4 Hour EASY with no DF?

[M and N's Mom]

Hi.  My DS is 4 3/4 months old.  He has been on a 3 hour EASY since birth, without the DF as it seemed to interrupt his sleep even more somehow.  We took his paci away 2 1/2 weeks ago (with Zoey's help on the pu/pd forum - thanks Zoey) and are starting to do ok with that but are having trouble moving to the 4 hour EASY.  Sometimes he is ready to be awake longer (2 hours) but sometimes he seems really ready at 1 1/2-1 3/4 hours. 

He is showing most of the signs of being ready...shorter naps (which used to be good), night wakings (although he was never great at this...never slept through ), and less interested at feeding times.

What I'm wondering is if anyone has done a 4 hour EASY without the DF?  I still feed him once at night.  His last feeding has been around 6:30 and he wakes to eat once sometime between 2 & 4am.  The other wakings are not hunger.  He is breastfed.

I can't really post a schedule as it isn't the same every day.  We start the day at 7:30 and can usually get to 3.5 hour easy, but not always.

Should I be doing E at 7:30, 11:30, 3:30, and 7:00...any other cluster feeds because no DF?
What about when he wakes long before the next scheduled feed?  Then what?

Thanks for any advice

[KDawn]

Hi, when we switched to the 4 hr, dd only ate 4x in day, w/last feed at 6.  She then would wake up once around 2 to eat, and then not till am.  She wasn't overly hungry at 7 am, so I was thinking of how to eliminate when one evening she decided to wake, and was crying.  I was trying to put her back to sleep, but decided to feed, and then she slept right till morning  It was awesome.  She is only bf, but now eats solids 3x a day.  From about 4 mos she was eating at this schedule, then at 5 1/2 mos, she started the evening feed and goes till morning.  She really doesn't have a 4hr easy, but it works for us because she sleeps well.  She eats at 7, 10:45ish, 2:30, 5:30-6.  In bed no later than 7, and gets nursed around 9:30.  Only prob is she is waking early in am, but not to eat, just to play!  Good luck, it definately made a difference going to the 4 hr easy.

[M and N's Mom]

So do you now wake her at 9:30 or does she wake alone?  Sounds wonderful...hopefully the 4 hr will help my DS.  Does your DD nap well?

[KDawn]

Hi, if she doesn't wake on her own by 10, then I wake her.  I am actually tempted not to wake her to see if she would sleep till am.  Still scared to though!  I like sleeping through the night again.  Her naps are great.  Am 1 1/2, afternoon 1 1/2, and then quick cat nap.  I think it might be too much sleep, but if she doesn't get that much she seems to be very fussy.  Getting rid of the soother also helped.  I am going to ask my mom how many times a day she nursed me and my sisters.  From about a mo old all of us were sleeping (w/o eating at all) 12 - 14 hrs!  And she didn't read a any books on how to do it.  Go figure!  Sorry this rambles, but I found trying to do a dreamfeed resulted in her always waking at that time, and not being really hungry.  So that is why I think I am going to quit waking her and see what happens from there.  I also find her A times are hard to extend sometimes.  To switch the easy, I found at the night feed, I fed only till she wouldn't cry if I laid her down.  This helped her take more in the am, which helped all the other feeds then.  I guess that is why she weaned herself from the night feeds, she was eating enough in the day.  We did this at 4 mos.  To stretch it more, we would go outside and play w/ the bunny/cats/dogs.  Just to get her mind off of eating.  Worked for us.  Let me know how it goes!

[jumblebox]

random thoughts & comments...

Maybe, because he's been on the 3 hr for so long, he's getting sleepy out of habit, more than really being ready for a nap? Just do what you can to keep him awake a few minutes longer, without upsetting him. With our DS, we often take him outside for a few minutes when we're trying to keep him awake & happy. You could also just go to 3.5 hr EASY, if he really seems he isn't ready for 4 hr.

If you're in the midst of switching from 3-4 hr EASY, I would at least give the DF a try for a week or so. You're already dropping one or more feedings by extending the schedule, and you want to make sure your LO is getting enough to eat during the transition. Since you BF, are you waiting til 6 mo to start solids? That's only about a month away, and I've read that's a good time to try dropping the DF (when they're getting more calories during the day).

If you stick with 4hr, and your LO is waking (happy) with lots of time til next feed, you'd probably have time to play for a little while, then try for another nap. If he's waking unhappy, I would definitely try to get him back to sleep for longer.

Good luck!

[M and N's Mom]

Thanks for the advice.   I did try to feed him less at his 4am feeding, as you suggested KeiraDawn, but he wasn't having any of that.  I tried putting him down 3 times and each time he cried until in the end he had mostly a full feed.  I'll keep trying though as he wasn't all that hungry at the morning feed.

Yes, I'm waiting until about 6 mos to start solids but that is only a few weeks away.  I kind of think there is no point in trying to start a DF now (after never having one) if it will take a couple of weeks to establish it and then we'll have to turn around and drop it.  I'm also scared since when we tried it before it seemed to cause more night wakings.  We have had 2 days so far with only 4 feedings during the day (instead of 5 previously) and he is still only waking once a night to eat so I'm hoping that means he is picking up the extra calories during the day feedings.

I think that you're right, Jumblebox, that some of his sleepiness is habit.  If we can distract him we can get some more time out of him.

We'll keep plugging away, and I am going to keep trying to feed him less in the middle of the night if I can (if he'll let me  .  Eventually he'll get it...I hope 

[KDawn]

Hi, good to hear you are down to 4 feeds in a day.  Hopefully when he gets used to it, he will on his own drop the other night feed, or move it to evening so that you can get a full nights sleep!  I think this week we are going to try dropping the pm feed, as she isn't hungry anymore for her am feed.  Plus, I am finding I am making her eat at the pm feed, which in turn is not letting her be hungry enough in the am.  But, be proud of how far you have come.  I had a friend who bf, but didn't use bw, and was nursing pretty much every 2 hrs, day and night!  And that was still at 7 mos!  I also agree w/ sleep being a habit.  From reading how long their naps should be, and how much she actually sleeps, there is a big difference.  One other thought, the past 2 wks, I started topping her up w/ a bottle of ebm while nursing.  I found she wasn't getting enough as she did in the day, slower letdown, less milk etc at supper. 

[Duckie]

My ds#2 is 3.5 months and gets 8ozs at 7/11/3/7.  He sleeps from 730-630 and doesn't wake to be fed.  This has been going on for a few weeks now.  The dreamfeed interrupted his sleep (just my opinion) and the fact that I would sleep with the baby monitor on kept me up and rushing in.  He's LOUD and often wakes up to babble and yammer away, so unless he's crying I just leave him!