regularly didn't nap he would develop overtiredness.

What we aim for at the moment is:
7.30 wake
1pm start winddown, stories etc
1.30 asleep
2.30 awake
7.15/7.30 bath
8pm winddown for bed, stories etc
8.30 asleep

Until we got the timing right Callum was refusing naps and taking ages to go to sleep at night. Eventually I realised he was going to sleep at night at around 8.30pm, regardless of what time I put him in bed. I moved bedtime later and it got much easier. So I'd suggest playing around with the times you try for sleep.
Lucy

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Offline Katet

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #63 on: August 03, 2007, 21:51:26 pm »
Hope I might be able to help here.
My 26mo has been in a bed since 19mo we have had the night visits issues & he too would refuse to nap unless had lots of assistance.
We got to a stage he was so chronically overtired that he slept less than your ds... needless to say I was a wreck too.
With all he has been through & his sleep patterns, while CIO seems like your only option in reality it would be proving to him that all the anxiety of the hospital & the impact of his sibling & all his worst fears are true, that really he doesn't matter & that he doesn't have your support. How do I know that... well long story but through doing some psychotherapy I discovered my biggest insecurity steamed from a childhood incident much the same as you are facing with your ds & to be honest I don't feel I have ever loved or trusted my parents.

The road we went down with my ds (at 22mo) was to go back to the information I got from a sleep session to deal with my own insomnia... you can't make someone sleep but you can set the scene for them to be relaxed enough to sleep. So first night I read stories until he fell asleep, did the same at nap time too... yep nearly lost my voice. Then for the night wakings, I sat beside the bed & told makeup stories, mostly about "boys sleeping", I would stroke his head & cuddle him if he got fidgity etc... now I won't say it improved overnight, but we certainly have less resistance to sleep (except if elder brothers activities make him overtired) & even on occasion he has requested bedtime or nap.
CIO will (esp in a bed) just make him hate his bed & also from an aquantance's experience a 2yo can cry for 5 hours before going to sleep (2-7am)... don't think that will do much for anyones sleep.

I know with my eldest who was a "willing sleeper" although a night waker until 3yo, from about the time his brother was born (22mo) he needed about 20-30mins of stories to wind-down for bed, even if he was telling us he was ready, so reading your post he basically has kisses & then bed, no real stories or cuddles to wind-down & on the nights he hasn't napped & is exhausted, then he is ready to sleep, but when he isn't so overtired he really does need to have something to help him wind-down... all children need that & more so children like your ds who seem to be spirited.
dc1 July 03, dc2 May 05

Offline johnc

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #64 on: August 04, 2007, 20:09:33 pm »
hi evryone and thanks for the support.

thanks for the post katet, we will definatley not be trying CIO no matter how tired we may be, sometimes though it seems the only option, after hearing friends/family/work colleagues saying "let em get on with it, he'll learn eventually, we let ours CIO"

just a quick post, if anyone can oblige, whilst we try to implament $alot of what is advised on the above posts, my wife asked after reading how to balance wind down time reading to jack during the day, to help him nap, with an equally demanding 6 month old.

if any one has routines/tips

cheers

john

Offline mari

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #65 on: August 04, 2007, 20:15:36 pm »
Could your six month old start to enjoy a little story with Jack.  Alex loved to look at boooks even at that age.  :)

Offline aisling

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #66 on: August 07, 2007, 02:13:17 am »
How is it going John?

A x

Offline johnc

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #67 on: August 29, 2007, 14:54:23 pm »
hi A,

to be honest, we gave in to tiredness. my work was suffering as was my wife's ability to be a happy mum all day.

we tried something that will probably be frowned upon and we are creating another issue in the future but we needed some sleep after 22 months of disturbed sleep.

we carry on with the routine as previously posted and put the boys to sleep i n there beds.

after Louis has his dream feed (10.30pm) i lift jack without waking him into our bed, when i rise for work at 6am i move him back into his bed.

he does not wake up at all, and until we feel we are recovered to start a fresh, this seemed our only option.

i have since spoken to a child sleep specialists who has advised that once he gets used to staying asleep allnight, he may sleep all night in his own bed, i doubt it but we will have to wait and see.

thanks everyone for your advice and time, and i hope you are aren't all tutting at me whilst reading this post, :(

john, deb, jack and Lil' Louis x

Offline mcruari

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #68 on: August 29, 2007, 16:44:04 pm »
Hi John,
no judging here ;D
everyone has to do what suits the family at that point in time.
glad you have found a solution for now.

Sinéad


Offline aisling

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #69 on: August 29, 2007, 16:55:34 pm »
Totally agree with Sinead and I hope the sleep specialist is right.  All the best and lots of ~~~sleep vibes~~~!

Aisling x

Offline Colin Macs Mom

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #70 on: August 29, 2007, 17:06:03 pm »
Don't worry John, we often advise people around here to do what it takes to get to a place where you are rested enough to handle sleep training. Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do!
Jessica
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Offline Katet

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #71 on: August 29, 2007, 22:51:59 pm »
John if it working for you & your family then why is it wrong? only because it isn't a socially acceptable norm in western society... if you lived in Asia you would be co-sleeping  :)
I have a friend with a 4yo & a 2yo... the 2yo sleeps in its own bed all night, the 4yo sleeps on the floor of the parents bedroom, a recent move from actually being in the bed... all the family sleep better that way
dc1 July 03, dc2 May 05

Offline johnc

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #72 on: January 04, 2008, 14:33:13 pm »
hello all, thought I'd post an update.

the method of moving jack in and out of our bed worked well for a few months, but he soon reverted to type and began waking up during the night again.

we have just been away for new year with friends and family, and due to a booking error, jack had to sleep in with us for a week, subsequently it is as if we have travelled back in time and he is worse than ever, waking every two hours in his own bed until he gets what he wants and is allwed in our bed, this coupled with the youngest going through a spell of teething equals no sleep at all.

what made it worse was whilst away, a friend child, was the best sleeper i have ever seen, they would bath bottle put to bed, lights of close the door, then walk away and you would hear this 2year old playing around and amusing himself and then eventual going to sleep with no fuss, sleeping all night till 8.30 the next day.

on asking they advised "oh we just let him get on with it" and "he cried it out for two weeks which where hard but it was Worth it".

this made us look very deeply at our problem, with one of us missing most of the night spent consoling a non sleeper, we may have to reconsider drastic action.

anyway, thankyou for all your posts, i doubt anyone will still read this, who wants to hear me moaning on all day?????

em_here

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #73 on: January 04, 2008, 14:38:57 pm »
Just saw this..... am sorry things have been like this, am sure someone will have some more advice for you x

Offline aisling

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Re: help, tired father facing divorce unless we get some sleep
« Reply #74 on: January 04, 2008, 14:40:11 pm »
John big hugs, we're all still here.  I urge you to reconsider thinking that CIO is the method to go with. Please also try not to compare your child to this other LO.  I know many parents that have tried letting their LO cry it out IRL and on here and it was a disaster.  I will let others much more experienced to fill you in with more details and offer some advice.  In the meantime as usual, wold you please mind posting your routine for Jack. Many thanks.

A x