2-1 mess, waking early early EBT doesn't work.

[Skadiver13]

Hi all, I was told to post here now that Mr Liam just turned 1 on Friday. YAY  They thought I might get more eyes on.  We've been in the throes of 2-1 since 10 months. He's always been high A times, low sleep needs. We have always been 30-60min higher than average and I've accepted that 10.5hr is his norm not OT (at least I hope he's just not perpetually ot). Lately I've been doing one nap but I thought I would put in the occasional short AM/long pm nap to help combat OT. We aren't (fingers crossed for even putting this out into the Cosmos.) getting any NW, but we are getting the 10.5hr/11hr night. What we've been shooting for is

W: 6
S:11-1/1:30
BT: 6:30

We've been getting good 2/2.5hr naps but he was still waking at 4:45/5/5:30 depending on when he goes to sleep because he's only doing 10.5/11hrs. So to see if he was OT I did a short Am/Long PM nap on monday to help catch up if it was OT. That backfired When I was doing it every day it was A3.5 S:30min; A2.5 S: 1.5-2 BT about 4.5hrs later. So that's what I did. So on Monday, Short 30min cn woke him and he was happy. But DH slammed a door really loud during the long nap and woke him at 55min. I was able to get him back to sleep by rocking for another 30min. Since he'd been up since 6:30 I did a BT of 6 (ended up being 6:30 due to unforseen issues) so thinking slightly EBT to combat the bad nap. He slept till 5:58 I was happy with that. So wake up of 6 tried Early AM nap did 30min. Then woke from his PM nap at 40min crying. I couldn't get him back to sleep so I did another EBT of 5:30. Woke this morning at 4:45. So not a bad night but WAY to early waking. I tried for 40min to apop but to no avail. If he's not tired no amount of rocking is going to get him back to sleep. SO.... I was in a pickle today. So I figured what the heck do a catch up day. First nap didn't want it to be too early so did 9:40 almost 5hr A which he does on a one nap day. Did 1.5hrs but woke up crying? So put him down after 4.5hrs woke after 35min crying. Was able to apop another 20min till 4:30. So I'm going to do BT at 6:30? I know that it's an extremely long day but EBT isn't an option so since he's already OT I might as well push for a slightly later BT and hope to get a later wakeup? Or it could all backfire on me.. I was going to do 7 but with the bad afternoon nap didn't want to push my luck.


OK so after all that rambling I need to figure out what to do. His Birthday party is sat, family arrives tomorrow for a week, then he goes off on vacation with DH for a week so set BT/nap time is not an option until after the first week of June, I think that might be what I do for my own sanity when they return.  He seemed to do ok on one nap but was doing early mornings and I couldn't get that BT pushed back so I wanted to see if anyone has any advice on how to get out of the EBT/EW rut we are in. The 15min incrememtns wont work becuase it's not as if his routine is set, his wakeups/naps/bt's are all over the place as of the last couple days. 

HELP!

[anna*]

Woah, that is a lot to take in! With all the disruption coming up I daresay that consistency is going to be pretty hard to achieve so I would just wing it until Liam gets back from his trip with Daddy and then try set naps and bedtime. I'm sure the answer is yes but is his bedroom TOTALLY dark? Mornings are so light so early right now. Sure it's not teeth waking him? Has he got white noise playing in there so nothing external will wake him?

[Skadiver13]

I guess winging it isn't working. He's so OT. Couldn't get him to sleep till 7:30 last night. Its 5:30 and he's rolling around awake in his crib. No idea if it's teeth but he's never crying and he doesn't wake in the night due to teeth. Can't do dream needs as he wakes. Yes to the white house. But no his room is not pitch black but never had been. There are darkening curtains up but we have to put the a/c unit in anyway which adds light and there is nothing I can do about that.

I know is a lot of info but really I just need him to get through this weekend and not be a complete mess. I feel like I messed up with everything.

[anna*]

Can you add foil or cardboard around the window to block out the light? Even my kids who aren't prone to EW will definitely wake early at this time of year because the light wakes them (unless we have the black out up). I know you can't get every single chink of light but it might be worth the effort.

Really sorry not to have any magic answers - but I gues syou know already that there aren't any!

[Skadiver13]

Ive blocked out all the light I can, this has been going on long before the light. I know there arent any magic answers just looking for some bdtd advice on how to get back on track.

We're both exhausted and he is such a happy boy even hes sleeping well.

[anna*]

The light and teeth are definitely confounding factors - my little girl has NO other teething symptoms and is happy as a clam all day but she will wake early with them.

Have you tried pushing the nap out later? Really not sure what else to suggest, and I know that's tricky to do when he's sensitive to OT>

[anna*]

Couple more questions - what happens at 5am, do you get him up and start your day?

Also, in your first post you say that 10.5hrs is his usual night (not OT), but in your 'shooting for' routine you've got an 11.5hr night. If 10.5hrs is a normal night for him, and he's not one to tack on, then there's really no option but to keep pushing that nap a little later (hoping for a nice long one) and for a later bedtime, and accept that some OT is goign to be pretty much inevitable until he sort of 'grows into' this routine. Trouble is, with a 10.5hr night as normal and a 13.5hr day, he's going to have to be able to manage long-ish A times AND pull a long nap to get through it. So like 2 x 5.5hr A times and a 2.5hr nap.

Does he EVER tack on over night - or is it a complete no-no? How early have you done bedtime?

[Buttonbobs]

Just a thought - perhaps the switching between one and two nap days isn't working for him. I know with my E she was more messed up by switching between than just going for one nap and expecting a bit of OT in the medium term. I agree with Anna, perhaps try pushing out for just one nap?

[Skadiver13]

I leave him until he starts whining usually about 30min to see if he'll go back to sleep. Then I go in and try to apop him back to sleep. Its not working. So then we get up. Sometime its 5:45 sometimes it after 6 but i never just get him up and start the day. I'm shooting for 11.5 because I know thats normal but I'd settle for 10.5. He never tacks. Only 2 times in his life did it work. With wakeups at 5am ebt would be like 4pm thats just not going to work? He'll still take a 2hr nap so ebt doesnt seem to work as he's had enough day sleepm does i thought ebt was reserved if he has a bad nap. He cant handle 5.5hrs yet. He did 5 yesterday and took a 2hr nap. The short am/long pm wasnt working. So yesterday i went back to and  I did the long am short pm. My day was
W5:30
S:10:30-12:30. He woke at noon b ut resettled himself.
CN: 4:10-4:30 i rocked him and he let me.
S:7 (fell asleep finally 7:15)

However he woke at 2 SS
Woke at 4:55 rolled around for 10min seemed to have SS not sure how long he'll sleeep, will come back and let you know. . Long day but trying to push the wakeup to at least 6 so i can start pushing the nap out.

I will try and fully cover his windows to see if i can block all light but i dont think its that, and with the a/c in the window i cant block out the vents so there will always be light coming in. It could be teethijng but even if it is i cant give meds everyday anyway, and i wouldnt think it would be everyday?

I agree he needs one nap but i think with all the turmoil of visitors and the travel next week its going to have to wait till we colme back then I'll go to set naps/bt maybe? I just want him to sleep sko that hes not a little tired monster for his party tomorrow you know?

[anna*]

At the EW do you think he'd be easier to APOP back to sleep if you didn't leave him to try to resettle? I mean I know it'sn ot optimum but at 5am he's had quite a bit of sleep and might just think he's not tired if he is fully awake. kwim? I agree if he doesn't tack then you can't really do an early bedtime, not if he's awake at5am. That way your day just creeps earlier. I agree I think you just have to APOP catnapsand do what you have to to get through until you can do set naps/bt.

[Skadiver13]

Thanks. He slept till 6 so that's good. 10.5 hrs. Napped 11-1:10. I'm.apoping a cn now from 4:40-5. BT hopeully 7;15/7;30.

[Skadiver13]

As for apoping and going in earlier, not really. There is a better chance and this point he'll SS, then apoping working. I can apop a cn but the am has gotten hard and he screams and kicks most of the time and its just really not a great way to start the day, I'd rather just not put us through it.

[Skadiver13]

Ok not sure what to think Sat he woke at 6, 10.5 hr night. Put him down at 11, woke at 12:15 crying Rocked him back easily for another 45 min. He did not get a 2nd cn bevaise we had his party. But he did so well and was asleep at 7:10. Woke 5:45 left in crib till 6. Put down at 10:45, out like a light. No nw even after a 6hr a before BT. Woke up from nap at 45 nun but ss, woke again 15 min later crying. I'm rocking now. He hasn't done this in ages. It's not teeth gave need both days. He pioped this moening so dont think its tummy troubles. Any ideas?

[Skadiver13]

Anyone? Today he woke at 5:45 after BT of 7:30

[anna*]

I'm really sorry I just don't know what to suggest. If it's not teeth and not the light, if he doesn't tack over night and won't be APOPed, then really there's nothing you can do but try and get through the next few weeks until he sort of grows into his A times, yk?