13 months night wakings/night weaning

[mommykay410]

Buntybear - I was hoping you'd say something other than oat milk so I would have another option to try haha.  The oat milk made him poop literally 20x a day, all day and all night.  He had such horrible diaper rash, and every bm was liquid or mucous, never anything solid.  Maybe I was just giving him too much of it during the day, and could possibly try just once a day?  He wasn't drinking more than like 12 ounces of it total.  We got the Pacific brand. 

creations - The ped said that they never recommend goat milk because it's not regulated I think?  Or not fortified?  I don't exactly remember, but she was very clear that they never recommend it.  But the allergist, and my own general research, said that the proteins they are allergic to in the cow's milk are similar proteins in goat and sheep milk so they would likely have the same reaction.  My husband still thinks we should try it, but I'm leary of him having a reaction and then having to explain to the doctors why we did it when we were told not to.  The doctors obviously don't recommend raw (unpasteurized) cow milk either, but that's what we drink anyways. 

For rapid night wean, I would have to pick whenever he wakes earlier in the night.  Most nights he only wakes twice, the first is not usually at the same time, but that one would be easier to settle using other methods I think since he would still have the majority of the night's sleep ahead of him.  Whereas if I pick the 5am one, although it's a more consistent time, I'd be afraid of him waking for the day too early and of waking DD for the day with his screaming.  So for the gentle wean, I would gradually decrease the minutes each day, pull him off and rock/pat him, then once I'm down to, say, 1 minute then the next night I would try to stop it altogether?  Should I wait til I've been giving him the two daytime feeds for a few days, or start the day feeds and weaning process at the same time?

[creations]

I'd probably start the day BFs and the night wean at the same time.
Usually at 13 months I would have said from the off that LO didn't need night feeds for hunger...it's only that in your case there was no day milk on top of the solids so as soon as the milk is there in the day I don't see a need to delay the night weaning.

[*Ali*]

Hi, I'm certainly no expert but the experts advise that all babies are breastfed on demand, day and night, for 2yrs or more. This is especially beneficial for babies with cmpa so continuing to breastfeed is optimal if you are happy to do so.  If not then there are certain milks that are recommended above others. This website gives more info https://gpifn.org.uk/cmpa/

In terms of you getting more sleep whilst feeding at night, have you considered lying facing each other on your side while you feed him, especially for that last feed rather than sitting in a rocking chair? It would probably be more restful for you both.

How are your baby's symptoms now? Could be he also needs comfort at night, especially if he's experiencing discomfort from itchy eczema for example.

[mommykay410]

I would be happy to continue nursing if I could go back to eating my normal diet, but I'm a picky eater to begin with, so not being able to eat dairy has really limited my food options, and many of the replacements are not the healthiest options.  So I'm sure my milk isn't optimal for him right now either in terms of nutrients. 

If I were to feed him lying down I'd have to lay with him on the air mattress on the floor in his room, and whenever I try to lay with him on there he just thinks it's playtime and crawls right off the mattress.  He would be especially inclined to do this at the 5am time since a bit of light starts sneaking past his curtains. 

In terms of symptoms, his eczema and itching are pretty well under control right now.  I'm not convinced that the elimination of dairy is what helped that since he does still get patches.  I attribute it more to the prescription cream and oatmeal bath/moisturizing routine.  His teeth bother him sometimes of course, but those are generally the nights when he cries for a long time and nothing I do helps, nursing included. 

I will see how it goes with adding in the daytime feeds and gradually weaning at the first waking.  I tried to give him the oat milk again the past two days since we found a new brand at the market, but he wasn't a fan, so I'm going to keep trying that too in hopes that it will be a suitable substitute.

[creations]

You could try fully blacking out the room, some babies will wake up with even a small chink of light coming in and end up starting the day way too early.
Mine needs full black out, I tried to reduce the amount of black out in his room thinking he'd get used to it but he still needs it at 7yo.  Once he was old enough to explain things properly to me he was able to tell me that the light in his room was waking him and that he was still tired.  We now have 3 layers on his window which helps.

[*Ali*]

Please rest assured that the nutrients in your milk are not affected by your own diet so it's always going to be the most nutritious milk you can offer him.

Are you under a nutritionist? They should be able to advise you on suitable replacements for dairy. Or maybe look into joining a breastfeeding with cmpa support group.

[mommykay410]

Yes, I have been meaning to put up extra pieces of blackout fabric to cover up the little rays that sneak through, I just keep forgetting, or think of it when he's sleeping. 

I looked back at DD's schedule at this age and she was sleeping through from 8-~6:30/45 each night and taking between 1-1.5 hr nap each day.  I'm sure I was wanting her to nap longer, but at least she wasn't getting up at night.  Could I be expecting too much for him to sleep so long at night if he is falling asleep around 7 and wanting him to sleep til 6:30 straight through?  He is still taking the shorter naps, but at least I'm reassured by the reminder that she was doing the same thing at this age and it will get better. 

I have been trying to gradually shorter the first feed in the middle of the night, which has been coming anywhere from 10:40 to 1:30.  He has been ok with me removing him, changing his diaper, and then laying him back down.  Then he gets up again somewhere between 3:40-4:45 and I nurse him again but haven't purposely shortened that one.  But then he is up again around 5:30, sometimes crying, sometimes talking to himself.  I don't want that to be when he is awake for the day though so I go in and nurse him back to sleep til he wakes ~6:15. 

I'm tempted to put some water in a bottle and see if he will take that instead of nursing.  I've tried to offer his sippy but he won't take that in place of nursing, but if he is able to lay back with the bottle maybe he would be more agreeable?  I also tried offering a pacifier, but he didn't want anything to do with that.  I did try to hold off on nursing him for a few minutes when I got him at the first waking the other night but he then started sucking on my shoulder. 

Ali - No, I am not seeing a nutritionist.  I am in a group on Facebook though for dairy-free breastfeeding.  I have started offering him the oat milk again now that we found a different brand that doesn't have any of the fillers that the one we gave previously does, so I'm hoping that he will be able to handle that better and not have the poop issues he had before.  He seems to like it so that's a plus. 

[matilds]

Oh my goodness, I could have written this exact post!
I have a 12mo who is allergic to dairy and has never slept for more than 2 hours at a time (hence why I’m on here looking)! She normally goes back to sleep fairly quickly after bf. But such broken sleep is killing me now I’m back at work and not doing much for my relationship as we’re both shattered!
We actually saw a dietician today actually, she wants us to try soya for a week (milk in food and yogurts etc). Then in a weeks time we will start the milk ladder to see if she can tolerate any dairy now.
The proteins in soya and goats milk are very similar, hence why these can be an issue. However, my son was allergic to dairy also and started having it again at 1.5. However I kept him on goats milk until he was about 3 as it’s supposedly easier to digest.
We too have massive amount of gas issues so we’re goinf to try probiotics again (good result when younger).
Will be writing my own post shortly, so you may want to see if anyone suggests anything different.

[mommykay410]

Hi matilds,

So sorry I'm just seeing your reply now.  I haven't had a chance to get on here to the forum in ages because we've been so busy.  Have you had any improvements with your DD?  My DS finally started STTN at 17 months (he's 18 months now), and thankfully he weaned himself off of the comfort night feeds.  One night when he woke up with gas he just laid his head on my shoulder and didn't point to the rocking chair so I didn't offer.  And that was that!  On the dairy issue, we have actually been giving him camel milk, believe it or not.  My husband did a lot of research and found that it does not have the protein that is in the cow, goat, sheep milk that the babies are allergic to so they are able to handle it.  It tastes similar to regular cow's milk, just a little salty.  Before we found the camel milk we were giving him oat milk, which he was ok on as well, although it didn't make for very solid BMs. 
Gas can still be an issue at times, and I am pretty sure the culprit for that is eggs.  We occasionally have breakfast for dinner-pancakes, bacon, scrambled eggs.  And I have noticed on those nights he is up all night with gas pain.  We are currently trying duck eggs to see if he handles those better. 
Hope your LO is making some progress too!