Author Topic: Help - we're stumped  (Read 669 times)

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Offline Shh Patrick

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Help - we're stumped
« on: February 08, 2010, 11:08:27 am »
Hi,

This could go in the night wakings or getting back on track but as it's more general I'll put it here and hope someone can help.

Our son is 21 weeks today. We have two other kids so (sort of) know what we're doing.

For the past four weeks or so he's been on a 4 hour EASY. A routine that has, give or take a bit, looked like this.

7am Eat

7-9 Activity

9-10.30 sleep

11 Eat

11-1 Activity

1-2.30 Sleep

3 Eat

3-4.30 Activity

4.30ish sleep (30 mins)

6 bath

7 eat

7.30ish sleep

11 Dream feed

Generally he has been happy and putting on weight. After the DF he would wake up between 3 or 5, and we would get back with shh pat and if he woke again, and it was early, maybe 5 or so, then my wife would breast feed. THis seemed ok - he knew day from night and four or five hour stretches at night were common. He was primarily BF until about five or six weeks ago when we cut down. Now he is primarily bottle fed. 8oz each feed apart from the dream feed where we give 7oz. He usually finishes them all but the last oz or so

Recently, though, it's been a disaster. Evenings he started waking frequently, got him back with shh pat without too much trouble. He would then sleep for three of four hours post DF, and I would sh pat him back to sleep as he didn't seem hungry. He would wake an hour later. Then I would sh pat him back. An hour later he would be up again, then we'd feed him as now he'd be crying and seemed hungry. Generally this would be 4.30 or 5. He would then go back for an hour or so and it'd be time to get up. One night a few weeks ago, he slept through, post DF until 6. It was, however, just a cruel glimpse of a restful night we have never experienced since (and it was a day when we had to run around visiting people and the whole routine got buggered up!)

However, now he seems to be sleeping all evening until the DF. But he wakes up approx 1.30 hours after it, then every hour or so after that. He's easy to settle with sh pat and doesn;t seem hungry. Even if he's fed from the breast at 4 or 5, after several wakings, he will only go back to sleep for 1 or 1.30 hours. Because of the waking after the DF, we decided to see what would happen if we dropped it, and fed him when he woke, in case the DF caused him tummy problems (see below). He woke at 11 both times, when we usually gave the DF. I can't remember the last time he managed a four or five hour stretch at night apart from the now mythical and oft talked about sleep through the night (maybe one of our other kids snuck him Medised when we weren't looking...)

Now the possible explanations. He has been ill, a cough and a cold, and he does suffer from reflux. Infant Gaviscon and a bit of cranial osteopathy have made that better; he still vomits occasionally but with none of the attendant pain he used to experience. It did mean that for the first 12 weeks of his life we held him a lot, to keep him upright. This meant he did fall asleep in our arms. But for the past month especially, we have been very disciplined in settling him in our arms, then putting him in his cot still awake and sh patting him to sleep.

The real frustration comes with his naps. He wakes, and always has done, after 30 minutes without fail. You could set your clock by him. We have tried everything to extend this: wake-to-sleep, holding the jolts, white noise, and none if it works (and we have tried them all countless times). The best bet is to sit by his cot and when he starts to surface, sh pat him back to sleep. This can take a good 20 mins or so, but he does back for another half an hour. Then we repeat, though depends on how near a feed we are.

I can't help feeling that until we crack the 30 min nap thing, and he learns to go into a deep sleep, the night waking will continue and continue to get worse as it has down the past week or so. His lymph nodes are still up and we still give him Calpol as he's batting his ears, as if they hurt, but the docs says it's just a virus and will pass. He isn't screaming with pain, or even crying that much. He just wakes up and doesn't seem to know what to do with himself. We've never really had to use PU/PD because sh pat works adequately. Though more than a month on he just doesn't seem to be getting better at going off on his own or staying asleep through the sleep cycle.

To be honest, we're a bit baffled. Are we missing something? Maybe the reflux is troubling him and waking  him, or it was so bad  when he was young it has messed up his adrenals and nervous system and caused this chronic waking habit? Yet he seems happy and feeds well, without crying. The docs seem happy. We have thought about dropping the late afternoon sleep but he'd be a mess without it and have to do down at about 6 or 6.30. Likewise, we have thought about not extending his naps, and letting him have a succession of 30 min naps, so his routine would become a sort of EASASE. But again, not sure that's enough sleep to last him the day. Even (*puts fingers in shape of cross*) controlled crying is out of the question , because with his reflux, he'd just vomit after any stretch of sustained crying.

By the way, he doesn't have a dummy. Won't have it. God I wish he would as our other son did and he slept like an angel from 8 weeks. He also sleeps on his front because of the reflux and we never swaddled him, though in hindsight I think we should have.

Any ideas?

cheers.

Offline clazzat

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Re: Help - we're stumped
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2010, 19:35:04 pm »
Did the problems start when he started on formula?  Reflux babies are very often intolerant to milk protein, so it's possible that the milk-based formula has been upsetting his system.

As for waking at 30 mins, have you tried tweaking his A times to try to change that wake up?  It's possible that if you shift things around a little - 10 mins one way or the other - you might find the "magic" A time that gets him past that 30 min mark.

Also, I don't know if this is just my kids, but at 21 weeks both of them had to go to bed at 6.30 after a 30 min catnap (4.30-5) and bath at 6 - is it possible that he is going down OT from too long a last A?

Offline Shh Patrick

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Re: Help - we're stumped
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2010, 19:58:41 pm »
Thanks very much for the reply.

He has had reflux since birth, and he was breastfed solely for eight weeks or so. When we introduced the bottle he seemed to suffer less after the bottle feed than a breast feed, or at least keep more of it down. However, it was only at Christmas that he switched from being predominantly breast fed to bottle fed, and since xmas his sleeping has been less dependable than before. We have toyed with the idea of lactose intolerance without testing it out. Might be worth a try...maybe the gaviscon is cloaking the problem a bit.

Will try tweaking the A time before the naps. We tend to go for two hours, including winding down. I think we have tried extending it and that didn't work so maybe go for a bit less.

Also you make a good point about bedtime. Will have a look at that too. He did used to have the bottle at 6.30 and be asleep by 7 but that seems to have shifted a bit come to htink of it. Might try and reinstate it.

Thanks - this is all very useful. Any other tips welcomed!!

Dan



Offline clazzat

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Re: Help - we're stumped
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2010, 20:08:39 pm »
If extending hasn't worked, it's always worth trying slightly shorter in the hope that that will help!  I think it is important to try to get his naps right, as 30 min naps won't refresh him properly, even if he doesn't actually get any less sleep, iyswim?

Definitely worth trying out different formulas - even without MPI, some of them don't get on with some formulas but are okay with others.  Have you looked at the Colic, Reflux and Crying board?  There are some good stickies about reflux/MPI which might give you some more tips.