How does shh/pat or PU/PD extend sleep?

[bethg]

On page 44 of the "Solves All Your Problems" book, when describing how to implement EASY for the first time, Tracy says "If she wakes up earlier, go back in and do PU/PD.  You might think this is crazy... you might have to spend 40 minutes getting her back to sleep and then she has only 10 minutes left.  Trust me: you're changing her routine and this is how you do it."

We are on the fourth day of doing EASY (see below), and our 4mo old DD is falling asleep in her crib well but is still waking up early.  Every day, we have ended up doing shh/pat or PU/PD from 5:30-7am, from 10-11am and from 2-3pm.  When she wakes up early, I try to shh/pat her back to sleep.  She seems not tired anymore and ends up getting frustrated that I'm not taking her out of the crib.  Then she starts crying, then I do PU/PD, but she's just aggravated instead of tired and we do that until the next time that she is supposed to eat.  I don't understand how that teaches her to sleep longer.  We make her stay up until the next nap time to maintain the routine, but since she had woken up early, she can end up being awake for 3+ hours is very tired all the time.

Does anyone have any insight on how shh/pat or PU/PD is supposed to change her routine?  How long should it take?  What are we doing wrong?

This is our EASY:
E 7am
A 7:30
S 9 (usually wakes up at 10)
E 11am
A 11:15
S 12:30 or 1pm
E 3pm
A 3:15
S 5 (she is always tired at 5, but doesn't always sleep when we put her down.  If she doesn't sleep, we just leave her in the crib for about 30-40 minutes as long as she's not crying)
Bath 6pm
E 6:30
A 6:45
S 7pm (if she didn't sleep for the cat nap, she is really tired by now and we back up bedtime to 6/6:30)
DF 10/10:30pm

[numa]

I have had the same question whether nap extending just helps them sleep more for that particular nap or actually helps them to learn to transition on their own. 

I have always had a early waking DS.  At one point someone told me or I read some where that with early waking sh/pat is not recommended.  Maybe one the of experts will comment on that......

[*Kara*]

There is a tonne of info about shushpat and PUPD and the how/when/what stuff in the PUPD FAQ's

http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?board=89.0

[vadensmommy]

Pat/shh and pu/pd are methods to teaching independent sleep.  You say your lo is falling asleep in her crib - are you doing pat/shh and/or pu/pd during the initial falling asleep as well?

I have to say that when we've used pat/shh with DD#2, I always set a limit on how long we are going to do it.  If she's not showing tired signs within 20min or so, then I get her up and we continue on with A time if needed.

Pat/shh and pu/pd are used to "extend" naps for a baby who is waking early because they don't know how to self soothe through the sleep cycle transitions.  It is not going to work on a baby who has gotten a good nap, and is no longer tired (since the goal of pat/shh and pu/pd is to help a baby go to sleep), and it is not going to work on a baby who has another need that is not met that is keeping them from sleeping such as hunger.

Has your lo been sleeping through the night prior to starting EASY?  Is she hungry at the 5:30am wake up?

EASY is not a strict schedule that you have to keep - it is a routine or an order on how activities should occur, so if there is some A time before the next E, and your baby is happy and content and well rested, then that is perfectly ok!  If a feeding needs to be earlier or a nap earlier than normal because that is the type of cues she is showing you, then you follow her cues.  So if she woke early from one nap, then you can always feed her at the appointed time, or whenever she shows hunger signals, and then a very short A time and go ahead and try for another nap.  Sometimes EASY looks more like EASAE, and that's ok, because they older a baby gets, the more their routine is going to look like this naturally because they don't nap as long.

A times for a 4mo are typically right at 2hrs, but if your baby is 4.5mo or more, it may be that she needs more A time in order to take a good nap.  Your routine looks pretty good based on a typical 4mo old.

Just some thoughts!  Hope that helps!

[bethg]

Thanks, vadensmommy, for clarification on when to use sh/pat or pu/pd.  Before starting EASY, LO was usually waking up between 430 and 530am.  I was feeding her, but she usually did not take a whole bottle.  After reading Tracy's book, I thought that since she was waking up at the same time each day that it was a habit and not hunger and I had gotten her hooked on falling back asleep on the bottle.  Since starting EASY, she put herself back to sleep one day at 530am.  Another day, my husband spent an hour sh/patting until breakfast time and she never cried.  So, we think that she's not hungry.  She goes to sleep in the crib on her own w/o sh/pat.  We just can't figure out how to get her back to sleep after a diaper change at 530am. 

[vadensmommy]

So when your lo wakes up btwn 4:30-5:30am, is she crying??  You said your husband did pat/shh for an hour, but she never cried?  You don't use pat/shh unless your lo is crying, so that you aren't leaving them to cio.  If she isn't crying, then you would leave her alone to figure it out herself, and would only go to her once she started crying.  Sorry if I am misunderstanding, but wanted to clarify that.

For whatever reason, I do remember sometime between 4-5mo, my first daughter would wake up really early, and talk and chat to herself for a while, sometimes up to an hour!!  She usually went back to sleep on her own until her normal wake up time around 7am.  Sometimes around this age, an EW is developmental, and not something you can always "correct" iykwim?

I would also be tempted to try w2s at the EW if you haven't already.  Maybe try it around 4am, and see if that helps anything.  More on W2S here:
http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=213387.0