Sleep training - feed or not during NW?

[rimkat]

Hi everyone,
I wasn't sure which board to post this on, as there is probably more than one issue here - but here goes.
DD is just over 5 months old and we've finally started sleep training. I finally decided that I can no longer handle 30 minute naps during the day and not getting more than 3 consecutive hours of sleep at night. The first day (yesterday) went surprisingly well, but I still can't seem to get more than 3 hours of sleep at a time.

DD feeds every 3.5 hours during the day (she's breastfed). She gets her evening feed at around 7:30, and then I gave her a DF at around 11pm last night. She woke at 2:30am and I fed her. I'm guessing she took less than usual, but still a substantial amount I would say. Then she woke at 5am, at which point I didn't feed her, but did a modified version of PU/PD and shush pat until she finally fell asleep at around 6am, and then slept until 8am.

I've really been trying to increase her calories during the day, but am not sure how to do this without her "snacking". She sometimes takes a bit of formula, and sometimes refuses it so its really hit and miss. We started solids at 4 months, but then she suddenly began to refuse the cereal so we are taking a break from solids for now.

My main question, I guess, is whether I should be feeding her when she wakes at around 2-3am. I certainly don't want to leave her hungry, but I'm not sure she really needs that feed since last night, for instance, she went from 2:30-8am without eating, and has certainly done longer stretches before from time to time.

I know Tracy says that random wake up times are hunger driven (and her 2am feed is random since she wakes up anywhere from 1:30am to 3:30am, depending on when the DF is given and if its given at all), but I'm really not sure she needs to be eating every 3 hours at night at this age...

Any advice would be greatly appreciated

Thanks!

[rimkat]

Anyone? 

I also noticed that she has consistently been taking less at her 7am feed, often refusing the second breast altogether...

[rimkat]

This is approximately what our EASY has been looking like for the past few days:

EA: 7:30
S: 9:30-11:00
EA: 11:00
S: 1:15-2:15ish (we are still working on this nap, so it's always different lengths)
EA: 2:30
S: 4:30-5:10
EA: 6:00
Bath, and top off feed: 7:00 (asleep by 7:30)

Last night was actually a good night for us. I did a DF at 11:30 and she slept until 4:30, at which point I fed (only one side) and then she slept again until 7:00

I used to shush-pat her to sleep, but since I started the sleep training a few days ago she now goes down independently. I put her down awake and most of the time, she falls asleep within a couple of a minutes it (this is HUGE for us because during the first couple of months of her life she was rocked to sleep constantly due to colic). No dummy. She's still swaddled though (something I want to wean soon)...

[DSAN]

Oh man we are in the same boat! Short naps and 2-3 hourly wakings at night! Just the other day my DS (almost 7 mos) did a 5 hour stretch and it was amazing! Unfortunately it hasn't been repeated 

I used to feed him at every waking until I realized he was going longer in the day without feeds than he was a night! No good! Any way, so what I've been doing is resettling him in his bed (modified shh-pat) for most of the wakings, but if he doesn't settle easily (the first few nights were rough but he's settling in just a minute or two now) I feed him, usually anywhere between 2am and 4am. Which I think is reasonable (I do his DF at 9ish when I go to bed). And then (I know this is bad) I'll also feed him at his next waking and sometimes bring him to bed because I'm usually to tuckered out at that point to care any more (DH is away, and has been most of the summer)

I'm hoping my method works, and soon, because like you I'm done with it! Any way, just thought I'd share what we are doing.

And I'm guessing that both our LO's are a touch OT, causing the short naps and NW, but thats just a guess... maybe consider it

[JaspersMum]

Same boat here too! DD is 4 months. I think I have to attempt PU/PD but have a toddler in the house and don't want him disturbed by the crying.

[rimkat]

Thanks for taking a look!

Well I was thinking about that actually. The problem is that previously I would start our winddown routine at the 2 hour mark and that nap would end up being 35 mins and I would have to go in and extend. So that made the A time around 2h 10. So I was thinking OT and so I cut our A time a bit.  Now I begin winddown 10 minutes earlier and the nap is 1.5 h. However, this could also be the effect of the sleep training so it's hard to tell

Do you think this is somehow related to her NW?

Thanks

[rimkat]

Oh, and I hear you about the OT, DSAN. Its so hard because sometimes despite my best efforts she won't get good naps. Its slowly getting better though I think.

Yesterday was really weird actually because she skipped her CN altogether (never happened before). But she didn't seem cranky or tired the way she normally does. I thought that putting her to bed would be a disaster but she went down without a peep. She did however refuse to settle after her 3:30 feed and we had to do PU/PD for over an hour while she cried on and off (

I'm attributing this to the day 5 regression though

[rimkat]

So yesterday I gave her an additional 2 oz of formula before bed (she took it no problem, surprisingly) and, after her 11pm DF, she slept until 4:45! 5 hours of sleep for me! )
So now I'm convinced that her wakings are due to hunger. Hopefully adding some formula will help her sleep longer, but I don't really think I can decrease the amount she eats during her NF more than I already have. I started offering only one breast at the NF and I take her off as soon as her sucking slows down. But if I take her off any earlier, she starts to cry...

[Shiv52]

Just wanted to add that at 5 months it is totally normal to have a DF and a NF so I'd definately feed x

[rimkat]

I don't mind feeding at night, but I just think she should be going longer than 3-4 hours between feeds at night, since that's what she does during the day.

She woke up at 4:30 last night, after an 11pm DF, which I am totally fine with, since I got about 5 hours of sleep. I think the extra formula before bed is really helping. She was however harder to settle, which is I think due to tummy issues. We reintroduced cereal this week, so I think her digestive system may be adjusting to that.

I know this is off topic, but how long does it usually take for their tummies to adjust to solid foods?

Thanks again