Please help with night wakings :)

[northof54]

How old is your child? 4 month tomorrow 17lbs 5oz last week

What’s his/her daily routine?
Wake 6:00am (working on this )
E - 7:00am (4oz)
A -
S - 8:30am
E - 10:00am (4oz + 1 tblspn cereal)
A -
S - 11:30am
E - 1:00pm (4oz)
A -
S - 2:30pm
E - 4:00pm (4oz)
A -
S - 5:00 - 6:00
E - 2 tbls cereal
A -
E - 7:00 (4oz)
S - 7:30pm
XXXXXXXXXXXXXX -- sounds good so far eh ? LOL
10:30pm wakes and I give the last feed (4oz)
1:30am wakes and I try shhh / pat -- won't hear of it (4oz)
3:30am wakes and I try shhh / pat -- gets VERY upset I do a PU/PD -- back to sleep
5:30am (same as above)
6:00 wakes back up

What’s nap routine?
How long are naps? 1.5 / 1.5 / 1.5 / 1 hour
What's bedtime routine?
A - Bath / Bottle / Bed
Time? 7:30pm

Do you bottle or breastfed?
0-3 months - breast
3 months - straight to bottle
3-4 months - EBM - formula

How much? or how long?
4oz each time

How many wakes per night?
Every 2 hours

What’s your LO like when waking at night?
How long is he/she up?
Starts crying -- until hysterical -- until I pick him up - won't accept the shh / pat

When you go to him/her is she fussing or crying? Or is it a mantra cry?
Not sure of the mantra cry -- but is crying and HARD

What have you tried to settle??
shh / pat
end up picking up - he finds his thumb / goes back to sleep

What do you do for A time and how long is it?
Minimal A activities / I have a 2 year old / so on with the day!  Mainly sits in bumbo / lays on ground / plays under matt / goes for errands in carseat


Are there developmental issues such as teething or milestones?
he rolls over


Have you introduced cereal? Why, how much, and how many times a day? (for LO’s under 6 months)
2x daily - 1 tblspn morning / 2 tblspn evening

Do they have a prop? If so what is it?
Thumb

Do they have a lovie?
Not too sure?

[momofclaire]

Hi North,
I am sorry to hear you aren't getting much sleep.  I can imagine that with a little one and a toddler you are pretty busy. I have a couple questions.
Your routine looks pretty good, but it seems you are on a 3 hour easy. I think he might be ready to move to a four or at least a 3.5.  Have you tried extending his a time?
Have you tried feeding when he wakes at 6:00 and starting your day then?
Is there a reason you started solids so early?  Have you noticed a connection between bad night sleep and the solids?  Many babies can't really handle solids at 6 months, 4 is really early. 

Post back and we will try to get you all sleeping as soon as possible.

Welcome!
Myia

[Danielle K]

Hang in there North!
My LO could not digest solids well until well into his 6mnth.  I did try them earlier and he would struggle with a gassy tummy and it did cause him a restless sleep.    Even though he would eat the solids he really wasn't ready yet.  He is 7.5 mnths now and digests them really well - so it just took a bit of time.  Not sure if this will help but just wanted to share my experience with you.
I hope it all works out - I am certain you will get the help you need here - they helped me and my LO with night wakings too!

Danielle

[northof54]

Hi girls and THANK YOU very much for the replies !

He is doing 100% BETTER on the solids.... he is almost 18 lbs and had very BAD reflux.  It was recommended that we start (I normally wouldn't have until 6 months -- I did 5 with DS#1)..... BUT was struggling with colic / gas etc.  Now he's a DREAM! 

He is a "touchy" baby.... and doing SOOO much better on the routine

I think he can do a 4 hour -- BUT he really likes his naps and I'm not too sure how he can stay awake for 2 hours.  However, he definitely can go 4 hours between feeds.... so I'm not too sure how to do one without the other ? KWIM?

At 6:00am he just is NOT hungry.... really he isn't at 7:00am either -- but I want to stay on the routine so I coax and plead   -- I should have clarified that sometimes he only takes 2-3 oz at this morning feed to ?  -- again telling me he really doesn't need it -- and that that 8 hour stretch would be beneficial to all between 11 - 7am LOL -- if only he understood that !

But I still am struggling with the night wakings??

Thanks in advance for the tips

[northof54]

oh I wanted to add that the only connection I noticed with the night wakings is we got out of routine one day -- went to the beach..... completely out of routine -- he ate at 4 hour instead of 3 / napped in the stroller etc.... and since this time it seems to have gotten "out of control"

Also -- we put his crib in another room...... the night wakings had started a day before this.... but DH wasn't getting any sleep -- so we moved his crib into his own room and they have continued .

[momofclaire]

I would try to extend his A time by 5-10 minutes each day until you get to a 4 hour routine. Go slowly and watch his cues because you don't want him to be overtired.  I would cut that last nap down a bit, to 30 min.

[northof54]

oh another thing -- he used to LOVE being swaddled but now kicks his way out.... also will NOT sleep on his back.... much prefers his belly (I think the gas issues)....

[northof54]

I will start by trying to get him on a 4 hour EASY... just curious how this will stop his "habit" of night waking?? I'll try anything LOL

[momofclaire]

The night waking could be caused by too much day sleep or not enough A time. He could be waking to play. Often a routine tweak can do wonders for night wakings.

[northof54]

Thumbs Up!

I'll try the 4 hour EASY!  And cut the last nap down to 1/2 hour

[momofclaire]

Keep me posted. 

Moving the crib into another room may also have thrown him a bit. Sometimes it takes a while to adjust.  When our routine gets all messed up I know we will have early wakes or night wakes, I think that is why I lovingly refer to myself as the nap nazi.

[northof54]

Hi momofclaire -- and thank you again for your help

Okay -- last night went a little bit better

He drank 4oz at 7:30pm
3oz dreamfeed at 10:30pm
5oz at 2:00am

Awake at 6:15am
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
now here's where I tried the 4 hour and am running problems the biggest that he likes the napping schedule of 3 hour EASY.

6:30am -- feed eats 4oz
7:15am -- I get the other 2oz into him

8:00am -- I cannot get him to stay awake anymore - sleep

9:50am -- wakes up

10:30am -- 4oz
11:15am -- I get another oz into him -- possibly could have gotten 2 but my two year old is a real distraction for him and came into the room.

11:45am -- back to sleep
1:15pm -- wakes up

1:30pm -- actually gets fussy and wants the bottle (this rarely happens)
it's a little early but he's hungry so I give it to him -- he drinks 4oz

by 2:00pm he already exhausted.....
2:10pm -- 1oz

2:15pm -- napping again.

Hum..... some things I've noticed.... he spit up today.  This could be because I'm pushing more oz?  Also -- I skipped the morning cereal in an attempt to encourage more oz from the bottle -- I'm not too sure what I should do here

Also -- being out of the routine sucks LOL

[momofclaire]

North,
To me, that looks like real progress.    One thing I notice is that he seems to nap better with more A time.  Would you agree?  I think you should try to not focus too much on the clock and instead focus more on his cues. 
You may find that a 3.5 easy is a good place for a few weeks in order to transition him gently to the four hour.  I would have fed him at 10:00 when he woke from the first nap.  I think that he wasn't able to handle much A time after his second nap because he was so tired from the extra A time.  I would limit A time to 1.5 hours or 1.75 if you think he can handle it.  I would also stop giving him the extra ounce 45 min after a feed because this could be teaching him to be a snacker.  I wouldn't be giving cereal at his age because they really need all the nutrition from the milk, if he gets that full feeling on cereal then he will naturally drink less and not get the nutrition he needs. 
I know what you mean about being out of routine.  I love routine and I think I struggle more when things are out of whack than dd does.

[northof54]

From the book and website I understand to try to increase his oz intake to wait the 20 mnutes after he's eaten and offer the rest of the bottle ?? 

I will try the 3.5 hr..... I don't think he's ready for the 4 hour yet.... he has started spitting up again -- I think I was pushing too much formula.

I will keep him on the cereal though because this really curbed the spit up (re: pediatrician)....

Thanks so much for the help!  I will try to focus on the cues  

We will get this right LOL

Last night he did awesome!  11:15pm dream feed and slept to 4:45am feed and up at 6:15am

[momofclaire]

Yes it is recommended to give an oz or two 20 min after feeding, I was recommending not doing that because of the spitting up. Pushing too much food can cause them to just spit up what they have drank. 
I think 3.5 easy will be great right now while you transition. 
I hope you see a repeat of last night tonight.