seriously low milk intake

[yaya]

I have been 'double weighing' E for a few days and on average she takes 60ml from one boob!! She pulls off after this time, I try to insist a bit for her to latch back on, nothing, I try second boob, she gets upset. In the end I give up and shes happy as larry and seems content with her feed...this is clearly not enough milk at 5mos! I was feeding every 4hrs before and she used to take over 100ml i'msure altho never weigh, calculatd this from pumping quantity ).
what can I do??? she totally refuses EBM in a bottle, wants no formula...arghh

[RachelC]

Have you been double weighing her at each feed? 

How long is she lasting between feeds?

[yaya]

yep double weighing due to rally bad feed refusal...if it were upto her she'd last 7 hrs between feeds

[Samuel's mum]

You are giving yourself a tough time here. You know that your supply is just in recovery after your mastitis and the whole cream thing. I would give yourself a bit of a chance.

But OK let's assume this is the 'normal situation'.
A few things -
Some LCs are really not fans of the whole double-weighing thing for a couple of main reasons. Letdown is a reflex very much tied up with our emotions and our mental state and it has been found that when mothers knowingly do the double-weighing thing it can affect their letdown and how a feed goes (perhaps they are particularly tense and that affects baby too - who knows). I'm not saying this in entirely you but I think it might be a factor. The other issue is that most household scales are not reliable when it comes to smaller variations and can give incorrect results. What kind of scales are you using? Are you taking 1g =1ml?

BTW I wouldn't assume that you know what she was having before based on pumping output. It's a completely different ballgame.

I think it would be really helpful if you could make a 24 hr log for us. So write down details of feeds (continue with the weighing if you want to or mention behaviour at the breast and feed timing). Record sleeping patterns. Record wet diapers particularly carefully. General behaviour too. Plus record her medication, how and when you administer it - I know you mentioned you give it with fruit puree so it would be helpful to know quantities and the timing in relation to the milk feeds.

I agree that 60mls as you describe - assuming that IS accurate - is not a lot. We'll all put our thinking caps on.

[yaya]

You are right, I am being hard on myself but was seriously panicking...never weighed T but seeing as I couldn't interpret her behavour I needed something to work with! Anyway Yes, was calculating mg-ml just to get an idea of whether she was taking 6ml or 60!
She's been TONS better today and hasn't refused to latch on (tonight she fell asleep on the boob which she has done about 3 times since birth!). I would say shes not much of an eater, I dont even know what her hngry cues are tbh   I used to go by the clock she fed well and put on weight massively, then hit 4mos and started gettign very upset when I tried to latch her on, even went 7hrs in daytime between feeds. Last 2 days she has got better as I said and I have really worked on gettin supply back up (think I may hev OD on water LOL) and my boobs 'feel ' like they are properly producing milk IYKWIM? I have noticed she sometimes falls off right boob and I haev also noticed she doesnt suck hard. NEver sucks for comfort or falls asleepon boob. just trying to outline her behaviour. Yesterday I was feeling  a bit panicky as you may have noticed and was spoon feeding water and she seemed to love gulping it down so i tried giving her one of T's sippy cups and she drank a whole cup of water!! I have this inkling in me sayign that my letdown has changed so drastically (used to spurt across boob) that she hasnt leart to suck properly, seriously before she'd sit there lips round boob and it poured into her mouth....not sure that this is making any sense but what I mean is that her behaviour with the cup made me think perhaps it's a slow letdown issue...she cant be bothered to suck when it slows down?

[Samuel's mum]

Completely agree with Stacy on the cups. Not a great plan to either reinforce breast letdown is slow or to fill her up on water which will take away her motivation at the breast.

Have you used breast compressions much - it can really help if you think she's impatient at a slower letdown. You can use them to 'reward' her for being at the breast.
And you certainly could pump for a moment before a feed and then put her on so the letdown is already there BUT the problem with doing that is that you are still not really teaching her to milk the breast. And feeds have multiple letdowns almost always so she'll still have to work for the next one and get that hindmilk out.

I'm glad things have been better. Keep us updated. A record of feeding over 24 hrs would be useful.

[*Nicola*]

Michelle just offering you support and ((Hugs)) 

[em_here]

More }}}}hugs{{{{ Michelle, hope things work themselves out 

[yaya]

Thanx everyone!
In a rush at the mo but wanted to update!
Only tried the water the once! Re: fuit , she has a teaspoon am and a teaspoon before bed, either puree or juice (needs to be apple to get the omeprazole working better)
SO she has been much much better. My boob is now bruised looking but no longer red and not sore hurrah! She is not refusing boob anymore and stays on for over 5mins. She seems very content and pulls off every now and then to smile at me rather than fidget and twist on the boob I have been feeding every 3 hrs now instead of 4 which i was doing to see if she was hungrier. She latches on every tiem after  3hrs so thats good! Still have no idea what the month long feeding strike was all about but who cares, lets hope it's over!

[yaya]

thanx for ur reassuring words! One Q: if i dont see hungry cues do i just go by the clcok?

[Samuel's mum]

I'm so glad things sound better. You mentioned elsewhere that you weren't always sure about hungry cues so maybe for the time being you might want to offer as part of her EASY routine even if you haven't seen any cues.
If more frequent feeding seems to be working for now then I would agree with Stacy that you may be seeing a sort of 'growth spurt' as she works to build your supply back up.

[yaya]

thanks emma, never been able to tell hungry cues   she will happily go for hrs amusing herself but whereas  beore she refused boob, now I can offer 2.5hrs, 3hrs or 4hrs and she'll feed. only thing I have noticed is she gets super fidgety before she takes a massive feed