PU/PD and WTS not working for 4.5 month old's naps

[laurencopenhaver]

So should I not feed him in his room?  He eats so much better in there but will he start asscoiating that with the wind down etc.?  Also what did you do for the winddown?  I'm curious on how long and what kinds of things I could do?

[laurencopenhaver]

He's doing very well with the paci.  He's taking it in the crib, and if he hasn't dropped it by 10 min asleep I yank it out and he doesn't wake up.  And sometimes when he's calm he'll spit it out and go to sleep without it.  And it never leaves the crib.  Does this sound okay?

I'll have to find another spot to feed him; b/c with my husband home if he sees him he's not at all interested in eating and wants to scream and play w/ daddy.  And w/ the tv, lights, dog, etc. he's easily distracted.  And w/ his new found mobility (rolling over, grabbing toys, etc.) he doesn't want to sit still.  The other feeds during the day, should I move them out of his room too?  Should he strictly associate his room w/ sleep and not eating?

[laurencopenhaver]

Okay good!

I want to get one other thing straight...when he wakes early morning, say at 5:15 or 5:30 and he doesn't cry for real, only mantra cries, but can go on for 45 min to an hour, I just let him be right.  Only go when he really cries?  When he does this and finally gets up at 6:30 and eats, he tired and ready for a nap at 7 or 7:30.  How am I supposed to keep the rest of the day on track, or am I?

[laurencopenhaver]

Well usually that early AM is mantra for 10 min then quiet for 10 (which makes me think he fell back asleep) then awake and mantra etc.  But if I don't respond to other mantra cries during the day maybe he won't associate mantra w/ mommy.  And maybe if I feed him early, b/c he usually starts waking around 4:30 or so; and if he's still half-ass awake I'll feed him by 5.  How's that sound?

He's always wakes up anywhere from 3-4 for a minute and puts himself back to sleep, but last night he didn't make a sound from 10:30 until 5:30 this morning. 

Also he almost always wakes for his DF now, does that mean I'm not going in soon enough and he's getting too hungry?  B/c I don't want him to get in the habit of waking for that.  If he hasn't woken me up by 10:30 he always wakes not when I feed him.  What do you think is going on there?

[laurencopenhaver]

I do that.  It all depends on when he last ate.  If he eats at 6:30 I do it earlier, if he eats at 7 I do it closer to 11.  Should this be something to worry about and really try not to wake him.  I might have to go back to the slower nipple b/c he's on the 6-9 month nipple and it still comes a little fast for him, so maybe if he's not getting as much that will help.

[laurencopenhaver]

Maybe twice a week he'll wake, and the other times he wakes when I feed him but always falls asleep by the end of it.

[laurencopenhaver]

Last night he ate at 6:15 and was in bed at 6:30.  He woke at 9:45.  He ate 7 oz, so he was hungry I guess.  But he usually only wakes that early if he eats early like that.  Sometimes it's 10:30 or 10:45, it's not usually the exact same time every time.  Last night too, or I should say this morning, he woke at 5, so I put 2 oz. formula 4 pz water; he ate 3 before falling asleep again.  Then he woke at 6, talked to himself till 6:45 then we got up and I tried feeding him at 7 which was 2 hours after that bottle of 3 oz and he wouldn't eat.  I had to force 2 oz.  What do you think is happening there?  Was he not really hungry at 5 or was 3 oz too much?  I have no idea, I'm stumped on what to do now.

That bedtime routine worked like a charm.  I got in the tub with him at a little before 6.  Then I fed him at 6:15; then we sat in his chair and rocked w/ the nightlight on and turned on his mobile to listen to the music for a few minutes.  Then I swaddled him sat back down (not rocking) for a few min. then went to bed.  He fell asleep fairly quickly.  I usually stand there w/ my hand on his chest to make sure he falls asleep w/out getting his arms out of his swaddle.  Is this okay or does he need to fall asleep w/out me there?

[EsMum]

Hi there, it sounds like you've been having quite the time with all this!  When we taught our LO to self soothe and go to sleep in her crib (instead of on one of us) we used shh/pat and even after she fell asleep I would stay there with my hand on her chest for a few minutes.  I don't know if this is "right" but it worked for us.  We didn't have to keep it up for long - pretty soon we were able to put our LO down in her crib, tell her "sleep time", give her a kiss and leave, and now she puts herself to sleep.  We do the same thing every time and I think she really appreciates the consistency.

I have had to feed my LO in the dark for about 2 months now, because of her getting distracted by every little thing!  I don't think she looks at it as part of the wind-down, she just looks at it as getting food.  But again, I think she appreciates the consistency of knowing when she is going to eat.

Honestly, our LO did not do well with suggestions from the BW until she was about 3 months old, and even then it was only bits and pieces that worked for her.  We do a modified EASY that works for her and adjust as necessary because she is always changing.  I used to stress and worry because she wasn't doing exactly what the book said she should be, but that's just the way our LO is, she is happy, she is healthy and that is all that matters to us.  Good luck!

[laurencopenhaver]

Yeah if he's calm in the crib he turns his head and looks the other way to fall asleep so he's not focused on me at all.  I just stand there, (mostly b/c I think I like to watch him fall asleep) but I'm not patting or shhing just standing quietly w/ my hand on his chest.  I'm confident I could leave, in fact I almost always do at night once I know he's entirely focused on going to sleep.

With the AM feed, I'll try one oz. of formula and 3 oz of water.  He didn't mind the water at all.  I can see this disrupting his eating cycle, b/c he's a very sensitive baby anyways.

I think I'm getting better at reading his cues.  Well I guess he doesn't really have any until overtiredness kicks in.  But one thing I'm confused about is he used to be very content and calm during the wind down when I was holding him, now he gets real fussy when I hold him and actually calms down better and quicker if I lay him in his crib.  Ya know why this is?  I assume it's not a problem...

[riuliani]

I experienced the same thing with the wind down.  I just assumed it meant he was getting more proficient at soothing himself to sleep and didn't need me anymore.  I saw it as a good thing.  If I held him for too long he would get angry and wound up.  Now I don't even hold him at all.  Just a swaddle, a kiss and down he goes.

[laurencopenhaver]

Good to know.  How do you paste the little lilypie on your account?  I went there and did it but I can't figure out how to paste it.

[riuliani]

I am going to assume you know how to create your marker on the Lilypie.com website.  Once that is done it is easy to have it appear on your Babywhisperer postings.

1) On the Lilypie website, after you have made all your selections, copy the code (aka giberish) that appear in the box "HTML Used for web, email and forums that allow HTML."

2) On the babywhisperer website go to your profile page and choose to modify your forum profile information.  Paste the code from the Lilypie website into your signature.

Then when you make a post it should appear below your post.  Let me know if you run into any difficulties.

[laurencopenhaver]

Thanks Riuliani.

Hey Stacy, I put Kyler to bed last night at 7, didn't take only but 2 oz for the DF, woke up at 4 so I BF him.  He ate well, but still woke at 5:45 and talked to himself and Mantra until 6:30 when I finally just got him up.  Why do you think this is?  Am I still putting him to bed too early?  The night before he got up this early too but I figured it was b/c he went to bed at 6:30 (B/c he got up that time that morning too?)
And He's been ready for bed early b/c he's been getting up earlier.  But I waited until 7 last night, he was real tired but went to bed very well.  Should I keep him up until 7:30 and/or should I go in when he's not really crying and try to put him back to sleep.  He really will talk and mantra for a very long time if I don't go in.  What should I do?

[Mom to M&M]

True - the DF never worked for us. So we gave it up and would just feed Marisa when she woke - which for a while was somewhere between 1-3am. Eventually she dropped that night feed - but the DF only seemed to disrupt her sleep and cause wakings.

[laurencopenhaver]

Marisa'sMama-How long before she dropped the 1-3 feed?  The DF used to work like a charm, but now it seems to be disrupting sleep I think.  And even the last two nights he's gotten an attitude like "mom I don't want this I just want to go back to sleep."  But he almost always takes a full 6-7 oz so I'm confused.