help! my 7 month old spirited baby nurses all night!! up every hour or less.

[zombiemom]

i'm new to this forum. i just read the baby whisperer and i can't wait to start e.a.s.y. my husband and i are starting this sunday when he can help. not sure how i will last till then with 'no' sleep. but i know i can't do it myself.
our baby has ever so gradually turned from a good sleeper to a horrible one. we have been co-sleeping but it obviously doesn't work for us. she wakes every 30 minutes to an hour, all night, to nurse, sometimes she is awake for a few hours around 2:30. in anticipation of starting e.a.s.y. i have tried to get her into the schedule, with success in the daytime, but at night i don't know what to do. when i start e.a.s.y. she will be going from 10 feeds a night to zero. is that ok?
i am so anxious about how this is going to work. i imagine screaming and crying all night. with me doing a fair share of the crying! does anyone have any advice or a similar situation?

[anna*]

(((hugs))) keep posting for support, we will help you get through to Sunday Are you going to wean the co-sleeping and the feeding back to sleep both at the same time? It's going to be tough, I can promise you, but it won't last forever and I bet you'll both feel better when you get some uninterrupted sleep.

You don't have to go from 10 feeds per night to none. I would suggest feeding her 2-3 times at least for the first couple of weeks. I'd suggest you make a 'rule' for nights is that you will feed her when she wakes IF it has been 3 hours since her last feed. If it's less than that, you'll settle her some other way.

As for settling her without feeding, it might be easier for DH to do this the first night, and maybe the second, too, because he won't smell of the lovely milk she's hoping for. I think you should both read up on Shh-pat and PUPD, but try to settle her with shh-pat first, use PUPD as a last resort.

As another alternative, you could try gradual withdrawal. I know that some other mums on here have had some success with weaning from co-sleeping very gradually. You could take a look at this thread and see if anything there is helpful to you: http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=142701.0

Let us know what you decide...

anna
x

[A pair of Charlies]

Hi

Here to support you anyway I can. Anna's suggestions sound really logical to me - going cold turkey on night feeds would be really hard on both of you and a steady decrease gives you both some room. Make sure you really try and tank him up during the day so that you can eliminate your worry that he's starving at night. 

Settling without feeding & DH: If you've been nursing back to sleep, you settling in the dark hours of the night can be a problem - as your baby will expect the feed. And think you've lost the plot when you don't offer. In my experience, if DH settles our DS in the late morning hours DS will cry louder and harder BUT for a far shorter period of time than if it were me. It's as if he works the situation through in his head: scream loudly, Mummy will come with the boobs....no sign of Mummy, just DH....scream louder some more then give up because Daddy just can't give milk. And he nods off back to sleep quicker.  If I go in, no crying really just a long drawn out refusal to go back to sleep and whinging for a bit of BF. So DH for night settlings it is!!

Gradual withdrawl: I've done gradual withdrawl from my son sleeping an inch from me (and not being close enough for his liking) to his own room and independent sleep. Anything I can help you with on that front, just let me know.  I can walk you through it.

Good luck!!! Here to support you anyway I can.

Charlotte

[zombiemom]

first of all i want to thank you for all the support. your suggestions are very helpful. since i have only read the book i was going to do exactly what it says. like the shush-pat, the book says it's only for 4 months and under, but if you think it could work for my 7 month old, that would be nice. the more options the better!
i also like the suggestions about the night feedings being decreased gradually. every 3 hours seems like a good gauge.

my husband has taken some time off, so the first three nights he will put her to bed at night. i will probably take the nap/day shift. then after that i am on my own at night. i hope she makes some good progress by then.
we plan on being very consistent. i realize that is the only way this method can work efficiently.

i did a nursing chart for a few days and realized that she eats frequently but sometimes just for a few minutes, so i am feeding her less often, hoping she will eat more at each feed. i'm trying to get her prepared for the huge change coming her way. i'm nervous!

so, to recap:
pu-pd
shush-pat (is ok for 7 month olds?)
one dream feed with other feeds if they are 3 hours since the last one
does that sound right?


thanks again!
 
sandra

[A pair of Charlies]

Hi

Sounds like you have a great plan and set time aside. Watch out for regression on day 3 or so, and just stick to your guns. These little ones like to test you I think.

My DS is a spirited wonderboy. I've heard other mums of the spirited comment that PUPD hasn't worked for them (doesn't mean it won't for yours) so just watch for improvements and cues carefully. With DS, it winds him up more and he becomes super clingy...and I found it wasn't for him. I know very little on PUPD so perhaps Anna will be able to guide you on how it's meant to go and what signs to look for to check it's heading in the right direction.

Which leaves shh patt. Of which I am a massive fan as it got my boy into his own bed. Again, the spirited like to step up the game a little. Often both combined can be too much (I think this may be the same for a lot of babies) and it's a case of finding the one which suits your LO (shh or patt, and the way they like it) and recognising early on when they aren't in the mood for either. Example: ssh patt was our reliable tool for a while, now he finds it 'annoying' to have either in a steady pattern, even when really upset. A random slow shhh is often comforting (as long as it's irregular  ) and a rub / pat on his back, bum or legs also works. Again, for some reason it doesn't work with him if it's regular  ....intermittant and lazy slow. It's a bit of finding what comforts them. Are you clear on how to do shh patt and what you're working towards? Can get you more info on this if you want; just say.

There are some other things you can do to make it an easier move for your LO:
Really, you're making a change that for her is a big big deal. And she's likely to find it unsettling and confusing...so you need to make sure that she is more than sure that you are there for her, she is safe and loved. Sounds silly and obvious but worth pointing out. Look at her room and where you are putting her from her point of view. What can she see and can't. Is it light enough for her to see and feel that she knows where she is (initially). If she only ever sleeps in there, perhaps let her spend a little wind-down play time in there with you and with you out of the door, so it's a room she gets used to and is comfortable with. Is there a place that you can put a picture of you that she can see clearly? Just little things. Music or noise all the time. Cosy bed with a lovie. A lovie that smells of you (worth cuddling against her while you nurse too for a few feeds)....comfort, safe and loved. And loads of Mummy loving time during A slots helps too.

[zombiemom]

thanks again charlotte, for all the information. it is so helpful. but i have to admit i'm a bit more confused now. i hope you don't mind me asking for more help.

the book makes it seem rather simple. do the pu/pd and stay with it and it works. so the shush-pat, how does that work? you put her in the crib and pat her back while shushing? what happens if she gets irritated or cries? do you then pick her up? my daughter sleeps on her back or side, not usually on her stomach, do you shush-pat on the belly, too?
do you think we should try shush-pat or pu/pd and stick with it for a week or two, and then try the other if the first doesn't work, or do they work in conjunction with each other?

as far as the crib goes, she is pretty comfortable there. she plays in there a bunch, sometimes with me, and sometimes with out. we have also put her to sleep in there before. but it never works unless she is completely asleep, and even then she sometimes wakes up and protests, which is why we don't try it very often. i've been nursing her on a super soft blanket which i will use for her lovey, it should smell like both of us and plenty of milk with a touch of dad. she hasn't really picked a lovey yet, i'm hoping this one will work.

the thing that makes me most nervous is the feeding. i feed on demand, but mostly to get her to sleep. the book says to feed her when she wakes up. does that mean i stop feeding her in the day when she cues? i have gotten myself into such a pickle. she only nurses to sleep, all of our other 'props' that used to work, have stopped working (which is so sad because now dad can't help), and even nursing takes a long time. sometime i have to nurse her for 30 minutes or more just for her to fall asleep for 30-45 minutes, sometimes 10! i remember when i would complain about only getting 2-3 hours of sleep at a time, now i would kill for that. i'm lucky if i get an hour.

i have a few questions about the naps, too. the book says to pu/pd for the length of the nap, and then if she goes to sleep in the last ten minutes to wake her up after the nap 'time' is over. is this the way to do it, or does this not work with spirited babies?

i guess what i am asking for is a perfect formula that i can follow for 3 days to 2 weeks that will be guaranteed to work.
please. 

thanks again for your continued help, 3 days till we start! scary.

thank you, thank you!
sandra

p.s. what does DH and DS mean? i think LO means little one.

[zombiemom]

i forgot to mention that i currently only breastfeed. i am starting her on solids a bit, but she isn't very interested, so we've decided to wait a little longer, and certainly until she has a good sleep schedule. i don't want to confuse matters anymore than they already are. not sure if this info matters, but i thought it might.
thank you.

[anna*]

Hi hun. I'm going to copy and paste some blurb I've written about shh-pat and PUPD. Try shh-pat first. If it's not helping at all, you can go ahead to PUPD. I would really try and find a variation of shh-pat that works for you, it's much 'gentler' that PUPD.

Oh yes and the abbreviations. DH is dear husband, DS is dear son. With putting her in the crib when she's asleep, babies (like us) expect to wake up in the same place as they fell asleep. So if you fell asleep on the couch and woke up in bed, you'd be all 'what the...?' That's why we put so much effort into getting them to fall asleep in the cot. So that when they wake up in the middle of the night (as we all do), they can just roll over and go back to sleep. That's the theory, anyway

One other thing:
Starting from now, get a wind-down routine in place, so that your LO knows ahead of time that she's going to be expected to sleep. It doesn't need to take more than a few minutes. I used to have ours written down and stuck on the wall in Stan's room so that I didn't get confused and mess about with it when I was tired, and so that DH or anyone could do the same steps in the same order to put him down. It's nothing fancy, just:
Walk upstairs slowly, talking to him softly or humming a tune
Check/change nappy (no giggly games, keeping it all very low-key)
Draw curtains
Put him into sleepsack
Close bedroom door so it's dark, then sway and sing a song with him (we skip this if he's overtired and fretful)
Lie him down in cot
Give him his rabbit
Give him a kiss and say 'it's time to sleep now sweet baby - I'll come if you need me'
Turn on white noise CD
Leave the room and close the door

The whole thing takes 3 minutes. It doesn't matter so much what you do, as long as you do the same things in the same order, every time. Now I warn you, when we first started doing this with Stan he started to SCREAM when he knew a nap was coming, but it got less and less and before long he would happily chat to me all the way through and go straight off to sleep by himself.


OK. Here's the info on shh-pat. Get comfortable, it's long...

Shh-pat. There is more info here: http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=26672.0

OK here's the info on shh-pat. This is long! The info is really aimed at younger babies - but the aim at this age is to only give her as much help as she needs.

Put your baby in the crib, turn her on her side (I used a rolled baby blanket tucked against his tummy and thighs to keep him from rolling back), and begin to pat her back - firmly (not hard) in a 'tick tock' fashion. I used to imagine the rhythm/pace of a slow, steady heartbeat. You also want to make a loud, "Shhhhhhhhh Shhhhhhhhhh" noise. If after a while those two things don't seem helpful, you may need to experiment - Stan didn't like his back patted, so I patted his butt. Or you could rub the back, or just rest your hand on her back, or jiggle her in the crib. The important thing is that it is something that you can do gradually less until you stop. (ie, if she is in your arms, you can't 'gradually' put her down, she is either in your arms or in the crib). Also the sound, if she hates 'shhhh', try humming, or talking softly - find what she likes.

So here you are doing shhh-pat, or your variation of it. If she starts crying, pick her up, hold her against your shoulder and keep shh-ing and patting until she's calm. Then lay her down and keep shh patting. If she starts crying again, and won't settle, go ahead and pick her up again, keep shh-patting all the time. Once she's calm in the crib, keep going for a good 10 minutes after she's completely settled. Gradually, gradually, quieten and slow your shhhing, then stop. If she cries, shush again while patting and pick up if necessary. Eventually you will get to the point where she is settled in the crib and you have stopped shhh-ing. Then you gradualy slow down the patting over a minute or two, make it slower and lighter, but keep patting until she is asleep. Stay beside her in the crib - you may need to keep patting her until she is in stage 3 of sleep, ie more than 20 minutes after she first settled. Or you might just need to keep your hand on her back.

At this age, she still needs your help to guide her to sleep, and this is how to do it without accidental parenting.

The key is not to stop just because she has calmed down, keep it up. And stay with her, don't leave, until she's melted into the crib!

Now, it's true this can take a long time. If she is crying really hard, just remember this is the only way she has to tell you that she doesn't want to sleep in her crib, she wants to sleep in your arms! If 40 - 45 minutes of shh-pat have passed at nap time and she is still not asleep, take her out of the crib, feed, change her nappy if necessary, and try the nap again starting right from the 4 S's. If it's bedtime or the middle of the night - keep going until she sleeps.

This sounds so overwhelming, but it's really OK once you get into it - for me, I always felt better if we had a plan. With shhh-pat you can help her less and less, stopping before she is asleep and letting her put herself to sleep.


---

Now here's some info on PUPD. Remember, try to make some variation of shh-pat work, but if it won't, PUPD can be really helpful. There's a heap more info on PUPD here: http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?board=89.0

So, after your LO is down in the cot, you leave the room. When she starts crying, wait for a moment outside the door and listen to how she's crying. If she sounds frustrated, or like she's shouting, or just not like she's actually upset and distressed, leave him a bit longer. If she's fussing, shouting, whining etc, give her a chance to settle herself. Some babies NEED to mantra cry (you will have read about this in the BW books) to get to sleep. If you rush in too quickly in will just teach her that he CAN"T settle and he needs you to do it. If you're not sure, wait 30 seconds, still listening, and then decide if she's really upset. (HINT: If you're not sure, she probably doesn't need you just yet.)

If she's really crying, go into her (keep the room as dark as you can). Quietly, calmly, say something like "It's OK, mummy's here". Repeat the phrase as you try to settle her in her cot (with Stan I would turn him on his side and pat his bum or rub his back, different things work on different days. Sometimes he just wanted to hold my hand). ** If she's not calming down at all, pick her up and hold her against your shoulder. Keep saying your phrase softly.

This is the difficult/important bit: Don't Hold Her Too Long! After saying your phrase, lay her straight back down again, even if she starts crying again on the way down. You will have her in your arms for 30 seconds or so. Don't expect her to calm down in your arms. Try again to settle her in her cot. If it doesn't work, go back to ** and start again. When she eventually calms down, keep doing whatever you were doing (patting/stroking/etc) until she's very calm and drifting off to sleep. Gradually gradually, slow down. When you're sure she's asleep, stop, then tiptoe out of the room.

Now: If you're doing this at bedtime, you keep going until he sleeps. It might take an hour, it might take two, but she will sleep. If you're doing this at naptime, after 45 mins if she is still not asleep then take her out of the nursery for a 10 minute break, then go right back to the beginning of your wind-down routine and start again. Keep going until it's the next milk time. Eventually, she WILL sleep. She won't cry forever - it will just feel like forever

Once she's fallen asleep in her crib once, the next time should be easier. (Although sometimes it gets easier, then harder, then easier again). The aim is that soon you'll only need to pick her up once or twice, and once she's calm you can leave the room for her to get himself off to sleep. Eventually, she won't need to be picked up at all.

This isn't easy, but when it works the results will be worth it. The important thing is that you never leave her to cry. If she's distressed, you need to be there helping her (you know this already). Do whatever it takes to get yourself through it, and have some support if at all possible. Do keep in mind that if you start out with an aim in mind ie sleeping in a cot, you need to see it through. If you go through 24 hours of sleep training and then change your mind, you'll end up with a very confused baby and you will have put her through all that crying for no reason. And you'll still, eventually, have to get her to sleep in the cot somehow.

I hope this helps and it's all clear. Let me know if I haven't explained anything properly. Good luck, and let us know how it goes.

anna
x

[A pair of Charlies]

Hi

Working through your post:

the book makes it seem rather simple. do the pu/pd and stay with it and it works.

Tough one. It may be that I and a couple of other mothers were doing it wrong or not long enough. I don't know. I do know that for me it wasn't working AND that for the majority of Mothers I've seen on the sleep boards that try it 100% seems to do the trick. Anna would be able to guide you more in this area, I think. I really don't know enough about it.

so the shush-pat, how does that work? you put her in the crib and pat her back while shushing? what happens if she gets irritated or cries? do you then pick her up? my daughter sleeps on her back or side, not usually on her stomach, do you shush-pat on the belly, too?

I should've added a caveat to my post - it worked for us when DS was younger than yours. It evolved (following his cues) to an either or for us. I guess what I was trying (rubbishly) to say was that I find it best to follow their lead in some ways ...if you're shh pattting for 10 mins and you're just getting a major fight...then that shh patt combo isn't working, IMO (in my opinion).  Jay3 mentioned she's still using shh patt so perhaps she can add more?

If you went with shh patt, the idea is to get them focused on the shh patt (both, either, or) so that they are relaxed enough to go to sleep. You do it while you hold them first, then just as they go floppy, drifting off to sleep lay them in their cot. (Ideally). Then continue it from there til they are drifting off to sleep, past the jolts. But that's the advice for babies, and I'm not 100% whether it works the same at this age. Essentially, the aim is to get them relaxed and off to sleep...then each time, you do less to get them to sleep, leaving them to do more. For example, day 1 shh patting them to sleep, day 2 sp slowly / quieting just before they go to sleep...and each time earlier and earlier. At the same time, laying them down sooner and sooner - so as soon as they are relaxed, into the cot. Again, little babies is the experience I have. I would ssh patt the upper back her shoulder or very gently on the chest. Avoid the stomach!!

I used shh patt to get my DS into his crib from a babe in arms at 7 or 8 weeks. We almost clinched independent sleep a few months later but a holiday sent us to AP hell and I hadn't the strength to go through it all again (I had trouble with my wrists...). So shh patt at that age, worked for us.

Recently, we got independent sleep with GW (gradual withdrawl). I think Anna linked you to a long, very long and dull explanation of it in another post. Again, I'm not sure how it works at this age but I'll go do some digging for you and will post back links to anything I find.

do you think we should try shush-pat or pu/pd and stick with it for a week or two, and then try the other if the first doesn't work, or do they work in conjunction with each other?

I don't know enough about PUPD to advise. Anna's great at sleep advice and may-be would give you some more ideas on what to expect. One thing I'm fairly certain of is that if you try it, you should be committed. As I understand it, it isn't a stop-start-stop method so if you give up part way through and then start again, well your babe will have learnt that screaming long and hard will pay off. Not sure if this then makes it impossible or not. I think Anna suggested PUPD as a last resort?

i have a few questions about the naps, too. the book says to pu/pd for the length of the nap, and then if she goes to sleep in the last ten minutes to wake her up after the nap 'time' is over. is this the way to do it, or does this not work with spirited babies?

PUPD I can't comment on BUT I can tell you that is the approach I followed for shh patt / sleep training. With GW, I started it at bedtime so it wasn't a shock at nap time. Also, I had his A times bang on (luckily!) when I did GW so he fell asleep really quickly for naps with very minimal protest.

i guess what i am asking for is a perfect formula that i can follow for 3 days to 2 weeks that will be guaranteed to work.
please. 

I can get you a GW plan that works over 14 days. You should see results within 4 days.
p.s. what does DH and DS mean? i think LO means little one. [/quote]

DS - darling / dear son
DH - darling / dear husband

If it helps...http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=51772.0  

the thing that makes me most nervous is the feeding. i feed on demand, but mostly to get her to sleep. the book says to feed her when she wakes up. does that mean i stop feeding her in the day when she cues? i have gotten myself into such a pickle. she only nurses to sleep, all of our other 'props' that used to work, have stopped working (which is so sad because now dad can't help), and even nursing takes a long time. sometime i have to nurse her for 30 minutes or more just for her to fall asleep for 30-45 minutes, sometimes 10! i remember when i would complain about only getting 2-3 hours of sleep at a time, now i would kill for that. i'm lucky if i get an hour.

I think a glimpse of your current schedule would help here so we can get a picture of whether she's a snacker during the day and 'eating' at night. The feeding to sleep (making you a sleep prop). I think it's sleep training time.    How this works with feeding I don't know; I have no experience. Hoping one of the other ladies will be able to step in here?

I have a couple of questions / want to clarify:
 * How and where does she go to sleep during the day?
 * Is she nursed to sleep for all naps and night sleep?
 * When she's awake in the night (for up to 2 hours?) is she happy, wakeful or desparate to get back to sleep?
 * What routine are you aiming for / what is it looking like now? How much day sleep and how often?
 * How are the day feeds going - is she getting lots of calories during the day? Is there any chance of a bottle at DF (10 - 11pm)?

Hope my ramble helps in some way. What do you think?

Charlotte

[A pair of Charlies]

Hey

I didn't see Anna's post as I was posting (I got the warning and posted anyway!). Sorry.

Not sure if it helps, but I've pulled this from another post where I've explained how I shh patt and thought might be helpful. Might not.

* find a rhythm that works for you both: the first time I tried shh patt it didn't work. I was shhhing like a banshee; loudly, too fast, too stressed to be relaxing and sounded panicky. Enter DH who (less stressed and tired) found a rhythm for us. My shhh sounds, to me, like water coming in over pebbles in the tide and back out again...so it's stronger in the middle and long. Then I got my pat rhythm too, I tried the tick tock tick tock (I'd used a heart beat rhythm previously and that worked well too). Very gentle pat on middle of upper back. I kept in my head what it was meant to simulate: womb noises, the wooshing of fluids and the tick tock of your heart. Your LO's used to that sound; comfort. You're recreating it. Not loud, not stressed, not panicked...just gentle and try to tune out if you know what I mean? Sounds unbelievably anal but over a count / beat of 8 (tick tock = 2), my shh lasted 6. Silence for 2 counts and then ssshing started again. The pat was constant. To keep calm, I tried to think back to the times I would pat my tummy gently (or rub) when DS was on the inside and had hick-ups. We had more success when I was in that mindset.

* If bed isn't LO's favourite place, try the afternoon nap somewhere else that they like so they get a break of scene before nighttime. I did the pram for the afternoon nap. Slept better with fresh air, helped me get out and feel a little more human.

It's from http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=141531.0 but TBH (to be honest) I think you have all the info above to make an informed decision and put it all into practice. 

Once it's done, you'll both feel great. If you can get DH to help all the better. Might really come in handy with settling during the night at points where you don't think it's hunger...my DS gave up crying sooner with DH. Those moobs don't have milk. 

Charlotte

[zombiemom]

sorry to make you two wonderful women work so hard.
but, i do feel 100% better now!
i feel like i can use your suggestions and make a plan.

to answer charlotte's questions:

she nurses down and sleeps in our bed 98% of the time. the other two percent she sleeps on my husbands chest on the couch.
usually in the middle of the night, when she won't nurse down anymore, and i need some sleep. he is a great shusher and patter!

she nurses for all naps. this used to be quick, but all of a sudden it's taking longer and longer, with the naps becoming shorter and shorter.

sometimes she wakes in the middle of the night, usually happy and ready to play.

in anticipation of the changeover i have been using the 4 hour schedule. it seems to fit her. hard to say when she is such a bad sleeper. but she is normally tired right around the appropriate times

7:00- wake, eat, potty
7:30- activity (morning play with daddy)
8:30- potty, then mellow play (lights lower and soft music)
9:00-sleep (nurse down) sometimes i have to do this several times as she wakes after 10-45 minutes
11:00- wake, eat, potty
11:30- activity (play, store, errands, or swim class)
12:30- potty, then mellow play (lights lower and soft music)
1:00- sleep (nurse down)
3:00- wake, eat, potty
3:30- activity (usually a long walk, then play)
5:00- eat (i'm trying to feed her more in the evening so she'll wake less at night, which hasn't worked)
5:30- bath (i don't bathe right before bed because she gets so excited in the bath it isn't a relaxing time)
6:00- eat again
6:15- sesame street video (not sure if this is bad, but it is the only time she is mellow so i've been doing it before bed)
6:45- potty*
7:00- mellow time
7:30- nurse down (which starts the whole night of hell!)

11:00- when we start, my plan is to do a dream feed with a bottle

*we are doing the early potty training which is why i put 'potty' there. we sit her on the potty for 2-10 minutes.

she gets plenty of food in the day! i feed her on cue and sometimes more.

i decided not to do the catnap because she wasn't going down for it. and we'd have to take it away later anyway.

you guys are the best!
i feel so much better,
more prepared.

sandra

[zombiemom]

good morning new friends,

another tough night her. so happy to have a helpful husband! my little girl woke up at 3:30 with a ton of energy. she wakes up in the middle of the night once in a while, but my husband usually gets her to sleep fairly easy. but last night she was ready to play! ugh. they slept on the couch at 4:30. luckily i got to sleep the whole time. why would she randomly be awake at night like that?

i've been reading a lot of info on this site. i read the interview with tracy on sleeping. really good! i'm going to read it again more thoroughly when i have a chance. i'm wondering if i have this right: i'm suppose to try to stay on the schedule, but also read my baby's cues. if you let your baby go too far off the schedule does it get way out of wack? also i read that during the introduction time you're suppose to really follow the schedule. tracy's book says to start the process in the morning 7am. but in some of the posts people say to start at night. is that for spirited babies? or is it just something people have found easier?

charlotte, you asked me if she was getting enough food. i should probably clarify some more. i've been feeding on demand, plus adding extra feeds so she doesn't need to eat at night. but the reason she eats so much is because i nurse her down for every sleep. so she gets sooo much food, especially when it takes 45+ minutes to get her to sleep. i'm sure i'll have to nurse her more often throughout the day now, since i won't be nursing her down anymore.

two more days!
all rambling is welcome, for sure!
i want as much info as i can get so i will be more successful!

sandra

[hrk]

Just a thought, as our son was a constant eater...  He had silent reflux.  The swallowing temporarily relieves discomfort in the throat.  If you find things are not improving over all, you may need to rule out anything medical.  A good book for any gi issues is Colic Solved, likely at your library.  Check with your pedi, also, if the feeding situation continues and you are giving it good effort.

[anna*]

What do you think you plan is going to be? Are you going to stop nursing to sleep? We'll be here to support you.

[zombiemom]

hi jean, do you think she could have reflux even though i have no sign of that? she doesn't appear to have any discomfort. her ears bother her sometimes from teething, so she tugs on them a bit, but even that doesn't seem to upset her. the problem is during her lighter sleep cycle she always mashes her face and wakes herself up. usually i can get her back to sleep, but not always.

and to answer anna. yes, i will stop nursing to sleep altogether. i realize that is my biggest prop and probably why i am in this desperate situation to begin with.

i'm going to use the same schedule i posted before. i am trying to get her accustomed to it now, the only difference being that i am nursing her down now. but will stop that on sunday.