7mth old questions

[Colin Macs Mom]

It generally takes 3 to 14 days to change a sleep habit...is that correct? 

Yes, unless you are my DS and then it takes 2.5 months.    

If I was to offer her a small drink of half strength formula (e.g. 20mLs) would that slow the weaning process or just help make it a little more gentle?  I know that she will resettle faster after a small drink.

 

Sometimes a LO just needs a sip during the night - I know that I like a drink at night sometimes. Dry mouth and all, you know. So sure, try the watered down version. Every few days you can water it down a touch more. That version of weaning has worked well for a lot of folks around here, myself included.

[FionaS]

Ok so I have been continuing with the watered down formula and have got it down to 80mLs of water + 1/4 scoop formula (that is very very weak).  She will take about 1/2 of it (about 40mLs) then settle back down to sleep. 

Here are some examples of our nights:
1. One night she wakes at 3am, takes 30mLs watery formula, pat and shhh for a bit and she goes to sleep until 7am

2.  Another night she wakes at 5.30, give her the same as above, she sleeps until 7am

3.  Last night, she woke at 5.30, I gave her the watery formula but she just got very very mad.  I made it a bit stronger and she took some then went back to bed happily.  She talked, then grizzled, talked then cried etc until 6.45 at which point she fell asleep for 20mins and woke for the day at 7.15.  When she woke at 7.15 she was very happy and wasn't particularly interested in eating!  Since she was soooooo mad in the night + didn't settle back to sleep I assumed she was hungry but clearly she wasn't.

What would you recommend we do now...offer her water only?  Continue with weak formula?  Just us pu / pd?  She gets sooooo mad in the night and yet it doesn't seem like she is hungry....?

[Colin Macs Mom]

When she wakes, is she mad immediately?

[FionaS]

Not really.  She usually grumbles a bit then escalates. She gets mad as soon as we enter the room.  She often starts out talking, then grizzles, then cries.

[Colin Macs Mom]

Have you tried leaving her be then? If she gets mad when you go in I wonder if she just wants to be left alone?

[FionaS]

Yeap I always leave her until she is really crying.

Last night she slept through until 5.30am again.  She woke and started to cry loudly immediately.  She took the diluted formula, went back to bed happily but 10mins later started to grizzle / cry and kept it up until 6.50 at which point she dropped off for 20mins.  Do you think she is just getting used to going back to sleep without a full tummy and hence we just have to perservere OR does it indicate I still need to feed her more at 5.30?  It's a pain as anything she takes then interferes with her 7am feed.

[Colin Macs Mom]

I think you should just keep going as you are. She's learning to go back to sleep without the full tummy like you said.

[FionaS]

Well last night was worse than usual.  She woke at 3.20am which is much earlier than usual.  Tried leaving her but she was escalating so offered her the bottle (same dilution as the previous few nights).  She sucked then had a long pause, then sucked, long pause etc so I figured she wasn't hungry.  She's been really grumpy through the day (again - she always was unsettled) so I thought perhaps she is teething so gave her some bonjela.  She went back to bed fine and talked for a while then started to cry again.  She then went to sleep but woke every 20 to 40mins for the rest of the night and by 5.40 wouldn't go back to sleep.  I did reoffer the bottle at 6.40 but again she just sucked and paused rather than feeding heartily.  At 6.30 she was still crying and we were exhausted so I gave her some paracetamol and one side of her morning breastfeed. I put her back to bed assuming she'd be tired as she'd essentially been awake since 3.30am.  She seemed happy and went to bed and talked but was crying again by 7 so I got her up to start the day.  As soon as I got her up she was smiling and happy but not hungry as she'd had half her feed at 6.30

1. As she only sucked / paused at the 3.30am feed, do you think I was correct in assuming she was not hungry?
2. I presume it was either hunger or pain waking her every sleep cycle after 3.30am???
3.  I presume feeding her at 6.30 and putting her back to bed was a bad thing to do?
4.  We can see and feel her two bottom teeth + 2 top teeth + can feel the bottom eye teeth.  The two middle bottom teeth have been visable for 2 months.  They are still flush with the gums though.  Could it be teething?  The only other symptoms are grizzliness and ear pulling (her ears are fine).
5.  She seems to keep waking between 5am and 6am and won't go back to sleep unless she has a full tummy.  I take it this phase will pass if we are consistent in only giving her a small drink of watery formula?  We are tired as we haven't had any sleep after about 5.30am for 3 out of the past 4 nights.

Thanks for your continued advice

[Colin Macs Mom]

Hi Fiona,

1. I would have thought she wasn't hungry as well, just wanting some comfort.

2. Most likely!

3. Not necessarily. It sounds like she was hungry.

4. She's teething for sure!!    I'm sorry, it's tough. If it makes you feel any better Colin's teething two molars and two incisors right now and it's TERRIBLE. All you can really do until they come through is treat it with whatever works best for her - for Colin it's Motrin.

5. Yes, but the consistency is very important as it's a weaning process.

[FionaS]

Thanks Jessica - you are being a wonderful support!  I really appreciate the time you're taking to answer my questions and help us through the process.

[Colin Macs Mom]

No need to thank me, that's what we're all about here   

[FionaS]

Hi Again. Just wanting some guidance on how to proceed with the night weaning process. 

It seems like we've had a 3 day cycle recently - night 1, she sleeps through (well, wakes a few times but resettles herself with no feed), night 2 she wakes around 5 and resettles well after the watered down drink, night 3 she wakes closer to 4, takes the drink but then doesn't resettle.  If she does resettle it's only for 20mins and then she is crying again.

We are now down to 1/4 strength formula and she is taking about 60mLs of it.

I'm guessing that on the nights when she doesn't resettle properly she is actually hungry...does that mean I should keep doing night feeds or is it ok to continue weaning?  I'm going to focus on increasing her solids.  She already takes 4 good breastfeeds during the day but is only just on 2 meals of solids per day (she is 7.5 months old).

We've been gradually watering down the bottle for almost 2 weeks.  Is is about time to go to 100% water now?  If not, how do you recommend we proceed?

Many thanks

[Colin Macs Mom]

Is there any connection to how much she's eating during the day? Meaning, does her daytime intake vary on a 3-day routine like that as well? If not, I would continue on as you are. It could just be that the weaning process will be slower with her and that's perfectly fine. But if the same thing is happening in another week or two, I would go to 100% water then.

It may also help to introduce a 3rd solid meal.

[FionaS]

She didn't seem to eat as much though the day yesterday actually.  I'll try to encourage her to eat more today and hope for a better night tonight.

[FionaS]

This gentle night weaning doesn't seem to be working.  Last night our lo was woken at 3am thanks to our yowling cat.  She wouldn't resettle without a feed.  We offered 60mLs of half strength formula (a little stronger than usual) and she drained it quickly. She did go back to sleep but woke again at 5am, then resettled for 15mins and was awake and crying by 5.20am.  She refused water, and got very mad with patting etc.  In the end I fed her at 6.20am.  She took a huge feed but wouldn't go back to sleep so we had to start the day.  This has happened quite a lot recently which is throwing our daytime feeds & routine.

It seems that she still associates any night wakings with food.  If she cries and requires assistance she will NEVER settle without a feed.  I also seems she is getting hungry around 5am and hence not returning to sleep without a full feed.  That means on occasion she wants 2 feeds.

She is 7.5 months old.  Should we go to 100% water and get her used to settling with pu/pd, patting etc or should we go back to feeding and try the weaning process again when she is 9 months old?

I keep asking that question as we are desperate to night wean BUT we don't want to push our lo too hard if she isn't ready.

We definately need your guidance today as has we have no idea of how to proceed.