Naps

[stridey]

Hi there, I am pretty new to these message boards but would love some advice from anyone.
My DD is now 13 weeks old. She has always been a great sleeper sleeping through from 7 weeks - when I say sleeping through I mean that she was having her DF at about 10:00pm - 10:30pm and sleeping through to 6:30am - 7:00am, I think this is good, have been told by others that I am lucky. Over the past week and abit she has been waking at 3:00am. 5:30am and 6:00am. Could this be to a change/milestone at 3months or am i giving her too much sleep during the day?
Cheers in advance
Kiwi from NZ

[debo620]

hard to tell, can you post your normal day with eating and naps, bedtime/wake etc?

[stridey]

Oops kind of important!!!!!
Forgot to mention. She is not really having a DF – which is a FF, now but we still give DD her last feed for the night as if it was a DF – in her room in the dark, no chat, burp, nappy change, off to bed – where she falls asleep. For the last 4 weeks DD’s DF has gone from 10:00pm – 8:30pm. The reason for this is b/cos we were going in to give DD her DF, at 10:00pm and she just wasn’t having a bar of it – she would have about 50-60mls if we were lucky (just less than 2oz). My DH and I assumed that her little body clock was changing and she was telling us that she didn’t want to be woken at that time anymore so we just decreased it by 30mins each week. She is now having her final feed, as mentioned at 8:30pm. DD has usually woken at 7:00am over the past 6 weeks. I think the reason for her ‘early morning rises’ and change in routine is that DD is getting too much sleep during the day.

Here is an outline of DD’s E.A.S.Y routine as it stood b4 ‘the change’

E: 7:00am – 7:30am BF (now waking at 3:30am (happended a few times) and 5:30am
A: 7:30 – 8:15/8:30 – bath time, play, nappy change
S: 8:15/8:30 – DD used to take about 20mins to settle down. Would self-sooth


E: 10:00am – 10:30am BF – sometimes leave for an extra 30mins if she has had a fussy morning or taken longer to get to sleep BUT I sometimes have to wake DD as I don’t want her to sleep too long into her next feed. I am guessing I should wake her??
A: 10:30 – 11:15/11:30 – play, nappy change
S: 11:15 - 11:30 – DD used to take about 20mins to settle down. Would self-sooth.

E: 1:00pm – 1:30pm BF
A: 1:30pm – 2:15/2:30pm – play, nappy change
S: 2:15/2:30pm

E: 4:00pm – 4:30pm BF
A: 4:30pm – 5:15/5:30pm – play, nappy change
S: 5:15/5:30pm

DF: 7:30pm – 8:00 - FF
I think this DF is where I am going wrong as it is too much sleep b4 DD’s main night sleep. I have tried to stretch it out and go from 4ish till 6ish and then a DF at8:00 – 8:30pm but she just seems to get grumpy. She is pretty good about showing us her ‘tired signs’ yawning, rubbing eyes, losing interest in activity. And when I catch these signs and pop her to bed she settles down, usually, within her 20mins and is off to ‘Dreamland’. So during the time that I tried to keep her awake between 4 -6ish but she has been showing her tired signs, at about 1:15 – 1:30hrs, and I don’t want and overtired DD!!!!!
I have been increasing her activity time by 15mins every few days and she generally lasts for 1:30mins but sometimes, when she has woken early shows me her ‘tired signs’ earlier and I pop her off to bed.

So there you have it. Hope the length has not put you off…..bit of a novel really but would totally love any advice. All in all I feel really happy about the way things are going. She is such a smiley wee girl and seems really happy and content so not too sure why this 'glitch'. Still happy, even with her change, maybe just me overstressing!!!!! Basically just want to get DD back on track, as b4.

Must away, as I have let DD sleep and extra 30mins, due to her 'early morning', and don’t want her to sleep too much into her next feed.

Cheers and thank you so very much in advance.
Kiwi from NZ

[debo620]

well I think your day looks pretty good! from the most part the naps look to be about 1.5hrs which is great. Are you starting her night sleep at 5:30pm then?

the last sleep at 5pm should be limited to 40min (a catnap) and then she has awake time, last BF at 7pm ish, quick windown, bed and asleep for the night by 7:30pm.
If you do not do a DF at 10:00/10:30 then probably I would expect at least 1 night feed sometime after 2am

sorry if this isn't helpful, I may have misread your routine... let me know

[stridey]

Hi yah, thanks heaps for the quick reply. Yes, you are right that last nap, b4 the DF starts at around 5:30pm. Far out DD must be thinking.....what are you expecting me to do, sleep for eva. I totally forgot about the whole ‘catnap’ thing. Our DD didn’t really used to sleep very well between 3pm – 7pm so when she started to do this I think I was so excited I thought we would get an hour or so in!!!!!
I have been having abit of a think. See below for a revised version. What do you reckon?

E: 6 - 6:30 (used to be 7:00am but this works out better for DH to do bath time so don’t mind)
A: 6:30 - 7:30
S: 7:30 - 9

E: 9:00 - 9:30
A: 9:30 – 10:30
S: 10:30 – 12:00

E: 12:00 – 12:30
A: 12:30 – 1:30
S: 1:30 – 3:00

E: 3:00 – 3:30
A: 3:30 – 4:15
S: 4:15 – 5:30

E: 5:30 – 6:00
A: 6:00 – 7:00ish

DF: 8:30/9:00

Cheers
Kiwi from NZ

[debo620]

well aagain, the last nap looks a tad bit long. maybe you meant 4:45-5:30, really 3x1.5hrs and a 40min catnap is great. also I think yuo do really want to set your night up from 7-7 (so asleep by about 7:30 and wake around 7ish).

If it were me I would stick with the 7am start while you have it. many things along the way will make it earlier such as routine adjustments, time changes etc.  like we struggled to have a 6am start with my eary riser and when the time fell back (I don't know if this a problem in NZ)then it was 5am until we got it back to 6am.
some do the bath in the evening before bed as it helps there lo relax.

[stridey]

Hi yah, yep totally agree about the nap – yes it was meant to be the time you stated - still trying to work it all out. Would prefer the day to start at 7:00am. Thought it would be O.K. with 6:00am but as DD usually awoke at 6:50am and she chatted to herself in her crib till 7ish it is now 5:50am and that is abit much!!!!! Went to do the 'catnap' of 40 mins in the afternoon yesterday but we had had visitors and she had gotten abit overtired but will definitely do that from now on as it makes sense and will keep the DF later.
Due to a medical reason (epilepsy) it is not wise for me to bath her, as I may have a seizure, so with her change of times in the evening DH was not always home, as he goes to work later in the am to be able to bath, and have time with her. So will probably leave it in the morning but 7:00am would definitely be better.

Thanks so very much for your suggestions; all of them wonderful and I will put them into action.

Have a great day
Kiwi from NZ

[stridey]

Hi ya, Kiwi from NZ again. Just another question. Have started the 'catnap' and while it is very, very early days I think it will go well as DD has a good routine the rest of the day and I think she will settle into this really well.....fingers crossed.

DD went down at 4:50pm and settled herself at 5:00pm, she was then quiet till 5:10pm (didn't see if she was asleep as didn't want to risk waking her so just assumed she was asleep). DD then peeped at 5:10pm and took 25 mins to settle again.....bit of crying but mostly what I call the waa waas.....self-soothing (she sucks her thumb for this and chatting). She finally fell asleep, properly, at about 5:40pm. I woke her at 6:20pm.

Anyway, my question, in a really long roundabout way!!!!! is this. Do I take her 40 min 'catnap' from the time she actually settled for a deep 40min nap, as I did tonight, or do I take it from the 4:50pm start?

Cheers and thanks in advance again.
Kiwi from NZ

[debo620]

hmmn,
I think I would go with whatver doen't effect your bedtime, like maybe 6:20pm is a bit late. Thats great she is such a great self soother. In that situation I probably would have settled with a 30min nap, since she has had quite a bit of quiet time in her crib in the mean time.

[stridey]

Hi, yipee, we got a 6:50am wake up call instead of 5:50am, we left her to chat till 7am and then got her up for her first feed of the day. In terms of last night we got DD up at 6:20pm, as mentioned, and then DD went down at 7:30pm where she a wee chat to herself, in her crib,for about 10 mins and was off to sleep and we did the DF at 9:00pm. I think we confused DD changing the times on her and she seems much more settled at nightime so will go with your suggestions.

Thanks once again for the advice.

Cheers
Kiwi from NZ

[stridey]

Hi there again, not too sure if you will read this as I don't know how long these threads stay on the site. Everything is going really well with the 7am morning and the rest of her feeds and sleeps, and DF, throughout the day/night – right back on track. Just ANOTHER question . DD sometimes finds it hard to settle after she has woken from her last E and A in that mid/late afternoon period. As mentioned we usually leave DD for her 20min settling down time, by which time she is usually in 'Dreamland' but if she does not go to sleep and becomes unsettled, crying etc shall I get DD up and feed then have a short A time and then back to bed? Just don't want to put her down too early to avoid the old waking time of 5:00am and am abit worried that if I keep her up too long she might go into ‘meltdown’ and become overtired?
Usual routine at that time of the day

E: 4:00 – 4:30 BF
A: 4:30 – 5:30
S: 5:30 – 6:15
E: 6:15 – 6:35 FF
A: 6:35 – 7:30 includes wind-down

Or shall I get DD up at 6:15ish and do the A first and then the E at 7:00pm and then a little wind-down, nappy change and off to bed? Still abit confused on that one? Sorry, I know you have already gone over this, apologies.

Also, I don’t have the BWSAYP, am in the process of purchasing it, and was wondering if that has about the transition from 3 hr E.A.S.Y. to 3.5hr then 4hr and when I should be starting this. Have read about it abit on this website but want to make sure that I get it right from the beginning

Thanks again
Kiwi from NZ

[debo620]

hi, glad to hear everything is going well. yes many people do reverse the E and A at the end of the day,

so I would:
nap 5:30-6:15
activity
feed 7
windown
bed 7:30
 the BWSAYP book is very useful, it is the only book I have.  I does have a section on transitioning from 3-4hr  EASY although many find it a bit confusing, this switch is done right around 16 weeks, and yes some go to a 3.5 hr EASY. The main thing is that your lo has to be able to handle a little longer activity time to make it work.