back again....same problem!

[jay2yay]

I just can't seem to figure out what makes the beginning of our nights (BT until DF) so messed up!! Some nights are smooth sailing and I don't hear a peep, but I can't seem to figure out what makes those nights go that way, and most of our nights be complete chaos. Here was our EASY today

W and E 7:30
A 7:30-9:15 (1.75)
S 9:15-11 (1.75)

E 11
A 11-12:50 (1:50)
S 12:50-2:55 (2hr5m)

E 3
A 2:55-4:55 (2hr)
S 4:55-5:35 (CN)

A 5:35-6:35 (Bath, massage)
E 6:15
BT 6:35

Okay, so I always seem to either be misjudging his A time before CN or A time after CN. I think it's the one after b/c he will not go down for his CN before 2 hrs. I almost feel as if sometimes he wants to stay up longer than 2 hrs before the CN. During his feed after his bath around 6:15, he was droopy eyed, eyes rolling in the back of his head, etc. Does this mean he's ready to go to bed right after eating?? Because after he was done, he didn't seem ready enough for bed so we just sat and talked real low key. I picked him up and he started shoving his head into my chest and rubbing his eyes so I put him down about an hr from when he woke which is usually when he seems to be 'ready' to go down after CN. His eyes were drooping when I swaddled him which is always a good indicator (at least for naps) that I've timed it perfectly.

Sometimes he falls asleep immediately and then wakes within an hour and we have issues. But tonight he didn't even fall asleep. He didn't even really want his paci and just cried. Sometimes he mantra cries before falling off but it was a bad cry pretty quick. Nothing seem to help him, even APOP. He just wouldn't settle until finally falling off, which tonight was around 7:45, an hour and 15 minutes after putting him down. I was in his room for a lot of this time, shush/patting, etc.

Many many people on here say that wakings early in the night are OT or OS. Today I hardly put him under any toys and kept A time pretty low key. So it could be OT, but a little before he fell asleep he was just laying there making cooing noises! Does that mean UT?? I can't figure it out!!! 

[ZacsMumme]

Hun just throwing something else out there. Could the bedtime dramas be teething related? There is a developmental leap around this time too which wrecks havoc on sleep

Do you think his A times could be increased a little? Looks like he is getting lots of good sleep (I would have loved long naps at that age )

[*Liz*]

Have you tried a bit longer for the A after the CN? I know that OT is the most common cause of a restless early evening, but not all babies obey 'the rules'.

Both of mine would have needed a bit more A time during the day at this age

[jay2yay]

Zacsmum- You're not the first to make me think about this but if he's teething, he's not showing many signs besides the crying, I guess. Not really excessive amounts of drool, no white/puffy gums.....I could always just give him some tablets before bed since they're homeopathic and just see if it helps!

Liz- I feel like I have, but I didn't take notes so I can't remember if the results were the same    Before doing a 4 hr easy, he preferred 1.5 A time before CN and almost a full 2 hrs after. I guess I just felt like if he's already doing 2 hrs before the CN, that anymore more than an hr seemed like a long time? But, at this point I just need to try it b/c that's the only place I feel like I have the room for more A time. I definitely think I push to the max on his earlier A times, especially since his naps are so good. When he needs more A time, I get 45 minute naps.
 

[jay2yay]

Oh, and I meant to say that someone told me last night that the DF could be the cause for unsettled early evenings? She said she knew it sounded backwards but that's been the case for some people and that when she stopped the DF, her evenings went very smooth, but then she had the NW.

Last night, DS happened to wake ravenous around 9:45 so I fed him and didn't top him up at 11 or anything. He slept until his usual NW around 5 (another issue altogether) which I found interesting since that's when he wakes to feed even when I do his DF at 11.

[*Liz*]

I honestly don't see how a DF could give unsettled evenings, and I would say that it was a coincidence if someone else has found stopping it helped. DFs can certainly cause unsettled night sleep, but that is after the DF has occurred.

I am no DF expert though as I never did it with either of mine.

I think he needs more A after the CN really. I would increase to 1.5hrs (over a few days) and see if that helps at all.

[jay2yay]

We're making progress. Last night was another awful night...misjudged his A time before AND after CN. Tonight is much better. This may be silly of me to say but I've just figured out how to think about this! I looked back at Tracy's 4 hr easy example and saw that the time from the last feed until bedtime is about 4.5 hrs with a CN somewhere in between. WHY am I not getting this until now??
You were right, Liz, he most definitely wasn't tired enough. Today the last feed was at 3:40 and he did a 2HR A time, CN at 5:40 until 6:10. So I figured his BT would be anytime between 7:40 and 8:10 since that would be 4/4.5 hrs from his last feed. Sure enough, he really started showing signs at 7:40 so I put him down. He did wake a cry after 40 minutes (still a tad UT, u think?) but he went back to sleep  

[*Liz*]

How are you getting on???

[jay2yay]

Doing much better, thank you Liz.....I just try to keep the "4 hrs" in mind and base his A times around that and try to make his A time before CN at least 1hr45m. Sometimes he seems so tired during A after the CN but I find if I can hold him off, he does much better.

Happy Birthday to your Megan!