Waking up every 2 hours

[Lollipop86]

Thank you, I see what kind of fan you meant

Update:
*yesterday she popped right before bath time - a lot. She started pooing every 2 days before the illness but I think she isn't used to it just yet.
*she ate 150 ml of rice cereal and was BF before BT at 7.30 and she woke up at 9.
*I tried to masage her gums with a gel but wasn't helping - at 10 she woke up again and gradually started screaming as if: "I don't want you to put me down again!" I did it anyway and when she woke up after 5 minutes (if she was even sleeping) I BF and after that she slept till 2am.
*BF again at 4.15 and 7.05 am when she woke up.
*she got fussy at 8.15 and I tried everything, including BF at 8.50 but I put her down at 9.00 am - she fell asleep at 9.15 ; it's funny in the morning she gets tired so quickly and in the afternoon she sometimes skips the catnap or refuses it and is up a bit longer and doesn't showw signs of OT...

This is improvement after last few nights so I hope it doesn't go bad again! And I still don't know what is waking her up. We will try humidifier now and see how that works.

P.S.: I have to say I just love this spell check!     

[katie80]

P.S.: I have to say I just love this spell check!     

Ok, I didn't realize you were giving rice cereal.  That can really be a source of constipation and discomfort for the digestive system.  Tracy recommended to start with some easy to digest fruits/veggies when you begin solids, so as not to cause issues.  Things like pears, sweet potatoes, and squash.  You might try switching that up to see if it makes a difference in the NWs. 

It does sound like things are improving, so that's good.  It's also pretty normal to have a shorter A time first thing in the morning, but it could be due to the NWs as well.  You just don't want it too short that she's not getting a restorative nap even if she's seeming tired early.

Hope you're getting back on track!

[Lollipop86]

Ok, I didn't realize you were giving rice cereal.  That can really be a source of constipation and discomfort for the digestive system.  Tracy recommended to start with some easy to digest fruits/veggies when you begin solids, so as not to cause issues.  Things like pears, sweet potatoes, and squash.  You might try switching that up to see if it makes a difference in the NWs.

I am giving her vegetables for lunch (12-1pm) and rice cereal at about 6pm. Maybe she ate rice cereal too much yesterday (almost 200 ml) as she was waking up tonight every hour! I was so tired that I just BF... but even after BF she couldn't go back to sleep. It was quite horrible! But she is not constipated anymore as she was pooing now every day for 3 days.

She is so angry now everytime she wakes up! I know she is a spirited child but she wasn't like that till now. She arches her back if I pick her up, ssh/pat doesn't work because she twists her legs, booty, head left and right... She closes her mouth so I can't put the dummy in. And she cries loudly. I can see this even when I clean her nose - she was used to it but now she refuses it very much. Maybe it's developmental??

Oh, and I forgot to write that she id 5,5 months now.

[katie80]

Even though she's not constipated anymore, I wonder if her tummy is uncomfortable.  That's a lot of solids for a LO just starting out.  I think there's definitely a correlation between that and the NWs.  What you're describing sounds like she's in discomfort.  She really only needs one solid meal per day to start with (solids are just for fun in the beginning and milk should be the main source of nutrition until 10-12mo) and it's a good idea to do it at lunch.  If you really want to give a second meal, I'd give it in the morning.  It's best to let them digest the new foods early in the day so as not to disrupt night sleep.

[Erin M]

Just to echo what Katie said, I'd try dropping the solids at dinnertime for now and see if it helps.

[Lollipop86]

Thank you 

[Erin M]

[Lollipop86]

I'm getting totally frustrated now! My DD is super extra sensitive child. Even the slitest mistake with her schedule means a catastrophe. I don't know even where we did wrong on Saturday but we got into ut/ot cycle. We are trying to get out but it's hard work. Well we are getting a lot of sleep into her - yesterday she had 3 naps; 2.10, 45 mins and 1.45. I think this is ok, but the nights are getting worse by the day! Now she is waking up every 1.5 hours and sometimes every 45 mins. Sometimes I ssh/pat her or BF her but it lasts only 15 mins and then she wakes up again. Or my husband pu/pd and then ssh/pats and by the time he gets to his bed she wakes up again - she slept for 5 mins before.
I'm so tired that I don't even remember in the morning what happened at night. I want to leave her with someone for one night so I could sleep!
I have ruled out teething, tummy, solids, illness, humidity is around 50% at night and she is still shouting when we put her down. Even at morning nap where she almost fell asleep by herself before. The A time is 2 hours almost every time and sometimes even to get there we have to distract her.
Oh and I got my first period now but I don't think it has to do anything with it - she BF normally.

Please I need some advice on the whole schedule and methods - getting out of ut/ot cycle, A time, how to soothe her (is pu/pd still OK and how long can I hold her - is it OK that even if she arches her back I hold her firmly so that she calms down or I have to PD and deal with shouting and do that 100 times?)

Our approximate easy:
A 7.50
E 8.10
S 10
E 11.30
solids 12.30
S 13.30-14
E 15.30 - 16
catnap between 17 and 18 approx. 45 mins or sometimes we skip it and have BT earlier
BT 19.30-20.30

I would like to know when do you think babies should be in their own room. Is that individual? What about in our case? Oh and what is best to do when she starts to talk and swing around in her bed - continue ssh/pat or leave her and wait for her to start crying for help?

I'm sorry that I bother you so much!! But we are really having a hard time again... and my search engine doesn't work so I can't find what I would like to know in so many posts.

[katie80]

I'm sorry that I bother you so much!! But we are really having a hard time again...

No worries... that's why we're here!

Oh and I got my first period now but I don't think it has to do anything with it - she BF normally.

Erin might be able to give you a little more info on this, but I definitely experienced a bit of a drop in supply the first time I got my period both times I BFd.  With DS, I noticed it a few more times throughout the duration (probably because I was just more aware).  I don't think that's why she's waking so often at night, but just wanted you to know it can happen.

how to soothe her (is pu/pd still OK and how long can I hold her - is it OK that even if she arches her back I hold her firmly so that she calms down or I have to PD and deal with shouting and do that 100 times?

Is she not responding to shh/pat?  Yes, PUPD is fine, but if she's arching her back, Tracy recommended to put her down and try to soothe in the crib and then pick up again if needed.  It's possible that if you're holding her firmly and long enough to get her calm, you might be holding her too long and she's using you to calm down rather than doing it herself.  I'd try to settle her in the crib as much as possible.

E 11.30
solids 12.30
S 13.30-14

I think this is where the problem is with the routine.  If she's sleeping from 10-11:30 in the morning, she's likely not had enough A time when you put her down at 13:30.  At 5.5-6mo, she can go more like 2.25-2.5hr there I would think.  With that second short nap, I'd have given the CN much earlier, like 16:00, so she can do a longer nap there and make it to a decent BT.  As you have it written, she was likely OT at BT.

I would like to know when do you think babies should be in their own room. Is that individual? What about in our case?

Yep, I think it depends on each baby.  I believe the recommendation in terms of SIDS now is to keep them in your room til 6mo.  Both of mine were in their own room at 3-4mo, because they started to outgrow the bassinet and the baby room was right next door to ours, only about 10 steps farther away.  I know some babies that have slept in their parents' room for much longer, because that's what their circumstances allow.  I have a friend on here with her 17mo old still in their room and if he wakes in the night all she needs to do is say her sleepy phrase and he'll go back to sleep.  I have a friend IRL with her 16mo old still in their room, but she is not a BWer, so she either feeds him if he wakes or rocks him back to sleep.  If you think you are disrupting her sleep, then it's worth a try putting her in a different room.  I would definitely get something to use as white noise in either case.

HTH!!

[Erin M]

Quote from: Lollipop86 on Today at 04:39:22 AM
Oh and I got my first period now but I don't think it has to do anything with it - she BF normally.
Erin might be able to give you a little more info on this, but I definitely experienced a bit of a drop in supply the first time I got my period both times I BFd.  With DS, I noticed it a few more times throughout the duration (probably because I was just more aware).  I don't think that's why she's waking so often at night, but just wanted you to know it can happen.

Katie's right about that -- some ladies find their LO's notice a slight change in the taste of the milk (which they eventually get used to), some ladies experience a dip in supply -- if you're not getting enough calcium, that can affect your supply -- there's some good info on that here:
http://kellymom.com/bf/can-i-breastfeed/herbs/natural-treatments/#calcium

[Lollipop86]

Quote from: Lollipop86 on Yesterday at 09:39:22

    E 11.30
    solids 12.30
    S 13.30-14

I think this is where the problem is with the routine.  If she's sleeping from 10-11:30 in the morning, she's likely not had enough A time when you put her down at 13:30.  At 5.5-6mo, she can go more like 2.25-2.5hr there I would think.  With that second short nap, I'd have given the CN much earlier, like 16:00, so she can do a longer nap there and make it to a decent BT.  As you have it written, she was likely OT at BT.

Oh, I think there was a misunderstanding. She doesn't sleep 13.30-14 but I put her down between those hours and then she sleeps till let's say 15.30. So the CN cannot be at 16 yet
Well I know she has short A time sometimes but she gets so fussy and even if I try to sing or play with her it doesn't help so I rather put her down because I fear that she will become OT again... She doesn't usually have other signs like yawning or rubbing her eyes. She is just fussy. So it's hard to know sometimes what it is... If I start settle her after 2hr and she falls asleep after 20 Min's - this counts as 2.20 A time, right?
I have noticed that if I BF her again after 1,5 hours that she "restarts" and is ok again and then she can go on for 2,5 hours. Maybe it is the milk.. she BFs so weird since our illness I think - after 5-6 mins she gets off and wants to sit and then straight back on, and she does this 3-5 times. If I let her And a few days ago I tried to pump some milk for her solids and I pumped out only 50 ml from both sides. OK I know I+m not used to pumping and that it was quite soon after BF but maybe I don't have that much milk anymore. I notice that my fast letdown isn't there anymore on R breast.

Here's how settling went this time:
*put her in bed after 2.20
*she started talking and squealing
*I left her to "call for help"
*when she did I came back and she started talking again and looking around
*I left her again and came back when she was crying again
*PU/PD
*when I PD she went on her hands and knees (which es me off the most), crying - at this point ssh/pat doesn't work
*PU/PD about 5 times
*trying to unlock her arms so she would lie down - which resulted on more crying (the kind that leaves spasms - I don't know how you name it)
*PU/PD about 5 times until she gave up, lied down and did not go back up when I put my hand over her eyes
*she fell asleep after 2.50hrs

What am I doing wrong here - I really want to know - please correct me.   

[katie80]

Oh, I think there was a misunderstanding. She doesn't sleep 13.30-14 but I put her down between those hours and then she sleeps till let's say 15.30. So the CN cannot be at 16 yet

Ok, sorry I misunderstood. It sounds like your routine is just fine then.  You're getting two good naps and a CN, which is right on for 5.5mo.

If I start settle her after 2hr and she falls asleep after 20 Min's - this counts as 2.20 A time, right?

Yep!   That's pretty average for 5.5mo.

I have noticed that if I BF her again after 1,5 hours that she "restarts" and is ok again and then she can go on for 2,5 hours. Maybe it is the milk.. she BFs so weird since our illness I think - after 5-6 mins she gets off and wants to sit and then straight back on, and she does this 3-5 times. If I let her And a few days ago I tried to pump some milk for her solids and I pumped out only 50 ml from both sides. OK I know I+m not used to pumping and that it was quite soon after BF but maybe I don't have that much milk anymore. I notice that my fast letdown isn't there anymore on R breast.

Hmmm, I'll let Erin chime in on this as well, but I wonder if with the illness and now your period you need to increase feeds a bit to get your supply back up.  It's quite normal for them to be a bit distracted at this age, that may be why she's popping on and off.  I wouldn't let the pumping part bother you... it is often not a good indicator of what you're actually producing.  What about doing a top-up feed 1hr after the regular feed each time (this is where you'll eventually add in solids), to help increase your supply and also keep her well fed throughout the day?

What am I doing wrong here - I really want to know - please correct me.

(((Hugs))), it sounds like she's going through some developmental stuff with her getting up on her hands and knees and such.  Unfortunately, there's not much you can do about that, but ride it out.  Also, maybe you pushed the A time a bit too much there if you have normally been putting her down at around 2hr and having her fall asleep closer to 2:15-2:20, so she had a bit of a second wind.  Do you try shh/pat when you first go back into her?  Do you think PUPD could be stimulating her too much?

[Erin M]

Re the BFing -- it's totally normal to not be able to pump as much after the 3/4 month mark, especially if you're not doing it regularly.  If you think she's discouraged by a slower flow, you can try some breast compressions to keep her interested (Breast compression).  If she's nursing for a good 5-6 minutes on each side, that could very well be all she needs.  If you're concerned about supply, having her go back to each breast again will help stimulate supply, but if you feel like it's more like a game she's playing, then I'd just cut the feed off.

[Lollipop86]

It sounds like your routine is just fine then.

Unfortunately, there's not much you can do about that, but ride it out.

I'm glad to read that. I'm really trying... to do  it right and to read her.

What about doing a top-up feed 1hr after the regular feed each time (this is where you'll eventually add in solids), to help increase your supply and also keep her well fed throughout the day?

Good idea, I'll try that. 

Well I think we are slowly getting back on track - at least with A time and settling to sleep. I put her down now after 2.10hrs and she fell asleep with ssh/pat in 3 minutes! Yeey!  And as for pumping - I know it's not an indicator so I'm not concerned... I'm really not doing it everytime - I use water from cooking and it's fine.
I use breast compressions sometimes and I think it works, yes. But I'm BF only on one side each time. It was OK till now. I'll see what happens after top-up feeds.

The night wake-ups are still frequent and I try to deal with them with BF and settling. I have no explanation for them and I'm sure they will disappear eventually... (I think they will stay for some time - teething and crawling will appear...) I hope after 6 months at least

I have learned a great deal now (and I'm sure I'll do it more) - from the book, your suggestions and help, and from other posts. THANK YOU ALL AGAIN

[katie80]

But I'm BF only on one side each time. It was OK till now. I'll see what happens after top-up feeds.

I'd actually start offering both sides at the initial feed first, you may not need to do a top up then.  Both of mine started feeding from both sides around 3-4mo, when they hit a growth spurt and then continued that way. 

And, you're welcome!