Author Topic: 5 mo old..too many nw  (Read 6607 times)

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Offline Zoey

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #45 on: June 24, 2006, 23:21:25 pm »
You don't like 6pm?  Is he waking early because of it.  There are many nights that lil Owen finds bed at 6-615pm lol.  Daniel is getting SO BIG!  I love that picture, he is so handsome!

Big hugs, and support coming your way!
Zoey
      

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Offline teezee

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #46 on: June 25, 2006, 03:31:37 am »
are you able to stretch any of the A times anymore without lo getting overtired? if not, until lo can handle more - i would leave it there.

how many wakings are you at now? what are the nature of the wakings?? how are you responding?? are you weaning the night feed?

congrats on the steps you have taken and achieved thus far...fingers crossed for you.

i will be away after tomorrow afternoon for a week. but when i get back i hope to hear wonderful strides with your lo!! :)

in the meantime, as i said i will be here til tomorrow so if you need anything pls let me know :)
Tawnya
Mommy to Alecksandria
June 11, 2005




Offline x95stocchier

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #47 on: June 25, 2006, 14:30:26 pm »
Now that you mention it Zoey, it is rather nice to have so much of the evening  :)  But poor DH hardly sees DS.  I think I'd rather be at the 7 pm bedtime.  6 just seems unreasonable.

Tawnya-We're at 2:40 A time right now, and going for 2:45....some days he's ok with it, other days are tough. (especially the days he wakes early and I leave him in crib till wake up time, he obviously has trouble making the A time) 

 His nw are sort of all over the map....some days just 2 (for feeds--around 10:30 & 2:30....had been skipping the 2:30, and waiting till 5 ish for a while) then last night: 8:45, 9:30, 11:20 (feed), 4:20 (feed) then early wake at 5:50...never went back to sleep till we got him up at 6:30.  Some days he's sleeping right up to 6:30, no early wakes (though still nw).    Most days doesn't wake for the first time before 10 or 10:30, but then sometimes, like last night, he does.    ???  I don't see any real difference in the good days and bad days...ie overstimulation, poor napping, etc.

When he wakes, I let him go as long as possible without responding.  I make sure it's a real "need you" cry.  I also tried w2s 2 nights for the 2~3 ish wake up, but it has not worked so far.  When I do go in, I do pu/pd, but never takes more than a few minutes.

I've been "intending" to wean the night feed, but he's been going through his 6 mo gs (hopefully that's not the only reason he slept well a few of those days!) so I've been hesitant to cut the feeds just yet.  That should be over now, though still seemed extra hungry this AM.  By tomorrow I should know better.  But second feed I'm only giving 1 breast now.

I don't mind keeping the early bedtime for a while...espec when he was down to just 2 wakes, and sleeping till morning wake up time most days....but when he wakes lots (for unknown reasons), it's frustrating!  I figure by 7 mo (in a few weeks) we should be able to go for the 3 hr A time (based on what I found on EASY board), so that will hopefully help even out that end of day A time to get back closer to 7 PM.  Still not sure what to do about the nw since they are so sporadic.

Thanks for your reply!
Sarah

Offline teezee

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #48 on: June 25, 2006, 15:12:17 pm »
it very well could be in combo with 'habit' wakings - developmental. there is a lot of stuff going in lo's head right now - trying to accomplish new things...just keep doing what you are doing..i know i keep saying that but it is soo true. that's great it only takes a few min for pu/pd during the night wakings - have you tried just patting or shhing or just putting a hand on lo? try settling in the crib first...

i would absolutely wait til the growth spurt is done also. just keep trying to in the meantime to up the daytime intake as that will help as well.

w2s won't work unless the wakings are at the same time every night - it's always good to try things but that is generally how it goes - as you are supposed to do it one hr before the habitual waking.

i really hope things start working a little faster for you but you have made progress and any progress is good progress :)

if lo is waking a lot maybe try some pain reliever or orajel and see if that will help?!
Tawnya
Mommy to Alecksandria
June 11, 2005




Offline x95stocchier

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #49 on: June 25, 2006, 15:34:48 pm »
Yeah, that's a good point. I don't see any bumps on gums yet, ut it is about that time.

Actually, when I say I do pu/pd, I do a modified...meaning I just place my hands on him and apply pressure (p/s and true pu/pd overstimulated him, he never calmed, just got more riled up).  So in reality, it's 2-3 min of my hands on him saying soothing words to get him to calm.

Okay, I will keep plugging along. 

Hope your trip is vacation. If so, have fun!  Hope to have lots of good news when you get back!
Sarah

Offline teezee

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #50 on: June 25, 2006, 16:48:24 pm »
no not a vacation  :P just a visit to my dad's..

sounds like you are doing everything right with settling :) good for you!!

um btw your avator is gorgeous!! :D
Tawnya
Mommy to Alecksandria
June 11, 2005




Offline x95stocchier

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #51 on: July 06, 2006, 17:43:02 pm »
Are you back yet Tawnya?  Hope it was a good trip! Hi Zoey,
I wanted to update you both on our status:
We have been trying and trying to get his bedtime later, somedays 6:15, most days 6.  :(  I started to realize he's doing 11.5-12 hrs at night, but since putting him to bed so early, he's waking early.

DS now has 2 routines for night:
Scenario 1:
wake 9 ish, either self settle, but usually requires some assistance from me (hands on him, saying it's okay, just sleep, etc)
wake 11:30~1:30 eat
may wake 3~4 but usually self settles
wake 5~5:30 and never really gets back to sleep.. usually doesn't demand being picked up till closer to 6.

Scenario 2:
wake 10:30 ish eat
wake again 2:30~3:30 eat (I've been slowly reducing min on this one, but then some nights he follows scenario 1....)
wake 6 ish, usually doesn't demand being picked up till around 6:30

The past few days I tried something new, though it may be a bad idea.  He's followed scenario 1, only eaten once.  Around 5 I go in to whether he is awake or not, and bf (sort of like a df, though he's mostly awake) and put him back down.  he gets one More sleep cycle, so it gets him till 6:30 or later.  I don't think this is a good habit to form (teaching him to have a feed at 5 AM) but his early wakings screw up his day so much and I can't seem to kick them.

Any other ideas? 

His A time is still at 2:45, except at day end is usually 3-3:30, depending on his naps.  both naps are usually 1:30, but sometimes shorter.  His total day sleep is often slightly less than 3 hrs.  I know you've said before early wakings are a result of too much day sleep or overtired at bedtime.  How do you get to bedtime without being overtired?

Still frustrated with early wakes.  I think he's back to chronically overtired.  He wakes about 12 hrs after we put him down (6-6) but it's not good sleep, several wakes and 2 feeds.  Then 3 hrs or less day sleep.  How do I break it?  Do I need to start putting him down BEFORE 6?  It seems ridiculous to expect him to sleep past 5:30 AM if I'm putting him down at 5:30 PM, KWIM?  :'(  To make matters worse, I cannot stop stressing out about this.  So when he wakes and self settles at 4, I lay there wondering how long till the next wake...etc.

Also, what's the deal with that 9 pm wake?  It's not every night, but about every other or so.  How can I get rid of it? Can I do w2s even though it's not every night?  He's going to be 7 mo next week.  I really didn't think I'd still be working on all of this (how nieve of me!)  Seriously, am I doing something wrong, or is he just a poor sleeper?

PS either of you know what's up with the site lately?  Seems to be down a lot.  ???
Sarah

Offline Zoey

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #52 on: July 06, 2006, 18:26:57 pm »
Hi girl - been wondering about you!  The site has PMS and we are looking into some Midol for it. ::)

The 6p-6a could just be his bio-rhythum, if so there is little you can do to change it. 

Wakings can also be from hunger - is he getting all he can be during the daytime hours?

I'm sorry you are still tweaking! 

Hth some
Zoey
      

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Offline x95stocchier

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #53 on: July 06, 2006, 20:52:12 pm »
Hi Zoey-lol about mydol!
I thought the same about biorythems, but he used to sleep 7-6:30/7  just since we moved up bedtime for the catnap it changed...
I think he's getting enough to eat.  so hard to tell with bf.  But sometimes wakings are 2-3 hrs after he last ate...doesn't make sense that he'd be hungry again.
Sarah

Offline Zoey

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #54 on: July 06, 2006, 21:06:02 pm »
He is just do cute I wanna bite him!  He has cheeks like Owen, don't you just nibble them all day?!? ;D

Have you tried wake to sleep for the wakings?  The one where you go in an hour before he usually wakes and stir him and then sneak out using your stealth abilities, and pray to the Sleep Gods?  Do it for 3-4 days then see how he does.  I find when I use these wake to sleep methods, when you stir, you duck out of sight for a few mins after, THEN leave - I find if I try to leave right away, my leaving wakes him even more then he is up and mad.  Maybe that could help?

What happens if you extend the bedtime by 5 mins every 3 nights til you get to where you want it?  Does he get his bath at night?  If he loves his tubby liek Owen, try leaving him in there longer lol.  The whole world could come crashin down around us and if Owen is in the tub, he doesn't notice lol. 

Also, what happens when you don't feed him when he wakes?  Is he waking cause he is wet from pee?  What was the end result with pupd?   Could you do that or patting when he wakes?  Are you using the soother?

Perhaps bring back the catnap?  Have you tried that?

Do I ask too many questions?  Lol :P

Zoey
« Last Edit: July 06, 2006, 21:08:31 pm by Zoey »
      

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Offline x95stocchier

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #55 on: July 07, 2006, 11:58:39 am »
Not too many questions!  I appreciate the help!

his night wakes are not at the same time, so i haven't been able to do w2s.  The 9 pm one is w/i 20 min, but not every day.  I tried last night anyway, and he woke at 9:30 for 40 min!  ::)  Usually when he wakes, it takes max 15  min to get him back to sleep, so this was different for us.

Was trying to extend bedtime by 5 min at a time, but then he'd have a bad nap day or be particularly overtired and we'd have to scrap it and move up bedtime again that day and then ended up starting all over.

On a non-feed nw, sometimes he self settles (1-10 min) and if I have to help him, like I said, usually takes 1-15 min)  I doubt he's waking from wet, because whenever I feed him, I also change him, but I guess you never know.  don't use a soother, and as for pu/pd per advice of Stacy, we just do more of a pressure (hands on his chest/back and legs) and soothing words  actual pu never calmed him a bit.  This works, though he still gets madder before he calms.

FUnny you should mention catnap...I've been on naps board these past few days talking about that.  I brought it back yesterday since he's SO tired at bedtime.  They said if he can't do 3 hrs A time yet (which he can't) still needs catnap.  Problem is he fignts it.  It took 20 min to knock off yesterday, with some help from me.  All that seems liek a lot for a 38 min sleep!  But I think it helped.  he slept till 6:30 this AM.

I'm still wondering what's causeing those frequent 9 pm wakes..... grrrr...
Sarah

Offline x95stocchier

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #56 on: July 07, 2006, 12:46:12 pm »
Not too many questions!  I appreciate the help!

his night wakes are not at the same time, so i haven't been able to do w2s.  The 9 pm one is w/i 20 min, but not every day.  I tried last night anyway, and he woke at 9:30 for 40 min!  ::)  Usually when he wakes, it takes max 15  min to get him back to sleep, so this was different for us.

Was trying to extend bedtime by 5 min at a time, but then he'd have a bad nap day or be particularly overtired and we'd have to scrap it and move up bedtime again that day and then ended up starting all over.

On a non-feed nw, sometimes he self settles (1-10 min) and if I have to help him, like I said, usually takes 1-15 min)  I doubt he's waking from wet, because whenever I feed him, I also change him, but I guess you never know.  don't use a soother, and as for pu/pd per advice of Stacy, we just do more of a pressure (hands on his chest/back and legs) and soothing words  actual pu never calmed him a bit.  This works, though he still gets madder before he calms.

FUnny you should mention catnap...I've been on naps board these past few days talking about that.  I brought it back yesterday since he's SO tired at bedtime.  They said if he can't do 3 hrs A time yet (which he can't) still needs catnap.  Problem is he fignts it.  It took 20 min to knock off yesterday, with some help from me.  All that seems liek a lot for a 38 min sleep!  But I think it helped.  he slept till 6:30 this AM.

I'm still wondering what's causeing those frequent 9 pm wakes..... grrrr...
Sarah

Offline teezee

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #57 on: July 07, 2006, 14:03:26 pm »
hey sorry been gone so long...

but yes i am back - it sounds like you have gotten good advice from zoey and on the naps board. 12hrs is a wonderful amt of night sleep - my lo only does 11hrs and ALWAYS has..

the 9pm wake usually means lo's are overtired..i know my lo has been doing this since we got home from my dad's  ::) and it is NOT fun...and last night she was up from 11:30pm til 1:30am...so unfortunately we NEVER stop working on these things.  :-\

as for the site i think they are doing some work on it to try to improve with the glitches and everything...hopefully will be done now :)

if he isn't able to make it to bedtime without that catnap then for now give it - or give it sometimes if he seems to be having a good nap day and seems that he will be ok til bedtime...
Tawnya
Mommy to Alecksandria
June 11, 2005




Offline x95stocchier

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #58 on: July 09, 2006, 16:04:06 pm »
Thanks for your reply.  He's woken at 9 for the past 4 nights.  Even if it is from overtired, would w2s maybe work?  he was less overtired last night (I think) but still woke at 9.  Do you think w2s would work?  I guess it's worth a try. I've never done w2s at night....do you still touch them so the just barely stir like with naps?  I read somewhere one person flips her lo over to do w2s...seems like a lot more than "just barely stirs".  When I go in, should he be in a deep sleep?  (ie if he's aready stirring, should I skip it?)  Then, how many days do you w2s?


update: did a short AM nap yesterday, normal Pm nap, then catnap, and he slept till almost 6:30 this AM! (though he did have a few nw...plus night feeds...)  I'm so glad he slept in the morning though!  ;D
Thanks!
Sarah

Offline teezee

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Re: 5 mo old..too many nw
« Reply #59 on: July 10, 2006, 05:24:45 am »
ok i am no expert on - i repeat NO EXPERT on w2s..but here is what i can offer..maybe zoey can help you some more :)

at night w2s - go in 1 hr before lo usually stirs

if lo isn't in a deep sleep then i suppose your options are - 1. put your hand on lo to help settle
2. don't go in and see if lo settle himself

i would barely stir lo...anymore and i would think it would actually wake lo and defeat the purpose kwim?

i have heard w2s can continue anywhere for 2 or 3 days up to a week or two.

happy month birthday to daniel!!!! and so glad to hear he slept better. glad the nap tweaking has helped :)

don't know if i have mentioned this to you - have been weaning the night feed? is the 9 pm waking the only wakings at night now?..besides that early wakings (which has hopefully been overcome :) )?
Tawnya
Mommy to Alecksandria
June 11, 2005