Sleep horror

[Florena49]

Thank you will persevere. What if his nap is 1.30 should i adjust BT or stick to 8.30 BT still?

[creations]

I would just stick to set nap and BT now. For on holiday do the 8.30 1.30 8.30 routine it looks like you have then back to the 7-7 routine when you are back home.
If you stick with the routine for now you might begin to see where his sleep needs have/are changing. For instance if you have to wake him up from every nap or if you have to wake him in the morning or if the NWs begin to look more like UT.
hth

[Florena49]

Thank you Creations, i know what you mean its the only way to figure out whats up.
Seems our night are identical though

Yesterday was this:

8.30wu
1.25nap-3.05
8.20BT

I stretched him as long as I could for BT a bit more difficult to settle, but he still slept until 2.45,
And then it was a nightmare as it is everynight. WUs

2.45,4.05,7.18 all three time difficult to resettle, took me 50 mins second time. He was up for the day at 7.18, but i left him to it, as he wasnt crying, so he fell asleep, u fortunately so did I and only up at 9.15 today!

Im just so pleased with te first long stretch of sleep because it is a huge improvement, from not sleepibg longer that 4 hours.

[creations]

So your day may be a little off due to the later WU.  I'd stick to the nap and BTs regardless. If he's resistant to the nap try again 15 min later but don't let him sleep past 3.30 (ie what would have been 2 hrs but if he resists the nap and sleeps late you still get him up).

So - two nights of 5-6 hr stretches seems quite good considering his usual 4hr stretch. Must admit I'm at a bit of a loss as to why he is always waking in the early hours and can only think that he is just in a lighter sleep and actually needs to be in his own bed so he isn't disturbed by your sleep cycle transitions when he is in his lighter sleep. The early hours are always harder to sleep through so it may not be taking much to disturb him yk? Hard to say without actually trying him in his own room.

[Florena49]

Settled at 1.30 with my mum no problem, slept for 1.30mins too. Was alittle too tired for BT, but settled at 8.35 and asleep for now anyway, heres hoping he can repeat his long stretch again. He has been poorly and still has a snotty nose, so i was qondering that it might be disturbing him in the early hours as he is having difficulty breathing. I guess will find out when the cold fully goes.

[creations]

Hope you have a good night. Try to get some rest yourself too during that long stretch of sleep x

[Florena49]

It is the day tomorrow, Oskars room is ready and he will be having his nap in his cot in his room tomorrow hopefully. We will play in his roo in the morning, sort out his book etc, so he gets used to spending time there.
We are sticking to

7wu
12nap
7BT

He is t sleeping as well as he has been at my mums and dads though, not sure why, but we have lost the 6-7 hour stretch, but at least we got rid of the snotty nose and a cough, so i know there is nothing bothering him.
Im about ti snuggle with him in bed, hopefully he will ne sleeping in his cot tomorrow night.

[creations]

Good luck!

[Florena49]

We are still alive, i mean this is tough going. It turned that we dont have a problem with getting him to sleep in his cot at all, we have an issue with feeding at night, which i didn't see as an issue at all,  as so e nights he would settle without any feeds at all and other nights he would have 1 feed. I reckon we slept on and off for About 4 hours the first night. The boy has stamina! We only lasted until 1 and then he came in with us but that made no difference at all as what he wanted was milky not to be in bed with us. So we decide that we cant win it all straight away, we cant have him going to bed in his new room in his cot, stay there all night and not have any feeds. So we are going with no milky, going to bed in his cot and if he ends up in our bed with dad! Then thays how it is. Having me in bed isnt working at a at the moment, as milk hasn't gone yet and obviously i still smell of milky, so he settles much better with dad. Slept better last night, less crying overall, more sleep, hopefully better by the weekend. We are a family of zombies at the moment and both have busy weeks at work this week.

[creations]

Oh dear, I can well imagine how tired everyone is. Sorry that you all have to work on top of having bad nights

So, the plan now is no milk but he can still come into your bed with Daddy.  I can understand how this has come about because everyone is so exhausted, but (how to break it gently) being unable to self settle in the night without relying on some sort of prop (whether milk or co-sleeping) could be more the issue than needing milk. I doubt any LOs over 1yo are waking from hunger so I'd say it's prop dependency. The thing is, he may well be able to settle down to sleep bringing him to bed with Daddy but he isn't learning to self settle in the night which I imagine is going to remain an issue until it's tackled. Sorry, I don't like to be the bearer of tricky news but in your position I think I'd rather know than not know - yk?
If bringing him in to co-sleep is what you are all happy with for now then continue.
I suppose the thing to decide is if you prefer a few nights of awful sleep whilst you teach him to stay in his own bed and self settle or if you prefer longer term disturbed-but-not-quite-so-disturbed sleep when he wakes and needs to be brought in to co-sleep.
It's totally your choice as a family.

[Florena49]

I hear what you are saying and ideally yes we would want him to stay in his cot all night, if we had a week of being at home this is exactly what we would do, be it that it would be tough on us.
He wont settle with me in bed at all, i have to leave, as soon as he sees me, he goes for milky and he gest very upset he settles much better with daddy.
He has slept in his room in the cot sonce he was 4 months, but he has never been a good sleeper, but the skills of settling at night are there somewhere as he has done it before.
I guess i dont even know if cosleeping is a prop, he doesnt settle that easily in bed and the first night he has spent most of the night crying with stints of sleep in between. Webare also trying to stick to some sort of routine during tje day but its not easy really and he is off to childminders tomorrow so by the end of the day I will have an exhausted child. Zombieland is signing off now, we are literally heading to bed
We are so tired we dont een have a plan

[creations]

Oh I'm so sorry for you 

Maybe it is not the co-sleeping which is the prop, but rather it is needing the comfort of Mummy (milk because that's how he finds the most comfort with you) or Daddy (clearly not milk because he finds comfort from Daddy in a different way), due to an inability to self settle when he wakes in the night. I can understand this, my DS has never been able to sleep in my bed, we never co-slept, he wouldn't AP in arms after about 10wks (nightmare!) and during times of needing extra comfort it has been a real struggle, he wants and needs to be in his own bed to sleep and to sleep well but he wants the reassurance of being with me, but me being in his room stops him sleeping and him being in with me stops us both sleeping...basically no answer.

When you have some energy do you want to post your current routine?

At these times I think you can only do what you can do, one day at a time and rest whenever possible. hugs x

[Florena49]

Hi Creations

As ever thank you, i absolutely agree with you that it would be great to do all at ones, but with out work and my husbands work and university, we simply need some sleep.
Last night was better, he was a little OT, i think the last couple of nights are catching uo with him, so he woke a few times within the first couple of hours, settled in his cot no problem, then i could hear him cry out and settle himself, about 10.30 i was chucked out of bed and dad took Oskar in, he settled very quickly, unlike the other nights and slept until nearly 3, so we decided to see whether he would settle with me, he wanted to, but i think habitually he was reaching for milky, but there was no hysterical crying last night, he was a little upset, but settled within 20 mins and we woke at 7 this morning.

Generally i stick to

7wu
12nap-1.30
7BT

Today he woke at 6.55, i dobt adjust his nap time in these cases i still go for 12 nap
He has been having 1.30-1.40 min nap, so not 2 hours, but i still do 7BT.
We are still zombi like but at least managed to get some sleep each and Os seems to be brighter today.

We would like him to sleep in his cot and would like to do it soon, necause the baby is due in July and my bump is growing and i can only stand over the cot for so long.

[creations]

Good to hear you all got a bit of sleep at least.

Routine wise it looks good, I mean there is nothing glaring, but then there wasn't before either was there... just this problem of never sleeping more than 4hrs.
The only thing I wonder is if he is now taking less than the 2hr nap perhaps moving his nap just a touch later may help, 10 or 15 mins, so that his A time to BT is not getting too long. Still set nap and BT but just set at a slightly later nap, then BT stays the same.
What do you think?

[Florena49]

Honestly happy to try anything really

So would we do

7wu
12.15nap
7BT

I mean today and to orrow are out because it just isnt working recently at the childminders. But come thursday he is at home with me and we start all over again trying to reestablish the routine. I hoping the settling in the night will get better by friday and we can try ad keep him in his cot over the weekend.