How do you know they wake up because they're hungry??

[SwedishinUS]

I don't know if I'm in the right place but this is in a way regarding night wakings so I hope I found the right place!! 

I am on my third night of PU/PD and the initial falling a sleep works wonderfully al ready. She falls asleep, full, with a dry diaper in no more than 10 minutes and with very little complaining.

We are working on her sleep because she has been sleeping with us and been eating through-out the night for a few months. Obviously she still wakes up at night, and I feel it is out of hunger, (she wakes up maybe every two hours or so. An improvement from every 30-60 minutes), but I don't know. It feels kind of useless to do the whole PU/PD if she is hungry, but I really don't know how to gauge that.

So how do I work this out? I don't want to breast-feed her every time she wakes up, but that is sort of what is happening and that totally defeats the purpose of this whole idea. Can they fall a sleep again even though they are hungry??

Here is the info you wanted, thanks for any help, it is greatly appreciated.

How old is your child? 7 1/2 mths
What’s his/her daily routine? 4 hour EASY starts between 6:30-7:30am and ends around 7:30pm
What’s nap routine? 2 naps, of at least 1,5 hrs each, usually 2,5 hrs after she has woken up
How long are naps? 1,5 hrs
What's bedtime routine? Time? Cereal, breastfeed, bath, clean diaper, pj's and a few books. starts 30 minutes before bedtime.
Do you bottle or breastfed?? breastfeed
How much? or how long? as long as she wants, sometimes just a minute, other times up to 10, (used to eat for loong periods of time during the night)
If breastfed.. one side or both?? (at each feed) Usually just one side
How many wakes per night? 4 maybe??
What’s your LO like when waking at night? How long is he/she up? A tired cry, smacking lips, eating hands, if I BF, I do that for 10 minutes max, and then put her down. She complains for 10-15 minutes and falls a sleep. If I don't feed, it could go on for an hour and an half before I finally feed her, after which she falls a sleep on her own in no time. (I am even able to leave her on her own)
When you go to him/her is she fussing or crying? Or is it a mantra cry? I don't know, but I think it is a real cry, there are tears.
What have you tried to settle?? PU/PD, shssssing, a firm hand on her chest, background music.
What do you do for A time and how long is it? Play on the floor with her toys. Sometimes by herself, sometimes with us. An hour at a time or so.
Are there developmental issues such as teething or milestones? She is learning how to crawl right now.
Have you introduced cereal? Why, how much, and how many times a day? (for LO’s under 6 months) N/A
Do they have a prop? If so what is it? It used to be my boob, now I don't think there is anything. She doesn't take the pacifier, or the bottle.
Do they have a lovie? Nope

[Colin Macs Mom]

Sounds to me like she got used to doing her eating at nighttime rather than during the day. She probably is hungry at night now because that's when she thinks she should eat. During the daytime feeds, how long does she eat? Is she snacking, or taking a full feed?

The best way to turn things around and get her to eat during the day is to wean the night feeds. Since you're breastfeeding you can offer less minutes every few days until you're down to zero. You should see an increase in the daytime intake during the process.

[SwedishinUS]

Yes, she has definitely gotten used to eating during the night, and I am planning to wean the night feedings, I just don't know if I should feed her every time she wakes up now, or try to make her fall a sleep again.

She eats a full portion of cereal with some pureed fruit morning and night and then she eats maybe a small jar of baby food plus more fruit split during the other two feedings. She breast feeds through out the day, anything between 3-6 times. I have not really figured out how to work the breast feeding in with the solids. I don't want to do it at the same time, since I think she might realize that she will get the breast after food, and not eat so much, but then if she gets the breast too often during the day she isn't hungry enough to eat food!! It is tricky!!!

I have noticed that she has been eating more during the day these few days that se hasn't been able to sleep with me and eat as much as she wants, so that is at least good I think.

[Colin Macs Mom]

It really is tricky! And believe me you're not the first mom to find herself with LO who has shifted eating to night rather than day.

Personally, what I would do in your situation is offer a shortened feed at each time that you would normally feed. Every three days knock another minute or maybe two off the time. This is gentler than just changing things cold turkey and will probably be easier on both of you.

[SwedishinUS]

That sounds like a good plan. I had thought I was going to wait until Wednesday to see if there were any particular patterns in her sleeping now, (by then we had been doing the PU/PD for a week), and then start weaning by cutting 2 minutes off every feeding time every other night, but it sounds like she is getting a cold, (she is very hoarse, and is not eating well), so I think we have to post-pone that plan for a while.

It is such bad timing, because I feel we were doing so well, but you can't really do anything about illness, so we just have to wait it out and hope for the best.

Thanks for you reply.

[Samuel's mum]

At 7.5 months you probably know that milk is where she'll be getting the majority of her nutrients and calories. It reaches about 50/50 by 12 months. So it's quite important you schedule the solid meals and breastfeed so she's still getting all the milk she needs. You don't really want her to fill up on solids which contain less calories and less easily digestible nutrients and then she takes less milk as a result.

At bedtime for example - by putting cereal first like that as part of a bedtime routine - she will probably be taking very little milk straight after and then you may also find your milk supply begins to decrease at that time. If solids are consistently prioritised your milk supply will begin to decrease overall.

At her age she needs 4 good breastfeeds (or more). A lot of bf folks do a breastfeed followed by solids about an hour later. Something like this:

7am bf
8am solids
11am bf
12pm solids
3.30/4pm bf
4.30/5 solids
7pm bedtime bf

It would be much better for her overall intake if she filled up more on milk than solids. When you talk of thinking she might hold out for the breast and take less solids it sounds as though you may not be aware how milk does actually take priority at this age.

I'm just mentioning this because if you feel she's hungry at night it might be a factor.
Around 9-10 months some mums swap round to put solids first but many don't. And breastfeeding mums especially often stay with milk first to make sure their supply doesn't decrease.

[SwedishinUS]

She is getting 4 or more good breastfeeds a day even without the one before she falls a sleep, and then she still eats two or three times during the night, so I am not so concerned about the amount of breast milk that she is getting.

My problem is that she still wakes up hungry, (she eats very intensely and fast, and shows no signs of nursing for comfort). So I have to fill her up with something don't I???

[SwedishinUS]

Thanks for the tip about feeding when she wakes up by the way. I have sort of been doing that, but will be more consistent with it.