Night wakenings since nap gone. 3 yr old

[Fiona (Leah & Kians Mom)]

I have posted on this before but the problem still remains. DD cut out her nap last August and I am still having night wakenings from her. They can be at any time, 11.30, 2.15....if I am lucky it's only once but sometimes it can be more often. Calls are for silly things, tuck in her bears, she cant find her pillow ( it's right under her head), occasionally a drink of water but I try not to give it as she forms habits sooo fast that it would then be every night. Initially we thought it was the ac which had become a prop as it was on when she was going to bed and then we turned it off so she would wake looking for that so we cut that out and she was fine eventually with it.
She goes to preschool 4 days a week, 2 days then a day off then 2 days before our weekend here. She gets home by 1.30 ish but I just cannot get her to have quiet time, I have tried everything. She is in bed by 7.30 pm / 7.40 and these days I have to wake her for school at 7.40. By 3.30 she is starting into meltdown. Have tried getting her to bed earlier but by the time dinner is finished and 2 kids ready it's 7.30 when I am reading her story.
I think she is over stimulated by shcool. When she was off on break last week we had no wakenings and she was a model child, now she is back to being naughty and cranky probably due to tiredness. I am thinking of sending her every 2 day to school now and cutting it down to 3 days a week but I honestly thought she would handle 2 together, this is not her first time at preschool but she was napping then.
I have tried bribes, sticker charts nothing seems to work. She is wakening me more often than ds. And of course dh doesnt hear her. And of course I cant get back to sleep after I have been in to her, today it was 5.30.
Does anyone have any ideas or do I just have to put up with it? It's starting to get me down a bit 

[Layla]

Fiona... I posted this suggestion on the other thread you have going.... I think if you are having to wake her up at 7.40am in the morning then maybe you should try an even earlier bedtime than 7.30pm (i know that might be hard to do because you have another lo to attend to). What about skipping a bath for the baby on the days she has to go to bed earlier to save time? Or see if DH can put the baby to bed while you are with her?

I don't really know much about preschool as Isabella has yet to go but from what I read she does sound overstimulated. What do you try to do for quiet time?

Believe me.. I know ALL about the 3.30pm meltdowns & having to tip-toe around them. Isabella is on day 3 of no naps & she's again becoming really really hard to deal with (she did this a few months where I thought she was giving up her nap). Distraction has worked well with us in the afternoons on the days she doesn't nap. I took her out of the house yesterday & today cause otherwise she walks around aimlessly & will get frustrated over just about anything!!!

For QT - I put a dvd of Dora on for her & she has almost fallen asleep yesterday (& I messed up by picking her up to take her to her cot) & today (the phone woke her right up)... so maybe you could try something like that... & hopefully it can give her time to take a break.

Layla

[Fiona (Leah & Kians Mom)]

Hi Layla,
Yes am really struggling with this one. After trying quiet time in her room, she was in and out like a yo yo, tried quiet time in my room she then wanted to sleep in my bed at night, we finally moved to the couches in the living room with a dvd of her choice on. Initially it worked, she would sit for at least an hour, now once again she is up and down like a yo yo, needs the loo, or a cracker, or just gets up and potters around, sometimes she will get her books but then proceeds to chat and sing really loudly.
Ds is on an 8 to 8 schedule and that allows me time to get her ready for school before he is up and has to have brekkie and she likes to go to bed at the same time as him, prob feels she is missing out if he stays up later. Also dh travels a lot so I often have to put the 2 of them to bed and it actually works out easier to put them at the same time. Might have another go at getting her to bed earlier.
On the days she doesnt go to school should I just let her sleep until she wakens herself? The other morning I woke her at 8.40 ish as I was afraid if I didnt I wouldnt get her to bed that night?
With the meltdowns I do try for distraction, get her cooking or helping me, this afternoon am going to do some glueing with her. Unfortunately it's still too hot outside to go for walks unless its around 5pm ish and then that runs into dinner time and she ends up being more tired then. I feel like I am in a vicious circle I need to get out of.
And today will prob be worse as they are having a school party so she should be pretty high when she gets home 

[Layla]

With QT.... I started off trying in her room but that didn't work (mine is still in a cot so there was no walking in and out of the room but rather screaming to get out) ... then we moved onto my bed, which worked great until last week which was when she would jump up & down & would poke my face rather than lay down & go to sleep.... & in the process waking up Jasmine from her nap some days. Because Jasmine is only on 1 nap & its pretty precious to me to have her rested as she could NOT handle being up all day like Isabella can! So we are now on the couch with a video. You know what I found... if I put a video on about 30mins before what would have been her nap time (say 12ish as she would fall asleep b/n 12.30-1pm)... she is more likely to dose off as if she would if I put it on right around the time she would have taken her nap. Its as if she has more time to wind down with the video on slightly earlier. She has lunch just before & I give her a bowl of sultanas (her fav snack) or some fruit or crakers with cheese as well as her sippy cup & her potty is in the same room. The only reason we have the potty there is because the toilet/bathroom is right next to Jasmine's room & again I don't want to risk waking her up. 

Today she did try to jump up & down & I sat with her to read her a book instead but she wouldn't have any of it.... so I put a cd of nursery rhymes & we sang instead . I am not sure how "relaxing" it was but at least she sat on the couch for a little longer. Otherwise she's banging walls, wants to play with her little piano.... all things which would wake her sister up

To answer your question... rather than letting her sleep in until 8:30 one morning & 7:30 the next... I would try for earlier bedtime as we discussed before. But if thats not working too well then maybe let her sleep . I would be very tempted to let Isabella sleep in if she went to preschool (& gave up her nap at the same tim) as preschool would probably exhaust her as well... I sound confused.... I think you should let her sleep in on the off days to let her catch up & maybe see how much sleep she needs overall. I am not sure if that would affect her ability to go to sleep at night since she is going to be awake all day long & will still get pretty tired by bedtime (just my opinion though)

Yesterday I took them on a train & that killed an hour at least! This afternoon after we went out for a walk, I filled up the sink with water.... some bubbles & let her play with the water. Or I fill up the bath & throw in all her bath toys, dolls & whatever else she likes to play with (whatever toys don't have batteries that is ) & she's in there for at least an hour having a blast with all her dolls...washing them... pretend playing...

Also with dinner I am finding that any later than 4pm & its not possible so we do dinner at 4.... followed by milk after dinner... & a snack before bedtime (which is 6pm here with a 6am wake up). So if you are finding dinner a struggle try bumping it up & give her another meal before bed.

[Fiona (Leah & Kians Mom)]

So things have improved wont say where incase I jinx myself but let you guess figure that one out 
Quiet time is still an issue, particularly on school days but I cant tie her to the couch- much as I might like to 
She is wakening earlier than I would like but can live with that at the moment, have to come up with a plan for it though as sometimes she doesnt do 12 hours. Of course bedtime is her worst time and she really pushes the barrell out in testing how far she can go, worst time of day for me too cos I have no patience and am usually putting 2 of them to bed.
Her behaviour is improved since I cut out one school day and I am using lots of positive praise, probably too much but it's easier than fighting with her all the time.
Thanks again for all your help and sorry I didnt update sooner