Help! I've just had to shut LO next door. His feeding is upsetting me so much.

[lynners]

So for the first time ever I've had to separate the two of us because I was furious.

About 8/9 months ago I posted about my then-11-month old throwing everything from the high chair.  At that stage he hadn't yet properly learnt to use a spoon and it may have been a developmental thing.  However 9 months down the track and it's still as bad, probably worse, and I'm really not sure what to do.  He definitely knows what he's doing now and laughs/smiles when he does it.

So this is the situation which I'm sure a zillion other Mums face....

LO will only definitely eat only a very few things but I don't want to give in to that palate (i.e. plain bread, rice, mashed potato, cereal and some types of fruit.  Oh and anything in a baby food jar.  That's about it really  .)  So when I give him his meals if it's something he likes he tends to eat it and then pass me the plate when he's finished (occasionally throws it but that's on a bad day)

If I give him something to extend his palate (i.e. rice and the dreaded veg) sometimes he'll try it and then often throw it, sometimes he'll just throw it.  I've definitely got to the stage that I tell him off when he does it but for a long time I had then been giving him something that he'd eat like a banana.  I feel though I'm now worried about him turning in to a picky eater and also don't want to 'reward him' for his naughty behaviour.  So for the last few weeks if he throws his food I'll tell him off, pick up the remainders and put it on the table near him - so he can reach it if he changes his mind, but not so that it's on the highchair otherwise it would go straight off.  Occasionally he'll end up trying it again if I leave him to it and potter about in the kitchen, more often than not he'll have a tantrum and throw it again.

So now I'm at the stage where if he does that I don't get him anything else, clean him up and get him out of the highchair.  It's happening a lot and it happened today (and he smiled when he did it - hence the 'I need to have a moment to myself'  )

So issues are -

-worried I'm not giving him enough food when I do this - has always had weight issues.  My MIL  thinks I should not be wasting my time with my healthy home cooked meals and head towards more processed, easy meals - really don't want to do this but think he'd probably eat such stuff.

-worried that I'm now getting really upset with him when he throws his food.  I haven't completely lost it but am definitely more than just raising my voice.  Feeding time just pretty darn awful.

Could really do with some opinions/advice.  Sorry this has been such a ramble.

 

[Sarah - Enfys' Mum]

I would always give him a few things on his plate; something you know he'll eat and something you're not sure about or that he has previously refused.  It can take many tries (>10) for children to try new foods.  I never really worry about what Enfys eats, as long as she has a choice of healthy things at each meal, she pretty much gets to decide what she eats.  But then, she's never been picky so I've never had cause for concern. 
As far as the throwing - I have zero tolerance for that.  As soon as anything is thrown, be it spoon, plate, food, I say "Uh oh, looks like dinner/breakfast/snack is finished" and put her down.  No more food until the next meal time. (and no in-between snacks either!)  It might take a few tries but I bet he'll soon get the message. 
hth xx

[1sttimemamma]

I agree with Mum. When DS throws (which hasn't been in a long time), I say "You must be done" and get him down. I also used to have him pick up what he threw and hand it to me. No more tries after that.

[amandamae]

Just wanted to say we've been going through a very similar situation and that you're not alone! Good luck with your little thrower!

[lynners]

Thanks ladies, I really appreciate your support. 

Today LO was at nursery giving me a well earned break from the feeding horrors so am feeling a bit better today.  Incidentally on the two days a week he goes to nursery he NEVER throws food and eats nearly all of the healthy home-cooked meals put in front of him.  Most frustrating    Don't know what I'm doing wrong.

Anyway I've discussed your suggestions with my DH and we think that yes, it's time to take affirmative action and take him down from his chair when he throws the food.  Bit nervous about his lack of eating but will try to give him more of a selection of things including stuff he'll probably have  (even though that tends to be bread, rice cakes etc.)  Good idea Sarah.

Fingers crossed and I'll let you know how it goes.

[mum101]

Hi, first of all sending you a big HUG, as a mother feeding your baby/kids is a tough job.  My DS has been low in weight and at one stage got sick and lots a lot of weight and it's tough to see.  

Sounds like if he's eating at nursery the foods he refuses at home, it's not an issue of textures etc. It's an issue of knowing what he can do at home.  He might even think it's a great game to play with you.  

I would persist with no more meal as soon as he throws a food, take him out of the high chair and says 'meals over'. Does he do it at the end of a meal, or just the stuff he doesn't like?
I would guess he's doing it because he can (and that he'll get something he does like afterwards), because he might get a reaction out of you.  Walk off and do something else. No reaction means no pay off.  No other food he does like means no pay off.  Wait until the next meal time and announce it's meal time.

A couple of things to think about...
What is his eating style? Is he a grazer, does like like to snack than fill up on full meals, does his appetite get less as he's nearing a nap or bedtime?  Is he easily distracted, is he better at eating when he has company at the table.  

Have a look at the volume of food he's eating, is he pretty hungry before a meal, is your expectation of the volume of food higher than his needs.
If you want to, you can post what he does typically eat in a day. I think a fair degree of hunger (but as long as it's not right before a nap) is good for appetite.  You can also work on running him around to work up more of an appetite.  

To introduce new foods... one suggestion could be to place a range of a couple of foods on a small table (I'm thinking of a tiny serve of something he does like and some foods he doesn't eat but kids usually like). Do this an hour or so before the next meal. It takes any pressure off both of you and allows him to touch, feel, look and get used to the food. I agree totally that it can take lots of presentations of food for kids to accept it.  DS has had a couple of showings of blueberries before he started eating them, he's a bit easier as he gets older.

Making food fun, even being able to mush yoghurt around is part of the fun and food experience. Doesn't mean he'll do it forever, it's just part of the learning.

When introducing a food you are hoping he'll start eating, add it to his plate each meal for a while. Don't add a lot of new things, let it be one at a time.

In the meantime you can pick the things he does like, say he likes spaghetti bolognaise and add pureed foods into it.  You could also start to add small things to the pureed foods he likes.  

Overall, keep in mind he's probably eating a good range of foods, and some kids are just going to be small and appear to live off air!  My SIL's DD seems to do that.  

[lynners]

Hi there,

Yes my LO recently lost over a pound in a month so the weight thing is an issue - although he looks really healthy.  Sorry to hear you have the same problem with your ds.

Like the idea of putting some new foods on a small table for a snack/or to get used to before his meal.

Currently his day of feeding is something like this -

7.15 A
8.00 - Cereal, yoghurt - always the best meal of the day.  Only sometimes throws plate.  This is the only meal he has been known to sometimes pass me the plate when he's finished.
10.00 - Snack - rice cakes, sultanas
12.00 - Sandwiches of some sort and fruit - loves bread and is ok with a few fillings.  Used to give him a home-cooked meal such as a stir fry or pasta but hardly ever went down well.  Sandwiches seem much better but he generally does not eat much at this stage.  Maybe not as hungry?
12.45 - 15.30 Nap
15.30 - Tend to try and give him his left over sandwiches.  Sometimes ok, usually a bit of a struggle.  Might try and put these on a little table with some extra bits that he can get used to in his own time.
16.30/17.00 - Dinner - usually try and give him a pasta or sausage and mash etc.  This is the main time of the day he throws his plate.  Possibly the food I'm giving him?  Possibly feeding him too early although this is when he eats at nursery and it's ok.  (Although if I gave him a banana he would woof it down    ) Also if I feed him a bit later he tends to then not want to drink all his milk before bed.  This is the meal in particular that I feel I'd like to add extra bits that he likes too.  Also still want to be giving him the likes of spaghetti bolognese as well - got loads of such meals frozen.  Can't bare the idea of throwing them all out.  So would you suggest giving him for example spag bol plus bits of things he likes for every night until he tries some/takes to it?
19.30 S

So yes writing this all down makes me see that his eating definitely deteriorates as the day goes on.  Whether he's less hungry, more tired or likes the food types less I'm unsure.

Really appreciate your help.

By the way mum101,  I'm from Melbourne too.  Moved to London 14 years ago.

[mum101]

It seems like he's eating a good range of food.     I would not worry that he's not getting enough variety.  And even if he's limited in what he wants, he's eating pretty healthily. 

Given that he has lost weight, and ruling out any health issues, keep in mind it might be just that he was very active or it might be a scale glitch, but also keep an eye for any other symptoms that he's not well. Also is he teething at all or had colds before he lost weight?  Have a look at his chart in the long term, is his head circumference growing, is he growing in height at a relatively stable level. They are good signs he's doing OK.  Also you say he looks healthy

I've been told by my health nurse and I agree (given that when I haven't bulked up DS's meals he doesn't gain weight) that I need to feed him up more than his natural appetite .  We also just recently had a blood test to rule out celiac disease, which thankfully was a good result.  It goes against what I encourage with my DD, but it's something I see as temporary measure.

The things I have tried...  I add formula to the full fat cows milk in his cereal (I also used to add it and mix it well into spaghetti bolognaise). If he has a fairly low fat meal like pumpkin soup or baked beans, I mix in dry formula or cream cheese.  If you think your DS will notice and refuse the food, start by adding it in in tiny amounts and build on it. I prefer good fats like olive oil, avocado and peanut butter.  When he was off the bottom of the chart I added cream to cereal and olive oil to savoury meals as a temporary measure.  I found the highest fat yoghurt (I discovered there are 10% fat ones available all the way through to no fat ones).

I give him peanut butter and cream cheese instead of vegemite on crackers. I encourage a big breakfast as he doesn't eat as well at bedtime (sounds the same as your LO).  For me evidence that he eats enough in the day is that he doesn't wake up starving, he plays for a while.  I give him meats, full fat cheese, and avocado. 

Your LO might do well with food at his level he can pick at for a lunch meal or after nap, experiment with that. He might eat better if he has a small snack before a nap so he has a good appetite for al lunch after his nap. 

I would think of the long term in adding more foods, and really concentrate on taking any pressure off. 

For extra veggies I add grated zucchini and carrot into the spaghetti sauce and simmer it down.  My DS still won't eat a lot of things my DD would, so one night if we have salad, I put it on his plate but don't expect him to eat it. 

My DS had giardia at around 11 months and one of the symptoms is that you can feel nauseous when eating.  To me I felt there was something wrong.  I think he had it for about a month, getting constantly sick with everything else, and I was at the doctors once or twice a week until we got a diagnosis (after a paediatrician finished telling me he simply wasn't getting enough breast milk!!).  He even dropped off the bottom of the chart for weight and it was so hard not to get really upset about it. 

Nice to 'meet' another Melbournite    Come back, we're having a mini heat wave in spring    That's Melbourne!

PS I was impressed with these web pages relating to calorie boosters and picky toddlers.

http://www.askdrsears.com/html/3/T030800.asp

http://www.pediatrics.emory.edu/divisions/neonatology/dpc/calories.html

[lynners]

Gosh it sounds like you and your DS have been through a tough time.  Great to hear he doesn't have celiac disease.  How hard for you when he dropped off the bottom of the chart.  MY LO started very high and over a year managed to drop to almost the bottom (not off though luckily).  He has been teething recently (always seems to be though) and seems to be out of sorts.  Not really ill but just not himself. 

Will definitely take on board your advice to up the calories.  LO loves cream cheese so that should be quite easy to add in to things.  I do also give him full-fat everything.

Thanks for the links.  Funnily enough I found the Dr Sears one last night but hadn't seen the calorie booster one.

By the way LO is home with me in a day.  Feeling empowered about the decision to remove him from his chair if he throws anything.  See how it goes.
 

[mum101]

Feeling empowered about the decision to remove him from his chair if he throws anything.  See how it goes.

That's awesome   

Sounds good, let us know how he goes.

[lynners]

So day one of the new eating regime went OK.  I bought some of those segmented plates so that he had different spots for the different types of food I gave him.  Different foods worked really well and he liked his new plates.  Cool.

We did however have two plate throwing instances.  Not so cool.  I stuck to the decision though and got him out of the high chair immediately and it at least felt good to have a definite plan.  As he had been grazing more with different food types at least I felt like he did at least have something in his tummy before I had to do it.

So fingers crossed will see how tomorrow goes but I'm feeling more positive.  Found a great vegetable slice recipe which he really went for too.

[lynners]

So on the plus side,  LO is definitely at least trying more foods giving him a greater option on his plate so that's great.  On the negative side we're still getting a lot of plate throwing.  Still sticking to getting him out of the highchair immediately but tonight was just awful.

We'd decided to cook a family dinner early so that DH, LO and I could all sit down and have dinner together.  DH had cooked a roast chicken and it all started great.  We'd even given LO a little pot of gravy so he could dunk his food in there which he seemed to love.  All going well and then from nowhere he had a fit and just pushed everything off on to the floor. 

We put him down immediately and he was fine for a while, but then he kept coming up to the table and pulling at my hand to get me to 'go walking' with him.  He's only started walking on his own the last few weeks but keeps regressing to wanting me to hold his hand - which normally I would do 

Anyway we wanted to finish our dinner and didn't want to reward him for his behaviour so continued with our meal.  Well then the whole thing escalated into an all out temper tantrum which I did not want to give in to.  Ended up putting him to bed early (he didn't have a very good nap which could have been part of it.  Who knows?)

I suppose the thing I found hard was trying to decide at which point the issue was about the throwing of the food turned in to something else.  I think I did the right thing 'not giving in to him' but it broke my heart.

Then when I was putting him down, he was finishing his milk and threw that too.   

Yucky day.

[mum101]

Sounds like you are going well in what you choose to do in the situations.  Great to hear he's trying more stuff, the plate sounds great.   I would expect plate throwing for a while, until he forgets about doing it.

His behaviour is completely normal for toddlers, they are so cheeky!  I think tiredness is a big factor, sometimes I can get Leo to eat more with a couple of giggles or a change in the mood around the table. Also the last 2 nights we had tuna pasta which we don't often eat and while he was hungry I could see him baulking and he was tired. So I pushed his high chair to the lounge room so he could watch a cartoon and we all ate there. He completely forgot he was going to fuss, and just started eating!  Pretty funny to witness. Certainly not something that's good for long term, but it helped us. I probably do that once or twice a week. 

Your stand to just put him down is good.  In terms of regressing with wanting you to walk with him is normal too, they steam ahead, get a little unsure and come back to mumma for some reassurance.  Always a big of coming and going 

When he's down off the high chair and having a meltdown, you can still engage him, but explain mumma is eating right now, I'll walk with you soon. Repetition of that will help, but he won't really understand.  Half the time our meals are interrupted too, I try not to give Leo his earlier than us (as in while I'm still getting ours on the table) but sometimes he can't stand to wait. Then he's done before us and trying to get down and can be trying to climb up on us etc. esp if he's in a mood.  I agree it is hard, but one day it'll be a distant memory!

If you are lucky sometimes you can engage them in playdough or something interesting, but sheesh that is hit and miss!

sounds like it's all going well!

[lynners]

Well we just had breakfast and it was nice to then come and read your response.  Threw his bowl again this morning which is really rare for him in the morning - normally his best meal.  Put him down from highchair saying 'meal over'. Trying really hard to not say 'no' in a raised voice as he seems to quite like that reaction.  Don't think I can blame his tiredness for this one!

Last night when he was having 'his moment' after we put him down I did still engage him as in 'mummy's finishing her meal now and you would be too if you hadn't thrown it so you'll have to wait' so I was pleased to hear you would have done something similar.

Any suggestions about snacks?  We're off to a mother and baby group this morning and would normally give him a snack mid-morning.  Would still rather do that due to his weight concerns but don't want to negate the 'putting down from highchair'.

Thanks for your help and all the best.

By the way love the name Leo, and no you're not the only one to use TV when necessary 

[mum101]

Good morning 

He might keep doing it for a while, it's in his list of things to do that get a reaction (even a bad one in the past), might take a while for him to forget it.  Sometimes things can get worse before they get better.  But another thought... might be his way of saying he's had enough. Leo often tries to climb out of his chair or the bath. His way of saying he's had enough. If you think he's had enough you could pre-empt it by taking him out. I offer Leo a snack 'to-go' like a biscuit or piece of bread because I am keen to up his weight.  If he's still a bit hungry he'll take it.

I think a snack while out is a good break from the high chair, and he probably won't think of throwing stuff, well we hope so. LOL

Glad you like Leo it's short for Leobin. I love love love Lucas, and was also thinking of Luca, but DH vetoed them. Of course by the end we had only one name left, Leobin, and he wasn't named until 2 days after he was born!