Need some help with wake-ups mid-nap AGAIN!

[greenteamomma]

I have been extending my 5.5 month olds A times and after a few weeks of good naps, have been having some 40 minute wake ups.  I can always extend but I don't know what to do.  He wakes after 40 mins, babbles, I put pressure and if he starts sucking his fingers I go hide.  He never cries but ends up going down after 10 mins or so for another 40 mins.  It started with one nap which I thought was just adjusting to A time but now it's for both naps.  I have been giving him a top up to make sure it's not  hunger.  I try to extend his first nap but he falls asleep in my arms after 2 hrs 10 mins.  The second nap I put him down after 2 hrs 20 mins, he babbles for 10 mins, I swear says good night starts sucking his fingers and he's out.  Now today, he stirred after 30 mins for his second nap but I just observed him...he kept twitching or stirring and then at 40 mins he cried out this time.  I put pressure on him and he was out again.  I am trying to increase this A time again but when I have him in my arms he whines and then when I put him in his crib, he babbles and is soooooo happy for those 10 or so minutes.  I don't know if something else is going on....I checked and no other "magical" teeth seem to be trying to pop out (he cut his first tooth and we didn't notice till it was in!).  Why is he waking like this?  Why has he started to switch or stir soooo much during his naps?

[becky1969]

Can you post routine in EAS format, and then we'll talk over the possibilities!

[greenteamomma]

Hi and thank you for replying!
My LO tends to settle more and more on his own lately and when he cries out as you will see, I apply pressure or put him more on his side (he is in a sleep positioner) and he puts his fingers back in his mouth with a wimper and calms down. 
here is yesterday:
woke at 5:30 babbled and had BM but fell alseep on and off to 6:30
E 6:50
S fell asleep as soon as he hit the crib 8:40, 9:20 whining, applied pressure only, slept to 10:10
E 10:30 (topped him up at 11:45 only because of sleep wakings)
S in crib 12:30 no help slept 12:38, 1:10 cried out then again at 1:30, 1:40 and 1:56, then woke pleasantly at 2:05
E 2:35
A here is quite long, he just wont go down for a CN, very happy, babbles and babbles in bed, even with patting until ready so CN in pack and play (we are practicing for trip next month) at 4:45 babbled let out one cry, sucked on fingers and finally slept at 4:55 and woke at 5:40 crabby (not like him).
E 6:00 crabbiness went away for a little while!
A Bath at 6:30
E top up at 7:15 (he is just dropping his 5th feed)
Bed at 7:30, fell asleep immediately
DF 11:00 cried out at 10:30 which he sometimes does, I went in and said time to sleep and he put his fingers back in his mouth and fell asleep
Woke at 4:50 today with BM, had to change him, up to his neck

so what do your eyes tell you? 

[becky1969]

I think that the BF at the early waking and then the sleeping on/off until start of the day is throwing your routine off.  That's not top quality sleep, and perhaps isn't SLEEPING-sleeping, if you get what i mean.  So instead of having like a 2 hour A time like you think you're having, it's more like 3 hours and LO is OT. 

The EW is probably happening because so OT from lack of good daytime sleep.

I think if we can get first nap timed better that it will be more consistent, and then the rest of the day will fall into place.  Also, at 5.5 months we're aiming for 2h15-2h30, so the 2h20 may be a bit long for naps 2 and 3.  I think its definitely too long when 1st nap is so broken.

So, I think what we're going to have to do is just start our day at 5:30 for now.  Hopefully it will only be for a day or two until we get naps consolidated!  If he wakes at 5:30 I want him down for nap at 7:30 -- that's a bit of a short A, but he's EW so I suspect he's going to be sleepy.  If he fights it, then we'll try 2h15 the next day.  If Nap #1 is better -- without disruption -- then I want you to do 2h15 for all subsequent naps.  Bedtime may be super early with such an EW (6:00 perhaps), but that's OK -- that will get moved out as we fix these EWs.

[greenteamomma]

oh, I meant BM as in bowel movement not breast milk. I thought that was BF?  I haven't fed  him that early in two months, LOL.  He is having alot of poops lately early in the morning.  Yesterday was much better, he only wakes half way through, rolls around (in his sleep positioner) and then finds his fingers and goes back for more sleep.  It takes him about 8 to 10 mins and then he goes for another 40.  I know he is sleeping in the morning from his sounds and peeking (he's in our room).  Its sort of like a cat nap, he's in rem.  It's not recoverative but it is sleep, like the cat nap at the end of the day.
I'm starting to think it was the sleep positioner as we have been trying to wean him from this.  I have loosened it so he can roll on his back but back to his left prefered side.  He seems to be accecting it more, so maybe that?
What do you think?   

[becky1969]

LOL!  Yeah, there's a BIG difference between BM and BF! 

Hmmm.  Yes, the sleep positioner may be causing more problems than it's helping. Can you just take it away altogether? It might be a rough nap or two but then you'll be done and you can see if it helps?

[greenteamomma]

I know, the darn thing....I'm worried to that when it's gone he'll be moving everywhere...my little guy is getting bigger and its making me scared.  How did you deal with the LO running around the crib?

Bac to sleep itself though, what about waking half way through and falling back asleep;  I seem to be getting mixed reviews as to the quality of the nap in total.  Some people say fine, as long as he goes back for the second part (which he does) and some say no no no, its not quality unless he sleeps right through that transition in the middle.....

[becky1969]

I think whether it's quality sleep or not kind of depends on the kid -- some can have a wake up and feel good and refreshed after.  But if your days are falling apart and you're getting MORE restless sleep, then I think for YOUR particular kid it's not working so well.  See what I mean?

I don't think at this age I'd worry to much about the rolling around the crib.  If LO can roll over, of course, he shouldn't be swaddled anymore.  And make sure you don't have loose blankets/bedding for him to get tangled in.  Otherwise, it's just part of growing up! he'll find his own ways to make himself comfortable, and that's part of learning independent sleep as well.

[greenteamomma]

I know I know, he's not even 6 months and I don't want him to grow up......

I have losened it again today and found him sideways..I will keep losening it till it's no use.

As for naps, he slept through both today with only a little stir and a fantome(sp?) cry.  They were not long though, only an 1 and an 1 and 15 minutes....should I be looking at making A time longer again?  He did wake early for about 45 mins again (and no poops this time) then went down for 40 before getting up.  he is at about 2 hrs 15 for his first, 2 hrs and 20 mins for his second and 2 hrs 45 mins for his one before his cn.  Seems about age appropriate I know....but he will be 6 months soon, some can do 2.5 at this age for all naps right? 

[becky1969]

Yes, some can do 2.5 hours at 6 months.

[greenteamomma]

we have done that and it seemes to be all good now and he slept til 6 this morning...better then 4 or 5 and then cat naps till 6...

[greenteamomma]

blah, and everything went in the toilet for the last few days!  45 minute naps, not wanting a cat nap, not wanting to go to bed, getting up at 5 am and not falling back to sleep.....two days ago he was doing 2 hr naps and I was waking him!

[becky1969]

What may have happened is those good naps got him caught up on sleep and he's ready now to lengthen A time a bit.   He may now be ready for 2h20 or even 2h30.