Need Serious Help! The S in my EASY for 7wk DS is not happening.

[jde78]

My DS is 7 weeks today.  I have a 3 year old DD, and the closest family is 1300 miles away, so implementing EASY has been tricky because I have my DD to care for as well.  I do my best to watch all my DS cues, but there are times I can't drop things and run to him because DD has needs, too.

DS has been sleeping in his crib at night really well for a week (bassinet by my bedside prior), but naps were in a swing, car seat or on someone. 

So, today is day 3 of starting EASY.  The first two days, naps went well in the mornings.  I was able to get DS in his crib 10 minutes.  He'd make little noises for 15-20 min, and then fall asleep.  He was eating every 2.5 hours.  He is solely breastfed.

Afternoon naps did not go  well.  He was OT, and took short ones, or not at all.  We started to try patting/shushing, although I discovered on the forum today I wasn't doing it quite right, but close.

Today was the kicker for me, and I am so lost.  First nap today, took forever to settle once I placed him in the crib, but did sleep 40 min.  Woke hungry and I fed him even though it had only been two hours.  2nd nap, he only got 20 min light sleep.  The remaining naps didn't happen at all.  I was patting and shushing through the entire S periods with him OT and crying.  The only time from 11:35am - 6:00pm that he wasn't crying was when he was feeding, getting his diaper changed, or the couple of time I attempted a little A to give him and me a break from attempting a nap.

He cycles through the 3 sleeps stages very fast and sometimes does all of them at the same time.  This is where having DD round is tough, because I can't always pick him up and start on the first yawn, but today, I made sure she was with a friend, so I had the whole day to be with DS.  I'd started the naptime routine on the first yawn.

I don't know what to do, and I'm afraid that after a day like today, he's no longer going to sleep so well at night.  DH is with him now, so I can scour these boards.  Below is what today  (3/29) looked like starting from midnight.

E 12:26a 
A diaper change
S 12:45a

E 3:41a
A diaper change
S 4:01a squirmed around for a while but settled on own; heard noises at 5:15a but settled on own again

E 6:39a
A diaper change
S 7:05a

E 8:48a (actually awoke at 8:38a, so I got him out of bed, but had to get DD handed over to friend)
A 9:13 - 9:40a
S 10:10a - 10:50a

E 10:53a
A 11:09a - 11:36a
S 12:29p - 1:00p  OT crying, patting/shushing since 11:36a.  Woke at 1p with OT cry so I  patted/Shushed again until 1:35p.  Had to leave him in crib crying for 10 minutes b/c DD got home, and had to get her down for nap.

E 1:49p 
A 2:08p diaper change, yawning so skipped A and decided to start naptime routine
S never happened - off and on OT cry with attempts to get him down until 3:15p (DD awake, made her snack and started movie so I could back to DS at 3:20p).  Continued trying to get him down until 4:10p.

E 4:12p
A 4:37p diaper change, awake and cooing, started yawning at 4:50p
S never happened - same story as above

E 6:00p
A 6:25p diaper change, was limp on me getting him to changing table
S 7:55p DH took this shift, and I am hoping it sticks

What am I doing wrong?  What do I do?  Please help!

[~Sara~]

Hi there   I had a hard time getting DS onto EASY as well...and I did the same thing you are doing: I started the wind down routine at literally the first yawn.  I think yawning is a good cue for when LO is tired, but sometimes, they just yawn (especially after breastfeeding bc the oxytocin makes them a bit sleepy .  So, after DS took really short naps, I found out that at this age, babies are doing about 1h15-1h20 for their A times.  A time is eyes open to eyes shut (I think of it as awake time rather than activity time); and includes eating, activities, and the wind down.  So with that approximate time in mind, I think if you try having LO asleep after 1h15-1h20, he'll go down for his naps much easier and stay asleep longer.  Granted, that's just an average time, so this is when when clock-watching and baby-watching have to work together: you'll learn what A time your LO prefers.  Not all A times have to be the same, either (which was SO hard for me to wrap my mind around!).  Some babies like a shorter A time first thing in the AM, some like a short evening A time, etc.

I actually just responded on another thread re: a LO this age, so I'm going to repost a bit of what I wrote there, here:

I'd shoot for something like this (Note: just use the routine times for the increments; the actual times for your LO will depend on when he woke up):

Awake at 7, eat
A: diaper change, some cuddle time, start wind down at 8, start shh/pat at 8:10
S: asleep no later than 8:15

As you can see, there's not much time for activities, etc., and I know you have a lovely big brother to look after.  You try the best you can, but I think if you can hone in on the sleep window, LO will go down much easier and sleep longer; and you'll actually be spending less time in there than you are now.  Granted, I don't have two kids, so this is theoretical advice.

If LO takes less time to drift off with shh/pat, then you can start the wind down later.  I just wrote in 15 minutes' worth to make sure that LO has some time to calm down from anything that happened in his A time.

At some point, though, LO just needs sleep over whether or not he's in his crib or if you used shh/pat.  When the OT monster sets in and LO is unable to catch up on sleep, I recommend using APOP (accidental parenting on purpose) to let LO catch up for a couple of days; then it's back to sleep training Smiley  So if your LO can nap 1.5-2h in the swing, I say go for it for a couple of days Smiley  He's still very young, and I highly doubt that by so doing, you'll be ruining chances for him to be a good independent sleeper.

Also, I noticed that at night, you're doing a diaper change after he eats every time.  If possible, try not to change him unless he's soaked through or has a dirty diaper.  At night, we let them wake up on their own if they need something (like a feeding), and when they do wake up, we keep stimulation to a minimum.

Lastly, when LO takes a short nap, then following A time (which starts from the moment his eyes open) will need to be shortened.  By how much will depend on your LO; but it will probably be basically a feed, the wind down routine, shh/pat, and asleep.

So, look over that and let me know what you think   *hugs*

[jde78]

Thanks Sara for taking the time to respond to my note.  I am seeing now many similar/almost exact posts on the forum, and you are dear for being patient enough to respond to me.

This morning has been better, but slightly out of order.  Just going with the flow, trying to stay as close to EASY, but get my boy some much needed daytime sleep today, so we can start anew.  He woke 1 hour after the last early morning feed (5:51a).  He wasn't hungry at 7:00a, so he had low key A while I made DD breakfast.  When he started getting a little fussy, I changed his soiled diaper, put him in daytime clothes, and then fed him at 7:51a.  I figured a two hour window was okay b/c I knew he was still tired from yesterday and would need a meal in his belly to attempt getting him down for a solid nap.  After he ate, we wound down by singing a little song, then I did our naptime routine, and at the 7 mile stare + 2 eyes closures, I transferred him to the crib and pat/shushed for 30 minutes.  I left the room at 8:45a and it's now 9:40a with him still asleep.  DD came in room twice, but she was fantastic and left the room quietly for me today. 

So our morning was more of an AES, but I'm hoping if he can take a few good naps today, irregardless of the EASY order, then we can try again tomorrow.

[~Sara~]

It's my pleasure to help out where I can   We've alllll been there, trust me

I think it's good to just have some days where you just go with the flow--sometimes it works out well, sometimes it doesn't.  But, EASY shouldn't be an overwhelming burden on anyone as Tracy's philosophy was that the structured routine was to help the entire family thrive and function (while meeting the needs of LO, of course).  There are times when you need a break, too (not just Me Time, but when LO won't nap, etc.) and so for your own sanity, it's good to go with the flow and try again the next day.

It's not that uncommon for that first AM feed to be a top-off feed is LO has eaten just a couple of hours before during the night.  I think the 2h A time is still too long for him (it's what a 4-4.5 month old is doing)--and I know you're doing your best   But, if knowing that about the feeds helps you get him down within his sleep window better, then there ya go

I hope you have a great day today!  Let me know how things go and how you're doing.

[jde78]

Hi Sara,

I agree that an A of 2 hours is too long.  The only way I can think to avoid it since pat/shush is taking at least 30 mins right now is to start trying to put him down again after each feed and diaper change.  Those two things are about 30 - 40 mins.  Is that what I should do?

If yes, I will try it when I can, but that is very difficult with DD around b/c it would be mean that I'm really not leaving DS's room.  Right now what little A time I do before trying to get him down again, and the S times that stick are when I can do things with her.  I know we will work through these issues, but it is taking a toll on DD.  Her behavior is degrading, she is very disrespectful to me, and today keeps telling me she is not going to be happy.  For this week, I have arranged playdates at other peoples houses from 9a-1p for her.  Then she comes home for her nap, and DH is going to work very early this week so he can be home 3:30-4p to help minimize the times I have to deal with them both as I work through the nap issues.

The first nap ended up lasting 1 hr 45 min.  The second nap today started just like the first, except I cut the A off a bit short to do some wind down in his room.  He immediately got upset, so we scratched that and started the napptime routine.  He started crying, so moved into pat/shush which again took 30 mins.  Left him with another A time of 2h.    This nap was only 40 min.  He was ready to E b/c it had been 2.5 hours at that point.

The end of his meal coincided with DD getting home, so I decided to do a little accidental parenting on purpose with DS.  I put him in the swing hoping he would fall asleep fast to reduce this A time.  It was also very needed to have him in the swing, so I could really focus on DD to spend some moments with her and then do her naptime routine.  She was not so well behaved, which is understandable.  Becoming a big sis is tough and sometimes frustrating when you're used to all the attention for 3 years.  I periodically checked on DS, and the little toot had the 7 mile stare forever.  He didn't end up falling asleep until the a time hit 1 hr.  Better than 2, but I thought he'd have fallen asleep immediately.  Guess not if he's OT though. 

Today has definitely been less than ideal, but so much better than the hours of crying yesterday.  The only thing that kept me sane for all that crying was knowing that I with him (with the exception of a few moments when I'd need to go to the bathroom or get DD to sleep) the whole time.  He may not have been happy with what I was doing, but at least he wasn't alone.  Poor thing probably burned a pound of calories!

If you have suggestions for tomorrow to get A times shorter with another child in the house, I'd love to hear them.

[~Sara~]

Hi!  How have things been over the past couple of days?

The only way I can think to avoid it since pat/shush is taking at least 30 mins right now is to start trying to put him down again after each feed and diaper change.  Those two things are about 30 - 40 mins.  Is that what I should do?

Well, if he doesn't have enough A time, he'll also be very inclined to take a short nap.  So, he probably won't be ready for a nap after only being awake for 40 minutes, so the shh/pat taking so long then would be due to the fact that he's UT.  If it's possible to try, I think starting the wind down routine after 1h with the goal of having him asleep by 1h15 (so 10-15 minutes of wind down and shh/pat) will probably be good for him. 

I think it's perfectly fine that you used some APOP to meet both DD's and DS's nap needs.  I think that's what a lot of moms of two do.  And while on this topic, I'm not sure if you've seen these, but I thought they might help you out a bit:
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=63933.0
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=80827.0
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?board=20.0

Also, I'm going to see if I can find some moms who've been in your shoes, to see if they have any advice/tips to share.

Oh!  I meant to ask earlier...is your DS swaddled?  Is his room darkened, or is there any white noise playing while he's sleeping?  If not, those might help him settle down for a longer nap, too.

[clazzat]

(((hugs))) - it's so difficult getting started with 2.  It does get easier, though - I promise!

My first piece of advice is to try not to stress too much about doing it perfectly - you can't spend hours sh/patting when you have an older lo running around, so it is better not to put that pressure on yourself to start with.

What I did when dd2 was tiny was to set myself the goal of one nap in the crib a day - it does take longer to establish independent sleep and EASY, but it is so much less stressful and you get more time to spend with dd.  For me, I found the first nap of the day was the easiest one to judge - and if I put her down at the right time she would be asleep within 5 mins (I confess, I didn't manage it that often in the early days!).  It was also often at a time when dh was at home and/or dd1 was eating breakfast so was entertained while I tried to get dd2 to sleep.  Once she was a bit more established on independent sleep (more about how in a minute), I would generally manage 2 naps at home in her crib without too much difficulty and then the catnap would be in the buggy/sling.

Re independent sleep - the dummy and the swaddle were my absolute lifesavers.  Once I started using the dummy I could put her down swaddled with the dummy in and leave the room - then I would have to go back a few times to pu the dummy back in, but that would only take a minute and she would normally be asleep within 15 mins or so.

You mentioned that dd still has a nap - I found that an invaluable time for working on sleep training with dd2.  If you can try to work out your day so that they are down at the same time for at least part of the nap then you can really work on sh/pat if you need to.

The other thing that I did was to make sure that there was a time of the day when I would spend time with dd1.  I was nearly always able to get dd2 down in the evening so that I could do bedtime routine with dd1 - a couple of tv programmes and stories before bed.  My rule was that dd2 could not interrupt stories as that was my time with dd1, and so if she cried I would tell dd1 that dd2 could wait (except the time when dd1 insisted on me going to look after the baby! ).  This was a period of about 10 mins, and tbh it was very unusual that dd2 did cry during that time, but I do think it helped dd1 understand she was still important and that sometimes I just couldn't look after her first, iyswim.

Final thing, have you done the know your baby quiz?  http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=52283.0  I found that dd2 was touchy for sleep, and that if I saw a yawn it was too late and she was already OT - we did quite a lot of clock-watching in the early days.  The other thing that it took me a while to work out that having a toddler running around is really stimulating - so dd2 would get very OS very easily and therefore her A times were shorter than average for a long time.

HTH.  Cx