Could my 9m old silly o'clock parties be a result of OT?? NEED HELP!!!!

[HenaV]

Today, DD has had 1h45m in the morning and 1h25m in the afternoon. She seemed more tired for the PM nap (unlike yesterday). She had to woken from both naps - though did wake happy both times. She was not in the least bit interested in her dinner (at 5.30pm) and was yawning at 5.50pm. Yet she is at the moment happily playing on her own which she would not usually do if she were tired - so yes I am confussed, and to be honest am dreading tonight... just the thought of another CP makes me want to tear my hair out!!

Any thoughts re: how I can tweak things (aside from extending her day?) Though to be honest, if that is really the only way to fix this, then I may have to deal with DH???

Thank you so much for you time and help, it is truely appreciated xxx

[ZacsMumme]

What was your EASY for the day hun? Really around this age their days do get kind of long You either get up early or have them up a bit later at night. Its temporary as once they hit the 2-1 teh days get back closer to 12hrs x

[LouiseV]

I just wanted to add something to remember here: when you increase her A times or make any changes try it for a few days before changing again. Even if she is showing signs of OT or yawning etc, it can be that he body clock is yet to reset itself and needs a bit more time to truly adjust. I've found that often I've given up on a new routine too quickly, if that makes sense? Even if you get a tricky night hold onto the plan for a little longer to let her try and adapt?

We had later BT too when M was on 2 sleeps but now that he's moved to one (at 12 months) he's down early again :-)

I only say this because you are soo close and she is obviously capable of STTN which is wonderful news

[HenaV]

Hi again, I did post our last 2 days EASY as you had asked - I think it got last becasue of my last minute post yesterday evening... sorry

Right our EASY for the last 2days:

Day 1:
Cry out@4.40am but other to that SSTN - woke self@6.15pm (was put to bed night before at 7.25pm and went off at 7.40pm (A time:3h40m with total DTS of 3h15m)

WU: 6.15am
7am - 7oz
8.30 - b/fast
9.30 - 11.15 - nap 1 (1h45m) - had to be woken but happy
(A time: 3h15m)

11.30 - 7oz
12.45 - lunch
2.30-4pm - nap 2 (1h30m) - had to be woken but happy
(A time: 3h15m)

4.10pm - 7oz
5.15pm - dinner but not interested
6.30pm - bath&BT routine
7pm - 7oz
BT - 7.45pm (put to bed@7.25, took 20m to go off)
(A time: 3h45m)

Total DTS: 3h15m

Day 2:
CP/NW@2.30 for appox 1h - nappy changed@3.30am(sometimes helps to resettle) - went back off about 3.40am. Cry out@5.30am but not wake - woken at 6.30am

WU - 6.30am
7am - 7oz
8.30 - B/fast but not interested
9.30-11.15 - nap 1 (1h45m) - tired went straight off. Had to be woken but happy
(A time:3h)

11.30am - 6oz
1.30 - Lunch (delayed because been out)
2.45-4.05 - nap 2 (1h20m) - not seem a bit tired at 3h15m A time, so kept up a bit longer. put to bed at 2.35pm&took 10m to go off. Had to be woken but happy
(A time: 3h30m)

4.15 - 7oz
5.30 - dinner
6.30pm - bath&BT routine
7pm - 7oz
BT - 7.35pm (put to bed@7.25)
(A time: 3h35m)

Total DTS: 3h5m

Last night - CP/NW@12.30am-1.45am. I went in&changed nappy about 1.30am. Cry out at 5.30am & woken at 6.30am.

The 5.30am cry outs sound almost like a single mantra cry. She doesn't sound as though she is awake though - it's just 1 cry out and then silence. I have gone in and woken her at 6.30am over the last 2days so as not to allow her to make up for the CP/NW - not sure if that is the right thing to do? She seems happy enough when I wake her, but can not go longer than 3h A time in the morning - this morning by 9.15am she was showing signs of being tired, so I put her to bed early - did wind down and put in cot for 9.20, she was off by 9.25. And no doubt I will have to wake her.

I find that she sometimes yawns with 1h30/45m of being up first thing and after nap 2, but i'm not sure whether she just needs a change of scenary. My DD tends to get v. fussy when she's tired. I have found, if I move her/do something different with her, she'll play just fine, so i've been thinking he yawning is perhaps a bit of boredem as opposed to being tired but I don;t know if I'm mis-reading her?

Re: doing BT 10m later - I don;t think I am going to be able to. DH is totally against her going to bed later - it's causes tension. It was bad enough when I pushed her BT back to 7.30pm from 7pm (as it has always been). But this is the guy who got up this morning and said, did Ruby SSTN last night!!!!!!

I agree, I too think that the CP/NW are due to UT as opposed to OT. Usually when she OT, she wakes and cries sometimes on the hour every hour but at the least frequently throught the night and she wakes grumpy

So what do you think - I am really at the point of having no clue! I feel like I have tweeked until I can tweek no more!!! Help!

So that was the 2 days you asked for. Yesterday was much the same in the day. I did manage to find myself 'running late' yesterday evening though and got DD to bed 10m later (at 7.40) she went off by 7.45 (A time 3h45m) AND SSTN! - so aybe extending her day is the only way ?

FYThansk Louise also for your input - I promise i di keep at thing for a few days - I have been tweeking, holding etc - for about 6wks now and yes, i'm tired. You're right thopughg, the fact she can STTN is fantastic and so i need to keep that in mind


So what do you think - is extedning her day the only way to cut the CP/NWs?

Thanks x

[ZacsMumme]

Louise is totally right, consistancy is key!
I know you say she struggles with a longer A in the morning and DH needs he in bed before its too late. So...I think you need to cap naps a bit more then, and make sure those as times are solid.

How about this for a week (assuming 6.30 WU)
A 3 hrs. After a week look at extending to 3hrs 15 mns if CP continue
Nap 9.30-11 cap at 1.5 hrs
A 3 hrs 15 mins OR if your brave enough 3.5 hrs.
Nap 2.15-3.45 cap a 1.5 hrs
A 3.5 hrs
BT 7.15

What do you think?

[HenaV]

Hey, that's great, thank you. I too this morning was thinking that i would need to cap the nap. I had another conversation with DH about a later BT (and without getting you into the domestics) it wasn't well received. So capping the nap seemed to me the way forward too.

The EASY you've suggested isn't that far from what I was thinking. Save for the morning, I think I DD mat stretch to 3h30m A time. So I thought I would try this for a week:

WU: 6.30am
A time: 3h
Nap 1 9.30-11am (1.5h)
A time:3.5h
Nap 2: 2.30-4pm (1.5h)
A time:3.5h
BT: 7.30

I agree totally with Louise, that consistency is the key. I guess when you're tired and feel like you can't work it out, it's not always easy to see that. So one week it is.

Just one question give DD has just woken from her PM nap after 40m and doesn't sound like she's going to go back off - is that likely to be because she was OT before she went to bed for her nap (after 3h30m) A time? That said, another thought it could just be becasue of teething, just happended to wake after 1 sleep cycle.

Should I perhaps go back to a 3h15m A time between nap 1 & 2 or carry on with 3h30m for a week and see what happens?

Also I imagine i will have to do EBT tonight to avoid OT, any suggestions re: what time I should aim for and should I stick with her usual routine of a bath etc before bed?

Thanks so much to both of you. I really appreciate all of your help and input.


H

[ZacsMumme]

I agree totally with Louise, that consistency is the key. I guess when you're tired and feel like you can't work it out, it's not always easy to see that. So one week it is.

I know, when its your own kid its so much harder to foolow through. I struggle when I need to change Z's routine too

Just one question give DD has just woken from her PM nap after 40m and doesn't sound like she's going to go back off - is that likely to be because she was OT before she went to bed for her nap (after 3h30m) A time? That said, another thought it could just be becasue of teething, just happended to wake after 1 sleep cycle.

could be OT or UT...but maybe OT. I guess you either need to stick with it and push through OR go for 3hrs15 between naps first for a week. Go with your gut

Also I imagine i will have to do EBT tonight to avoid OT, any suggestions re: what time I should aim for and should I stick with her usual routine of a bath etc before bed?

If you can get a CN in maybe try that,  but I suspect it will be a no go. I always did EBT at 6pm on terrible nap days. Yup usual routine but earlier. xx

[LouiseV]

Hey - and just so you know - you're not alone in having to work things around a DH. This has to work for all of your family. If he is absolute on not changing that for awhile then maybe the odd NW is the price you pay (and know that eventually that will get better)
It's always fun trying to juggle everyone's needs isnt it!?

All the best for this coming week's plan :-)

[HenaV]

Thanks so much Louise for that. It does sometimes feel like an up hill battle and you end up feeling a bit alone trying to fix thing BUT it's about all of us as you say!

So far this week consistency has worked a treat  We've had just one NW. The only thing I have had to tweak is the A time - DD started resisting Nap 1 even after 3h15m, so we have upped the A time to 3h30m between each sleep with a 1h30m nap in the morning and a 1h20m nap (so as to keep BT on track) in the afternoon. I have stuck with it!!!

I'll come back and let you guys know how we are getting on.

Thank you again for your advice and support xxx

[ZacsMumme]

Soundalike great progress Hun x

[HenaV]

Thanks! Just one Q - you said your if your DS had a bad nap day you put him to bed at 6pm - do you find he STTN? And does he then wake earlier the next day?

Thanks

[ZacsMumme]

My LO would EW no matter what so usual BT of 7 he would EW at 5.30 but if I PD for EBT to prevent too much OT he would tack on so still wake at 5.30. So he had more sleep KWIM?

Not all LOs do this, but it's a good thing to try as a LO do, and it's good to have as an option during nap cutting

He would have less NW if he wasn't OT too, at around 11 months the EW kind of resolved itself with the 2-1 x

[HenaV]

Hi, me again!!

Just wanted to check in and update really. I am keeping my fingers crossed that I don't jinx things as I posting this.... DD has been consistently SSTN for the last week and half or so.... YAY!!! We work with a 3h45m A time before the 1st nap and 3h30m between each sleep thereafter. We've also dropped teh 11am bottle, making it a lot easier to fit the day in. On the whole she has a 1h30m nap in the morining and 1h20m nap in the afternoon. I usually have to wake her from both, but she wakes happy!

Thank you so much guys for all you love, advice, support AND patience xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[ZacsMumme]

Sounds great! Good work.
If you find over the next few months your nights get shorter or the day too long - Or NW come back then you are likely to be hitting the 2-1 and you will need to cap 1 of those naps more

[HenaV]

Thanks for that. Your help abs advice is really appreciated. You will be missed x