3.5hr easy for 12week old?

[bear]

Hi sorry I am posting. I did read the FAQ section, but I have a question for the 3.5hr easy. My LO is only 12weeksold, means he can't stay awake longer then 1&1/2 hrs. I take that back he can and sometimes does if he is fighting sleep, but that leads to a 45min nap, so what's the point. Anyway. He won't eat much at the 3hr mark, so I moved him to 3&1/4 and 3&1/2, but he won't sleep until it's time to eat. So now that isn't E.A.S.(Y). So what do I do? I mean, I have let him have A-time before the feed, because he isn't hungry when he wakes and isn't sleepy anymore either, so what CAN I do, but it so defeats the purpuse of EASY, doesn't it?!

[becky1969]

We moved to a 3.5-4 hour EASY at 12 weeks. At first, my LO was short napping. The reason was b/c at around 12 weeks, sleep patterns for babies change and we need to re-teach them how to fall asleep when they stir at the 30-45 minute mark. In our case, he also wasn't getting enough awake time. I thought I saw sleep cues at 1hr15, but it turns out he was ready for 1hr45 of awake time!

Like your LO, Owen was not very hungry at the 3 hour mark, so we ended up having small bottles early in the day, and draining bottles at the end of the day. He'd wake before the dream feed b/c he was so hungry. At any rate, we were able to transition to 3.5 then 4 hour easy by doing some nap extension techniques (wake-to-sleep, holding legs down thru jolts etc.). Once I did that, naps were 2 hours, he was awake 1.5-1.75 and we were pretty much at a 4 hour EASY schedule.

As I understand it, and AEASY schedule is no problem. you just want to avoid feeding to sleep. As long as there is activity after the feed, it is no problem to have activity before the feed. Most people have to do AEASY at first, I believe, when transitioning to 4 hour EASY since the awake time is not quite long enough.

I'm not sure if that answers your question, but I'm sure a monitor will be by to correct anything I've said wrong or to clarify!

Good luck! You are hitting the FUN age, as far as I'm concerned! When Owen turned 3 months old, it's like he came awake all of a sudden. It was very exciting, and has only gotten better! 

[estherofi20]

Hi there,

i also changed my DS to a 4hr EASY at 12 weeks, i did this 'cause he just wasn't hungry at the 3hr mark nor the 3.5hr mark for that matter, so i did it cold turkey from one day to another, it was a bit rough for a couple of days, and he did get a bit grumpy at the longer Atime, but i distracted him by walking him around the house which he totally adores, and then he started to have 2hr naps, and everything fit into place. What i did was to keep him awake for 1.5hrs, and at the1.5hr mark i started the wind down, and he took it really well.

[bear]

Question for both of you: before you extended A-time did your babies go down easy? Today, when I put him down with his eyes wide open, he closed them within 10 seconds and was off to dreamland.

Now it's not been 45min, so I don't know what it will bring. As for w2s: I have tried it before, but when he supposibly is to stir, he MOVES, it's not just jolts. I mean everything is moving: head left to right to left to right...., arms, legs,.... I tried to hold it all, but I only have 2 hands, and most of the time he wakes from the pressure and then sees me and it's game over.
Any suggestions?

Also when you moved to 4hr/3.5hr easy did you drop the catnap?
He had been going to sleep at 7:30pm and didn't wake until a 5am feed (NO DF), yesterday I let him have only 3 naps and he woke at 2am for a feed and then was up by 6am. Then again I guess I am coming up on a growth spurt anyway.

[estherofi20]

We didn't drop the catnap until he was 6MO.

And before i extended Atime, my DS was easier to put to bed (considering that it could take me 45min of pat-shushing him) it would take me like10min, but after i changed him to a 4hr EASY, i could just place him in the crib and leave, i don't know if it was coincidence or what, but it became MUCH easier to put to bed

Since you say he jolts a lot, perhaps you can do the "tuck", it migth help him with the stirring, here is the link. https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=63879.msg474327#msg474327

If you decide to change him to a 4hr EASY, you could also add some cluster feeds, if you say he is going through a grow spurt

HTH

[becky1969]

The problem with my LO was I had to REALLY go in early for WTS - like at the 20 minute mark - in order for it to work. Otherwise, I'd barely touch him and he'd start moving and then waking up.

The other thing I ended up doing was just sitting in his room for the entire nap (which, since they were 45 minutes, didn't take long!) to observe him. With that information, I started going in WAY before the jolts started and just gently held him down. I found if I started the hold down before the jolts got crazy, then it worked. If he got TOO jolty, it happened like you described: trying to hold a wildcat in a papersack! Like you say, you only have 2 arms and it causes them to wake up from all the jolting and the heavy pressure. So, going in earlier may help either with WTS or holding thru the jolts.

The clue that I need to extend A time is always that he becomes harder to put to bed. After we extend A time, he almost instantly goes to sleep. I can't even finish one verse of "Hush, Little Baby" before he's out like a light! And you know, each and every time he gets difficult to put to sleep, I forget to extend A time? I always think I'm on top of those sleepy cues when it turns out he really can stay awake longer, and needs to! One of these days, I'll get the picture! 

[bear]

Hi,
I did a 4-hour easy yesterday and it worked fairly well during the day, actually it worked very well, but he woke at LOT more at night. He used to sleep from 7:30pm until 4:30am, I would sometimes hear him stir at 1:45am/3:15am but never a sound. Yesterday, he woke at 11:50pm and then at 3:00 and then at 4:00 and then again at 5:50am, but put himself back to sleep until 7am. I went in at 11:50pm to feed him, since he is breastfed and only got 4 feedings instead of 5 during the day, but he wasn't really hungry or though it seemed, and 3:00am I just soothed him back to sleep and at 4:00am I gave him a feed.
Are/were your babies breastfed when you moved them to a 3.5/4hr easy at 12 weeks? It's so hard to gauge how much he is getting. He will only nurse for about 5 min and then doesn't want to go back to the breast. Sometimes I give it 10min and try again and he sometimes will eat more. Still, I don't know. Maybe he is getting enough in 5min since he only nurses 5min at night too. I just don't know and was just wondering if you have any advice there.

[estherofi20]

Hmmm well nope, my DS has allways been formula fed, but maybe you can try to give him a dream feed, let's say at 11pm?

[becky1969]

Mine is FF too, so can't help you. This might be a question for the BF board.

But I agree with Esther - a dream feed might be important now. After we moved to 4 hour EASY, we HAD to do the dream feed in order to keep 5 feedings in his day. Once you get solids established, then you can slowly wean that DF - which is what we're doing now! We've been solids on a month now, and I'm trying to dump that last feeding at 10:30 pm.

[bear]

Becky1969,
when you went in and put pressure on your son as you said  I REALLY go in early for WTS - like at the 20 minute mark - in order for it to work and With that information, I started going in WAY before the jolts started and just gently held him down. Do they still open their eyes at the end of the sleep cycle? If so, do they actually see something, i.e. you or is it just a stare ? Just wondering if I were to hold him down if I can get away with it if I start early enough or whether all that will be for nothing because once he sees me he will still wake completely.

Well, I had a good day yesterday, morning nap was 1&1/2hrs, second was 2hrs (I had to wake him) and then two 45min naps, which works fine for me right now since that gives him 5hrs of daytime sleep and he slept fairly well at night.

I appreciate the recommendation for the dreamfeed, but for once my husband work starts really early so we go to bed fairly early and second, I personally think that you are disrupting their sleep cycles with a dreamfeed, maybe not if you give a bottle and leave them in the crib, but when you pick them up to breastfeed....
As wonderful as it sounds that they will then sleep from the DF until the morning, I just can't get myself to do it.

[becky1969]

bear - the DF is a personal decision. It has to work with your lifestyle. If you're already in bed, and would have to get up to give it, then might as well wait for baby to call for you! However, I also thought DF disrupted sleep. And at first it did! But after a week, he got used to it and doesn't ever wake up now! I know that sounds crazy, because you're lifiting them out of the crib, etc. But if they are already in a deep sleep, they'll stay there most of the time. Again, it has to work with your schedule. If it were me, I'd do what you're doing - just wait for a hunger cry since you're already asleep! I'm having trouble with DF right now because my DH is not able to do it anymore due to work conflicts, so I'm having to do it and I'm used to going to bed at 8:30/9:00! That's why I'm hoping to get rid of it SOON! LOL!

Yes, LO's eyes would often open. There were 2 kinds of eye openings; one would be where he would open them sleepily stare about blindly, then shut them again. It was clear to me he WANTED to shut them. The other was where he'd come sTARK awake, and then I knew it would be a battle getting him back to sleep. But at 3 months old, he didn't see it as a signal to play. That didn't happen until about 6 months for us, but I think all LOs are different that way. I think you could probably experiment a bit. I was REALLY scared to experiment myself, but if naps are short anyway you have nothing to lose! I also want you to know that WTS or holding thru the jolts takes a while to work. Do NOT be discouraged if it doesn't work the first 9 times you try it, because suddenly on the 10th your LO will turn their head to the side and put themselves back to sleep!

In fact, in our case, what happened was his naps were short. I was in despair. I was doing WTS and holding down. I just got used to hearing him wake up sometime between 30-45 minutes. I dutifully went up to do what i'd been doing for 3 days, I didn't even pay attention to what I was doing I was so hopeless. But, all of a sudden I realized I was trying to shove a paci in his mouth and he was turning his head away from me! So, I finally STOPped and watched him: he was puttng himself back to sleep! I couldn't believe it because the other 9 times I tried it, he was nowhere near putting himself to sleep. After that, each day he jolted less, cried less, and went to sleep faster until I didn't even hear him stir at the 45 minute mark anymore! since then, we've had short naps on occasion, but we've been able to nip them in the bud within 1-2 days insteady of 7.

[cathbilson]

Just a note on W2S. My son seems to go to 45 minute naps every time something disturbs our lives, for a few days. The way for me to beat them is to walk into his room at the 30 minute mark, wait until I hear him sigh, and then walk out again. Just the noise of me opening the door seems to be enough for him to stir, I've never had to touch him (tried it once and he was awake and yelling in moments!) You really don't need to wake them up. It seems enough that they do a little sigh or movement (kind of like you rolling over in your sleep) and then they go back down and the 45 minutes starts again.

[becky1969]

cathbilson - that's an awesome idea!! you're right - you're just trying to get them to sigh. My LO is pretty easily disturbed too. He's woken up just from having us LOOK at him in the crib! I think our breath did it!  I like that - listen for the sigh after you open the door.

[bear]

Hey,
I can't seem to help my little guy at the moment. I had him unswaddled last night, just the sleep sack and he did just as well as in the one-handed swaddle. I tried it today for the morning nap and THAT didn't work. SO I swaddled him completely for the 2nd and I was able to hold him down for a second go around of 45min (I was aiming for a 2hr nap, but after he woke completely after the 2nd sleep cycle). His third he wouldn't go to sleep swaddled, so I left his one hand out, he fell asleep but only for 40min. Now he is down again, fell asleep sucking his thumb, but I know I have to wake him at 5:30pm for a feed. It would be 4hours at that point, and I don't want to let him go longer than that during the day.

DO they really stop that 45min thing and how long does it last? I am trying so hard to help out, but sometimes I just want it to run it's course and be done and over with.

[cathbilson]

bear,
I read somewhere (can't remember where - don't think it was a BW book) that between 6 and 8 months babies sleep cycles change from 45 minutes to 80-90 minutes.
So looks like we've still got a while to suffer, then.
Sorry.