Very confused by 15 month's new sleep habits

[lucmom]

Hi everyone,
We need some help!  We'd had some early wakings(pre-6 am) lately, and we've been treating them like we always do (wait to see what the cry is and try to wait until 6 to get LO if he's not too upset).  In the past, if we were consistent, he'd usually straighten himself out in a couple days whether it was early wakings, short naps, night wakings or whatever.  But of course, once you're used to it, it changes!

Our LO is now on his second week of waking up before 6 every day and the last two nights, he woke up before 5!  He's on a single nap, usually 1 1/2 hours long (goes down between 11:45 - 12:30 on most days), but yesterday he only slept 30 minutes!  I know that being overtired is a possibility now, so we're trying to increase opportunities to sleep (we put him down early last night and he woke up before 4!), but he also seems really happy and in a good mood all day.

I've eliminated teething (I think -- he has everything but his 2 year molars), noise, lights, props.  His nose started running a couple days ago, so maybe it's all been related to that, but I'm not sure because the early waking preceeded it by a while.  However, since he has a cold now, I'm hesitant to try wi/wo.  And if this is all cold related, do I just roll with it, or do I try to help him so that the early waking doesn't become a habit after the cold is long gone?

The really confusing part is that all the disruptions are erratic.  It might be 5:45 one morning, 5:15 the next, then 4:30, and then back to 5:45.  The nap might go well or not.  Some nights he sleeps really soundly until 4:30, then wakes, other nights he's restless off and on, but then sleeps closer to 6:00.

Prior to this period, he's been a really good sleeper with only a few bump times, sleeping 11+ hours at night and good at putting himself back to sleep, so this continued inconsistency is unusual and leaving us frustrated about how best to help him back to the path of good sleep.

I think I've read about every post on sleeping related to kids this age, and I'm also wondering if it's something that's really common developmentally at this age and requires a new round of sleep training (WI/WO or whatever) even for kids who have previously been good sleepers or if keeping to the previous ways of reacting is the way to go?

Can anyone help?  Thanks!

[imsmum]

How long has your lo been on one nap?  Your lo is napping fairly early, especially for one nap of 1.5 hours.  I found that with my dd that it was such a chore at first just to do the one nap that we were ok having an early nap and it didn't lead to any sleep problems.  But at some point it became counter productive as it seemed to a)reinforce a too early wakeup and b) was too early in the day causing her to be overtired by bedtime, which led to night wakings.  We were in that vicious cycle for quite a while! Early wakeups can also be a sign of overtiredness/going to sleep too late as well.

Taking a look at your full schedule would help but I'd imagine given the early wakeups etc. your lo is pretty overtired by now so you could try an earlier bedtime.  How is your lo when he goes down--does he crash or take a while? Early to bed was pretty key for us to help get past overtiredness issues because even if there were nightwakings and/or an early wakeup she got more sleep at the front end of the night.

While the early bedtimes did help I found that I had trouble getting my lo to sleep anymore than 12 or 13 hours after waking for the day so when that happened I had no choice but to try to move the nap later despite my lo being tired.  I learned through hard experience that if my dd was not asleep 5 hours after nap wake up she would wake in the night, so I would just work backwards in order to determine naptime.  For us that did mean early wakeups for a while with a schedule of 7:30-5:30 nights and a 1.5 hour nap at 12:30 whcih was only really helped out by a convenient time change.   

Not sure if any of that helps but do post your schedule, if you have a moment.   

[lucmom]

Thanks imsmum,
I thought we were pretty early for one nap as well, but LO was doing some erratic night and early morning waking at 13 months, and an experienced BW doula we knew moved him to one nap when she was watching him one day.  It was bumpy for about a week, but then he settled pretty much into the following schedule:

6:15-6:30 wake -- cup of milk
7:30 breakfast
11:00 lunch (sometimes 10:30 on days when he was too tired to go further)
12:00 nap (still varies from 11:45 - 12:30 depending on his signals) -- most often 1 hour 20 minutes
2:30ish snack/second lunch
6:00 dinner
6:30 bath, bedtime books
7:00 bed (asleep by 7:20)

He used to settle a bit more quickly before I weaned him, but he still goes to sleep usually within 20 minutes of going into his crib at the most.

We've tried earlier bedtimes, especially with short nap days, but that doesn't seem to make a different with early wake ups.

He's been more restless than usual at night in general -- is that normal for this age or perhaps related to everything else?

Thanks so much -- I've read a bunch of your posts on this site and they are so helpful!

I think that you're right that part of this is the whole transition to one nap at his age, but on days when we've tried to nap him earlier to squeeze in two naps, he fights it.  And, he doesn't act overtired (other than the wake ups) -- he's in a great mood and happy everyday.  5 1/2 hours seems to be about right for our LO and that was working until the past week.  Do you think we should try to get in two naps even if he doesn't seem tired? 

[Harrisonsmummy]

The thing that is standing out to me is the nap length - looks like one sleep cycle. Harrison would wake after 1hr 20 mins when he transitioned. Now I have never figured out wake-to-sleep, but I think you may be able to extend that nap a bit. H sleeps in pram so it is easier for me, but I did have some success in rolling him into the next sleep phase by waiting outside door just before his normal wake-up time of 1hr 20mins and as soon as I heard him stir would gently put hand on back, and a bit of pat/shush etc to help him.

A couple of days of this and you may help to extend the naps and ease the problem somewhat.

I would also advocate very early bedtimes to ease the overtiredness. The early wake-ups always seem to take much longer to get out of than to get into - so it is worth trying early bedtimes for several days to get get an effect. H takes about 3 days to catch up after only a minimal disruption, so hang in there!

Good luck

Justine

[imsmum]

Hmm.  I agree with Justine, the nap is a bit short but it seeems some lo's get stuck o a 1.5 hour length after transitioning.  I was never able to extend naps.  I think Florencia had some success going in and laying her hand on Manolo before he stirred and she was able to extend naps that way (or was that for early w/u's??).  Certainly try that by all means since lengthening the nap will probably push bedtime and morning wakeups a bit forward for you. The only thing that seemed to help dd get slightly longer naps was when she moved it back a bit herself.

Even though the early bedtime doesn't seem to help with the morning wakeups you might want to try them in the short term to help him get a bit more sleep in but I would do it in combination with trying to push the nap back a bit so it is more consistently at 12:30.  If he is more rested at night, even with the early wake ups he'll be able to go a bit longer in the morning since it sounds like he struggles somedays. 

Do you think pushing his breakfast back .5 hours might help as well?  I think most lo's have a bit of a drop in energy mid-morning around the time they used to nap and a lot of mums give a snack then.   So either pushing breakfast back a bit or giving him a snack around 9:30 with lunch at 11:30(eventually once the nap moves back a bit)may help as well.

I wouldn't go back to two naps.I think it does confuse their body clocks and would just try a slightly earlier bedtime to help him catch up on sleep. 

Good luck and let us know how it is going.

[lucmom]

Thank you so much for the suggestions!  He stirred in the 3:00 am hour last night, but then went back to sleep, but unfortunately, then woke at 5:00 (which sadly, actually felt like an improvement!).  He was quiet for most of the next hour, although I don't think he was sleeping.  He did the same nap today as usual, but needed to go down by 11:00, so I'm not sure how much to move bedtime up tonight.  I'll probably try to have him asleep by 6:30, and hope that I'm helping him with the overtired part. 

Thanks for the support -- I've been caught off-guard by this since he seemed to be transitioning smoothly to one nap before we hit this bump.  I'll see how the earlier bedtimes goes for a few nights, and then try wake-to-sleep. 

[imsmum]

Glad there is some improvement!  I had a similar experience where the one nap transisition seemed to be going well but then got de-railed and we were unfortunately on that cycle for a few months.  I think in some ways I was helping to perpetuate it because I would put dd down to nap early because she had a bad night but then she was overtired by bedtime so she would wake in the night...and so it went.  As difficult as it is I think you do have to try to inch the nap slowly towards where it will eventually be, in conjunction with early bedtimes, as a later nap may actually help your lo from being too overtired at bedtime and waking in the night.  It's a fine line though you don't want to push the nap so latethat your lo can't take it, or he's staying up too late at night.  Looking at yourschedule I think I would try for a while until your lo gets caught up on sleep a bedtime about 12 hours after a his normal waketime--so around 6:30 and a nap around 11:45 to 12 and you can slowly push back both nap and bedtime as his night wakings decrease. 

[lucmom]

I think your advice is right on the mark imsmom.  During this changing time, do you respond according to how it's gone that day?  We've had a couple days where he slept longer or later so that he woke up from the nap around 2, which seemed to allow for a later bedtime, which resulted in a later wake up (I can't believe it worked that way, and now that I've written it, it will surely change!).  But if the next day, it's an early wake up, do you move the nap back?

In other words, what I think I'm asking is do you set the nap and bedtimes by amount of wake time each day, or go for a consistent time each day both during the transition time and after the one nap is well established?

Forgive the lack of clarity -- cumulative sleep deprivation is getting to me!

[imsmum]

I'm going to have to double check--maybe I'm just having a foggy Monday or could it be that my my experiences of that difficult 2 to 1 nap experience that I thought was seared in my memory is actually fading??   But my recollection is that I was being very responsive to each day's changes as I thought I was being a godd BW'er but that was in fact working against my dd.  So I think I tried to achieve a middle ground of a set nap time and bed time but would allow for some variability (like .5 hours) if dd had a particularly early wake up or bad night.  Her naps were pretty consistent though so we had a fairly set bedtime although I found eventually I could move it forward a bit and that helped. 

You know, I'm going to check my diary again to see what exactly we did, but that's my best recollection right now!

[lucmom]

Imsmum -- thanks, please let me know what you did.  We've been trying the same kind of thing...varying within .5 hour but trying to stay consistent as much as possible.  We had a good couple of days before today -- he took a 2 hour nap a couple days ago, then slept well during the night, put himself back to sleep when he woke at 5:20 until 6:30, and then took a good 1.5 hour nap!  But of course, then the setback.  He woke this morning just after 5 and didn't cry much but also didn't go back to sleep, then DH only got a 35 minute nap!  We'll try to compensate with an earlier bedtime, but here's my new concern...

I think that a lot of what is going on is LOs cold interferring with his transition to 1 nap, so am resigned to waiting that out before I try anything too different.  But tomorrow, we are scheduled to go out of town to visit his grandmother, and then stay with some friends for the long weekend.  I'm nervous as to how much worse this might make the situation.  Cross your fingers for us and if anyone has advice on how to handle multiple disruptions to routine, please share!

[Lucysmom]

Hi There -

I just wanted to jump on here to say that I also have a 15 month old who was really a wonderful sleeper who is now having lots of problems!!!  We moved her to one nap a few weeks ago without a problem (or so I thought).  Now we have early wake ups and last night she woke at 3:30 and would not go back to sleep.    I finally rocked her to sleep after MUCH PROTEST on her part at 5:30. 

Her one nap schedule was like this:

Wake 6:30/7 followed by breakfast
9:30 or so Snack
12 Lunch
12:30/1 Nap
She would nap anywhere from 1.5 hours to 3 hours.  I would wake her at 3:30 if she was still sleeping as I read in BWSAYP that anything later than 3:30 would interfere with bedtime.
Snack upon waking
5 Dinner
7:30 Bed

I have noted that her sleep has recently become more restless.  I hear her tossing and turning a lot more.  And she does not seem very rested in the morning even if she does not wake up early.  She is not cold or anything.

Because she was seeming tired in the morning, the last few days I have put her down for a morning nap.  And now from what I have read that is not a good idea.  She would sleep from 9:15 to 11 and then I would let her catnap from 3:15 to 4.  But she would not be happy after her catnap.  And then last night she would not let me lay her down in her crib at bedtime.  She kept crying and protesting and it was a nightmare!!

So I gather that I should try to keep to one nap and have it as close to 1 as possible, right?

I will look around to see if there is something developmentally regarding their sleep that happens around now.  I know the restlessness could be overtiredness but I noticed this even before we started having problems.

I should add that she has gotten 2 molars but we have been giving her Motrin and she does not seem to be in pain at all. 

I hope that I have not hijacked this post but I thought it was too strange that I was having the same issues as Lucmom!  Even our usernames are similar LOL.  Ok, so that was cheesy, sorry!!!!!!!  I am sleep deprived!  I hope he gets over his cold soon! 

[lucmom]

Lucysmom,
You are welcome to hijack this post -- the more the merrier!  Although I'm sorry you're going through this too, it's reassuring to hear that you're having such a similar experience -- gives me hope that we're just going through a transition/developmental phase that will pass if we keep with it.  Mine is often also more restless during sleep.  Let me know what you find out.

I've heard that some people go back and forth with the 1 and 2 naps and it works fine, and read other posts that say it's best to stay with a consistent time so their body clocks get used to it, and others who say to go by wake time....it seems like only experimentation and hindsight will tell...ack!  We did early bedtime last night and had a 5 am wake up today!

(I hear you on the sleep deprivation!  I think I'd just truly accepted that my LO was a good sleeper and started sleeping really well myself, and then this happened!  Can you imagine what the high school years will be like? LOL)

[TwiceAMomma]

Okay I have to tell you guys that as sorry as I am that you guys are going through this, I am so happy to find that I'm not alone.  My son is 15 months and I swear aliens came and took over his body!  He used to be a great sleeper in the way that for naps and bedtime we would read him his books, kiss him, and lay him in his crib where he would put himself to sleep without a peep.  Now he freaks out.  He too just got one of his molars and is unfortunately working on the other 3 I think.  So I am thinking that a lot of this has to do with age.  And I really hope it passes soon because I'm due with #2 in a week.  So if you guys need to vent or compare, let me know! 

Good luck!
-Sarah

[andibig]

hi
Another hi-jacker to this post . Sasha seems to be on either 2 naps or 1 nap (can't seem to make up her mind!) and i can't even blame it on teething as shes only got her 2nd yr molars to come! thing is she would nap for 2 hours (more if pos )but i have no idea when she should start her nap .
this is her routine at the moment so if anyone can help???
6.30-7am wake and milk
8am-b/fast
10-10.30 catnap
12.00-lunch
2-3.30-nap
5.00pm-dinner
7.00pm- bed.

generally with her afternoon nap shes fine but the catnap she takes a while to settle and wakes up grizzly

[lucmom]

Hi everyone!
So, how much do you think this might all be the transition happening at this age since the changes seem so similar?

Sasha's mummy...could you try skipping the catnap and doing the afternoon nap earlier?  Her schedule looks great if you could do the nap around 12:30, but I'm not sure of the best way to move the nap back.  I know there are a lot of posts about it on this site.

Judesmom, we had sleep disruptions as well during the molar teething and it went on for awhile.  The canines too, but that was pretty quick.  Our LO also jumps up and yells and jumps for a couple of minutes when I leave the room at night, even if he was reaching for the crib saying, "bed...night night" right before!  I think it's now part of his process of winding down (like a "wait, don't leave me I want to play, ok I'll go to sleep), but I'm missing those sweet put downs at bedtime.  It doesn't last long enough or seem bad enough to try anything, but I always feel bad when I leave the room now.

Our LO did great on vacation -- slept in (past 6 - ha!), took great naps, and now that we're back, he's doing early wakings again!  I do think some of the original change was due to the sickness disruption to his transitioning from 2-1 nap, and then he got overtired, so for now, we're thinking that we'll try to make sure he gets enough sleep, even it if means 2 naps or slightly early bedtime, and see what happens.  I'd love to hear what everyone else is doing -- venting and comparing is more than welcome!