Am I doing something to renforce early wakings?

[clareharley]

Hi Emma,

We are still well and truly in the same boat. Harley's naps are diminishing. We haven't managed the afternoon one for over a week now, the lunchtime one has only been half and hour for the past couple of days and that one and the morning one took us an hour to achieve today - 2 hours of pupd, shhhh, god knows what else and only an hour and a half of sleep. So, he woke up at 1.15 and he won't sleep now until bedtime which is at 6pm but he won't be asleep until more like 6.45. Then he'll wake up crying several times until morning starts at 4.30! I'm at my wits end, too. Like yours, he's so tired and all he can do is throw himself around and cry. I feel like doing the same!

Clare.

[emmas]

It's so nice to know I'm not on my own - I just wish someone could give us some construct sound advice/plan - thats what I need.

Today's what shall I try?  Is forced sleep!!  This morning after milk, I laid him down in the bed with me and refused to play - just closed my eyes hoping he would do the same - eventually it worked, I think he had about 45 mins - 2 hours after he woke, then  we walked into town, he fell asleep in pushchair (that NEVER happens) he was due a feed, but I managed to get him out still asleep, and put him in his cot still in his coat and he slept for 1 hour, he started rubbing his eyes 2 hours later so I put him in his cot, he was talking for 20 mins then fell asleep (probably out of boredom), I hoping I might be able to squeeze another nap in before bed - I'm not quite sure what I'm hoping this will achieve as even I don't think his daytime sleep actually makes much difference to his early wakings.  But if he gets 4 x 45min sleeps maybe, just maybe he won't be so tired, as that is twice the sleep he has been having.

I'm not sure I'm brave enough to try a much later bedtime, I've had trouble getting him down and its been close to 8 and I don't think it made a difference - It a tough call as much as I HATE anytime before 7 (I struggle enough with 7) I do like having my evenings. 

Emma x

[clareharley]

45 min naps are surely better than nothing. It's true that in the past we've had terrible days and good nights/normal waking times and vice versa. Maybe the general lack of sleep has an impact on early wakings and night wakings over a period of time. I just don't know. I'm even considering giving controlled crying a go. Like you said in your earlier mail, it's so hard when you can't give your child the most basic of things. Harley's looking so tired and I've got to do something. It really feels like we're back at square one again, where we were in November but this time he's not even responding to PUPD. Anyway, I've just left him alone in his cot now. He's scratching away, playing with his hands, practicing his crawling. He's just started to howl and part of me doesn't want to go in because what ever it is I've been doing over the past few weeks is obviously not the right thing. God knows what is the right thing!!!

[emmas]

Well ignore my "todays plan" post - he has just had 30 mins - woke up screaming like he has nevered screamed before and actually made himself sick by getting in such a state.  We've both been crying.  My whole life seems to be spent thinking.... I wonder if I should try???

[clareharley]

Oh God, what a nightmare. What is going on? I've never done this before but I've left Harley screaming and have shut the door. There is NOTHING I can do. If I pick him up he kicks, scratches, bites, headbuts, tries to throw himself out of my arms, if I put him down in his cot he goes ballistic as he is now. I feel awful for leaving him and it's something I said I'd never do but I don't know what else to do. Today has been a right ter of a day!

[emmas]

Oh honey - I think you've done the right thing - as hard as it is, you need to take a break in that situation.  Leave him for a min -gather yourself (or cry) and go back in.  Don't know whether I do the right thing in this situation but if he doesn't show any signs of going to sleep ie he is screaming - I get him up and take him back downstairs and then try again in about 5/10 mins.  It sometimes worked.  Probably just teaching him to scream then he'll get what he wants, but thats what I do when I can't settle him.

Big Big hugs  xxxxx

[clareharley]

Thanks. Good luck for tonight. I'm thinking of keeping Harley up extra late, just to see what will happen. Tomorrow I think I'll spend the afternoon out with him in the buggy to see if he sleeps then. I'm worried that not only is he refusing his afternoon nap, his lunchtime one is on its way out too. Anyway, we'll see.
Take care and I hope things go better tonight.

Clare x

[daniel'smom]

hugs to both of you!!!
it is SO HARD to have your child screaming and feel helpless. i truly understand that feeling!! the book that helped me with that was "the sleepeasy solution". i know these boards don't advocate anything but the babywhisperer books but this book really helped us, too. and sometimes nothing helps! that's when shutting the door and taking a few minutes is okay. you aren't hurting your child by letting them cry when they cry no matter what you do!!! don't worry, you're still a good mommy. REALLY.

we continue to have early mornings here, too. this morning was 6am which was totally unusual. and not sure that there was anything i did to make that happen. last night he was in bed at 6:15 and asleep by 6:30 (that's the earliest in a LONG time, because he was SO tired i thought his eyes might dry up into little prunes.) we'll see. probably tomorrow it will be 5am like usual.

here's hoping tonight is better for all our lo's!!

rachel

[Fiona (Leah & Kians Mom)]

Morning, another early start here too, 5.50 but today he wasnt so happy about it and was screaming. I gave him nurofen and tried everything to get him back to sleep, even a bottle which he didn't want. Just gave him his solids now at 7.30. Thing here is our naps are great, the only thing I havent tried is bed earlier which dh absolutely does not want to do. I am going to give ds the benefit of the doubt until his illness has passed, though the wakenings started before he got ill but at least then he used to chat for half an hour and then go back to sleep.
Does anyone think this is developmental? All our babies are the same age no? Same happened to my friend when her little guy was this age and it went on for a very long time.
Hope some of you got a late start today 

[clareharley]

Hi Fiona,
Someone told me that when they're learning to crawl and teeth, both of which mine is doing, it can really mess about with sleep so I keep clutching at the one because it means it'll be over soon! Harley woke up at 5am this morning but after only an hour and a half sleep all day yesterday he slept right through the night without any night wakings which is unusual these days. He also went down for his morning nap this morning really easily and is still asleep now, after nearly 45 mins! When he woke at 5, though, I made the mistake of picking him up and trying to get him back to sleep. Usually I let him chunter away in his cot until as close to 6 as possible but I wondered whether I could get him back to sleep. It seemed to make this worse and he got really upset. I then let him settle himself which he can do better than I can settle him but then by 5.30 he was crying again so my husband brought him in to our bed and played with him until 6am, which made him (Harley) very happy indeed!
Anyway, here's to a better day. Oh there he is, awake.
Clare.

[Fiona (Leah & Kians Mom)]

Yeah 2 bottom teeth came through about 10 days ago and pretty sure he is working on the top 2. Plus he is sick with a head cold and on an antib. He has been commando crawling for at least a month now. He used to just wake and chat for about half an hour then go back to sleep now though it's up time, there is no resettling and I cannot let him scream which he was doing for very long as he will wake dd. He had a nap of an hour and 15 mins then I woke him. Lets see how he does this pm but these past few days I have had to wake him from all naps. Too bad I dont have to wake him in the morning, those were the good old days 

[emmas]

Morning,

Well I've had a lay in!!!!!!  He woke up crying at 5.30, normally he's happy so I went in and thought I'm not getting you up til 6, patted his belly and left, he started banging the bars then after 10 mins all was quiet, he had gone back to sleep til.......... 6.45!!!!  I'm still in shock.

I think we could be right about the developmental thing, he had his bottom 2 teeth through for new year, looks like he has the top 2 trying to push through and his next two bottom ones.  He isn't interested in crawling, just trying to pull himself up and grunting at me until I help him walk around the front room.  I so hope today is better than the last week has been, I've woken up with a head cold and blocked ears - feeling sorry for myself.  No doubt wee man will come down with it too.....

Here's to a good day for all 

[clareharley]

That's brilliant! Maybe you've turned a corner, Emma? Fiona, I know what you mean - when it's time to be awake, it's time to be awake. I haven't managed to get Harley back to sleep from either a nap or an early waking for ages. He might sometimes doze a bit from 4.30-5.30 if I pull him out of a corner he's got himself stuck in but these days awake is awake.
Harley's is doing the same today as he did yesterday - woke at 5am then had a hour's nap at  8.15 and half an hour at midday. I'm going to try and get him to sleep in the buggy this afternoon otherwise he'll have to go more than 5 hours without sleeping. That's what happened yesterday and he fell asleep at 5 when I was feeding him. But, I've decided not to get so stressed about all this. If I can't get him to sleep and I tried everything, that's just how it is.

Good luck to you both for the rest of the day and this evening and I hope you have a repeat lie in tomorrow, Emma. Sounds like you'll need it more than ever with a head cold coming on!

[Fiona (Leah & Kians Mom)]

Thats great Emma, hope the corner is turned for you.
Am taking ds back to the doc again tomorrow afternoon, he is refusing all bottles and eating almost nothing, the boy who was on 900 ml per day and 3 spoon feeds 

[emmas]

Well I have had the strangest day - Had a nap in buggy again this morning as I needed to go out - nearly an hour I think, then had a friend round with a dd for him to play with - normally he'd be too excited to sleep, but after 3.15 hours A time he went up and slept for an hour, at 2.15 and I put him down at 4.45 as he was exhausted, its now 5.30 and he is still asleep.  Not sure what to do now, I feel like I should let him sleep but what about bedtime - actually I can hear him awake.  What would you do about bedtime??  I usually have him in the bath at 6.10 for a 7pm bedtime (he has 14oz of milk before bed so it takes a while to drink it) should I try for that, but not stress too much if he isn't tired???

Fiona - is your ds teething?? that normally puts them off food, amongst everything else, or it could just be he is full of phlegm   Our ds's have the same birthday!!