Time to Pay the Piper.(kinda long, lots of questions)

[hoosiermama]

Okay.  Here is how it went last night and today. 
Bed at 7:45 pm (we were at a friends house)
1st wake at 12:15 BF
2nd wake 1:42 (binkie and bounce (in amby)
3rd wake 2:20 b&b
4th 2:40 b&b
5th 3:18 BF
6th 4:40 b&b
7th 5:44a.m. BF(Tried to put him back to sleep, but wouldn't go to bed, usually we wait until 6:30-7:00 to get him up)
A. Until 7:00
S. 7:00-8:30, in bouncy and swing

E. 8:30
A. until 9:30
S. 9:30-11:00 in swing
A: until next feed

E. 11:30
A. shorter this time
S:11:45-1:00 in swing.

E. 1:00
A.Until 2:00
S. Took in the room and started wind down, swaddled, walking around the room patting on shoulder for a few minutes.  Put in crib about 2:40.  This was the first attempt today at pat/shh.  It only took about 5-10 min. and he fell asleep, woke up (by his brother) about 20 min later.  Pat/shh slept for another 20 min.

E.3:00 starting to cluster feed.
A: until 3:40
S.  Took him in the room, did same wind down routine, but he did not take a nap here. 

E. 5:00 bottle (41/2 oz)
A. Wasn't going to do activity, but would not settle down.
S: put in swing for catnap about 6:00.  Up at 6:30

A: Going to do wind down with brother (this is where we are at right now!)

[hoosiermama]

Well, last night went pretty well.  I think that Owen might be a pacifier addict though .
He was up quite often, but we got him back to sleep pretty easily with the binkie and patting.  He slept until 6:45 this morning!
My question now that I have been trying it is, he generally wakes up after sleeping for 2 hours and 45 min.  Do I pat and shhh (he can nurse after 3 hours right?) or do I feed him?  He seems hungry, but It is hard to tell in the dark and his crys are usually pretty frantic.

[nursekat]

Wow, that sounds like an awful night!  I would have been in tears after that!

Oooh...good point with the pacifier addiction, tell me more about that.  I recommend going to the props FAQs and checking out some of the posts there.  Paci addictions can cause lots of night wakings - my dd woke every 15-20mins for a few nights, every time it fell out.  We finally took it away and things got so much better.

If he seems hungry, definitely go ahead and feed him.  I definitely understand being unsure at night as to what the issue is!  If only babies could tell us what they meant!    What I did at this age was try to pat/shh and see if I couldn't get dd back down, and if it just made her more agitated, I fed her.  Also, if I got her back to sleep but she woke back up in 20-30mins, it meant she was hungry as well, so I fed her.

So tell me again, is he sleeping in the amby only or are you working on getting him in the crib too?

And to clarify, during the routine above, was he awake from 1pm to 6pm except for a 20min nap?  It looks like you start your day out right with naps and awake times, but as the day progresses your LO is getting more and more overtired.

[hoosiermama]

Sorry, we are strictly in the crib now. He took a 40 min nap yesterday between 1-6.  So yes, he was very over tired.  He did do pretty well last night.  Today he has been going down for his naps beautifully, usually falling asleep on his own, but wakes up after about 37-39 min, then it takes about 30 min for him to go back down to sleep.  So we have been working on extending his naps.  He will not settle with patting/shhing in the crib when he wakes up in the middle of his nap.  We have been picking him up, he settles almost instantly, but as soon as we put him down he gets hysterical and will not calm down until we pick him back up again.  Being that this is only our first full day of this I am really quite impressed.

[nursekat]

Glad to hear you are making progress!  3 months was a very difficult time for us with naps, too.  I remember standing over her crib and crying while shh/patting!    I think you are doing an excellent job, keep watching his cues and coming back here if you need more help!

[hoosiermama]

I do!  How long do we work on extending his naps?  It usually takes about 30-40 min for us to get him back to sleep after he wakes initially.  How long will it take before we don't have to do it any more?  I know, it is only day 3!  When we finally do get him back to sleep, I have been letting him sleep even if it goes into his next feed.  Is that okay?

[nursekat]

I would try to not stretch his feed past 30mins, as Tracy recommends in her book.  When I finally found a way to extend dd's naps, it took about 2 weeks of doing it consistently before she really took to it, but I still had to extend each and every nap until 6months.  It just got easier to extend them after 2 weeks of doing the same thing.  You will find a lot of different ways people do this. 

[hoosiermama]

Thank you.  You have been incredibly helpful.  Should it take 30-40 min to extend the nap?  Today he has just needed the binkie.  DH says one thing at a time.  He is being really great and is working on it with me, so I am not doing it alone!  Thanks again!

[nursekat]

That is great that you are getting help and support from your DH!  Yes, it sometimes took that long for me as well.  Tracy recommends not going past 40mins, though.  What I found was it took a long time, and I sometimes would even just give in to AP in order for her to get her sleep, but after a couple of weeks of trying, she got the picture and it would take less than 5mins to help her transition.

Great job!!!  Keep up the excellent work! 

[hoosiermama]

Ahhhhhhh!! Last night was terrible.  I am besides myself.  Here is how it went:
Down for the night (after nursing, but did not fall asleep nursing) at 7:23
Up at 10:09 nursed down at 10:35
Up at 12:34 gave him his binkie
Up at 12:53, finally fell back asleep with patting shhing at 1:12
Up at 1:17-1:22 fell back asleep with patting shhing
Up at 2:21 binkie
Up at 2:54 hysterical (he was wet!  Changed diaper)
3:08 nursed because he would not calm down, put down at 3:29
Up at 3:36 binkie
Up at 3:58
Up at 4:53 and nursed again because he only nursed for a few min. at 3:08
down at 5:18
Up at 5:25
Up at 5:49
Up at 5:55
Got him up for the day at 6:45 nursed shortly.
Down for his nap at 7:40 slept until 8:20
SCREAMED AND THRASHED for 45 min while we were trying to extend his nap!
He is now in the swing because if he doesn't get some sleep soon we will just lose it!

[hoosiermama]

Last night was better.  Today was better, but still only napping for 40 min.  Extened one in the swing where he slept an hour and a half.  He goes down pretty easily, but I can't get over the 40 min.  Gonna keep trying though.

[nursekat]

I hate to say this, but it still sounds like a paci addiction to me. 

[hoosiermama]

Hello.  He is pretty much sleeping in the crib now.  I have tried to extend his activity time, but by one hour he is usually screaming.  This is how we have been putting him down for naps:
Take him in our room
Swaddle and turn the music on.
Bounce/patt/shh over the shoulder on the bed for about 3 min.
Give him his paci and put him in the crib.
Keep patting until he falls asleep.  (I usually try to pull the paci out before he is completely asleep)

At night we do the same thing, but usually I try to feed him one last time before bed.  Last night he broke out of his swaddle and played in bed in an for an hour.
No, we don't usually rush in to get him with every noise, we wait until he has worked himself up to a good cry.  He is waking every 3 hours, so I have been feeding him.
We are still unsuccessful at extending his naps and he gets really, really mad if we try to patt.shh. Gotta go, he's up again.

[hoosiermama]

I have been worried about the feeding thing.  I posted that problem on the breastfeeding boards.  He will only nurse shortly during the day.  I was doing the 21/2 hour easy up until a few weeks ago, and I have been working on stretching him to the 3 hour easy and that is when most of my issues started.  He used to have a 6 hour stretch at night, then a four hour, then a 3 hour and then up for the day.  I'm going crazy, I did a different swaddle today, but he gets so mad!  He is trying to suck his fists, but it is not doing much as far as self-soothing goes.  He falls asleep beautifully to go down for naps.  Mostly by himself.  I am trying to work on extending his naps in his crib, but so far I have been pretty unsuccessful.  Today is another day, we'll try again.

[hoosiermama]

I'll try that.  I think that the swaddle break out was a fluke.  He usually doesn't break out of his swaddleme one, I had tried something else.  We managed to extend his first nap this morning (it took 40 min, but he slept another 40).  How long should he be napping at a stretch?  Should we be extending it more than once?  After we extended that nap we got him to stay up for 1 1/2 hours.  He is down again now, so we will see how long he sleeps.  Thanks for all of your help!  Okay he just woke up after 30 min.  Forget it, nothing is working, I give up.