How to stop frequent night visits from 3.5 year old?

[FroggyMom]

Well, DS was in his bed at 7:30 pm, but he had more trouble falling asleep tonight than last night.  Do you think 5.5 hours awake time wasn't long enough?  I decided to put an air mattress on the floor in his room for a few days and see what happens.  When I told him I was going to do this, he smiled really big, gave me a hug, and said, "I love that!"  Sweet baby...he is just so stressed about being alone in his room for some reason right now.  I tried to stay in his room until he fell asleep. but he was still awake after 30 minutes.  I did notice him looking over to make sure I was still there a few times, but he stayed in his bed.  Then, I had to leave his room to eat my dinner and get a few things done at 8 pm.  He was drowsy but still awake.  He came out of his room a few times quickly, but then he was able to go to sleep.

Shiv, I did do a little project before bed.  DH, DS and I made cards for each other to keep by our beds!  DS was very excited about his card that I made him.  I made him a picture and wrote about how much I loved him and would always be there for him and protect him.  He smiled and was so excited about his card!  So sweet!  Great idea!    I do think his card helped him to finally stay in his room that last time.  I also decided to take away iPad and turn off TV an hour before bedtime and put on classical music while we made card and played board games.  DS LOVED the music and asked to keep it on awhile longer.  I am going to make this music/no electronics/together play time a part of our nightly before bedtime routine. 

I have not yet thought of something of mine to give him to snuggle with in bed.  I mentioned the idea to him, and he seemed excited about it.  So, I need to come up with something.

FM  - it can take awhile to adjust to no nap. you could try a nap every other day or something like that?

Yes, I think I may try this.  Do you suggest capping the nap at an hour?  I've never capped DS's naps before.  Also, I know some people say they still do a "quiet time" when the child is no longer napping.  Does anyone do this?  If so, what does it look like?

Heather, I did not know there was a BW for Toddlers.  I may have to get that!  What you mentioned by sleeping outside DS's room sounds like what I've decided to try.  However, I am actually starting out in his room.  The hallway outside his door is very tiny and not much room there to sleep.  He did look over at me and stay in bed a few times though.  I would love to hear more about the sleep rules you implemented.  You can even PM me if you want!  I don't think there is anything medical going on with DS.  I have noticed in the past he can stay sniffly for awhile so I thought he may have some mild allergies.  But, I haven't noticed anything of the sort lately.  I will keep an eye out though.

As I was typing this, DS came out once and said his blanket was messed up and needed to be fixed.  I took him back, and he came right back out to use the potty.  DH took him to potty and back to his room and told him I would be in to sleep with him soon, and he stayed in his room....for now...

[michaeljacknnugg]

Aww, FM - your boy sounds so sweet! Fx for a good night for you.

[FroggyMom]

Aww, FM - your boy sounds so sweet! Fx for a good night for you.

Thank you!

Well, DS stayed in his room for the rest of the night...but only because I slept on his floor.  He did get out of bed once and start to the door, and I asked what he was doing and told him to get back in bed...he did.  I covered him back up, and he went right back to sleep.  I woke up with my back hurting and DH is going to sleep in there tonight, but at least we all got some much needed rest.

I thought about doing a no nap day today since he did a 1 hour capped nap yesterday, but he was rubbing his eyes during lunch.  I asked if he was tired, and he said he was.  So, I took him to nap around 1 pm and was going to let him sleep an hour like yesterday.  He fought me for 30 minutes and came out of his room REPEATEDLY trying to use every trick in the book!  I'm disappointed in myself bc I let his behavior get the best of me and got angry.  He finally just fell asleep at 1:45 pm. 

Now, I don't know what to do....still let him sleep an hour and push BT back?  wake him up in less than an hour? 

I do know I need a break during the middle of the day or I just can't function.  I have heard some of my friends say their kids still do a quiet time in place of nap each day.  Do any of you do this?  What do you do if so?  Thanks!

[Shiv52]

I'd have likely done 45 minutes then push bedtime out.  What did you end up doing? 

I do know I need a break during the middle of the day or I just can't function.  I have heard some of my friends say their kids still do a quiet time in place of nap each day.  Do any of you do this?  What do you do if so?  Thanks!

Honestly Hun it is better to have a longer consolidated nights sleep than a nap and a rubbish night. YK?  I had to stop my 2yos nap before 2.5 at we were having ridiculous bedtime nonsense. I was loathed to lose my middle of the day time but the nap had to go. She has quiet time watching a show after lunch. Other people do books on cd or just quiet play.

If he's getting into the habit of fighting his nap especially for so long I'd go for it and drop the nap. Maybe do a few no nap days then you may need a nap day.

I'd make sure you are telling him you are only on his floor for x days so you can help him know his room is safe and then after that you are going back to your bed.  Just so it's not a shock when you move back to your own room!

[nona]

it is so confusing to know when to cap nap or get rid of it completely. maybe try for a week of naps now and then and see what happens? he is 3.5 right? at that age he can probably do w/o the nap but it will take some time adjusting.

we did about every other night when DS was that age. he was in preschool 3x a week and they had quiet time as well for about 20 minutes or so. so he napped on his days home - maybe 2-3x week.  when he was 4 and a few months he dropped the nap completely.

my DS"s preschool teacher suggested the sleep chart (rules)  = kids like to know what comes next in their day. it did help.

basically it was:
PJs
brush teeth
bathroom
water x 1
books x 1 (we read long books at this age)
hug & Kiss
Tuck in  x 2 --> once in bed he was allowed to have one more tuck in
stay in bed & sleep until morning

we also used a this clock:
http://www.amazon.com/My-Tot-Clock-Faceplate-Special/dp/B001QS802K/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1378956201&sr=8-1&keywords=my+tot+clock

when it turned yellow he could get out of bed in the morning - it was blue during the night.

so after his 2nd tuck-in, we would say "remember the sleep rules" and we would NOT tuck him in again and he was expected to go back to his bed.

ok to make this work, we had to use 2 gates at his door (they were clear)  - otherwise he would just run out of hte room. my DS did a complete 180 on his personality overnight. during the day, the easiest child ever. at night, it was like he was possessed!  the weekend we started the sleep chart, we also used the gates - so he could see us but we would not go back in after the 2nd tuck in. some back story so you don't think we are really mean, we were sleeping outside of his room for WEEKS at this point and I was trying to TTC!!! so enough was enough, he needed his sleep and we needed ours.  there was crying bc he wanted us to come back in but we just said " remember the sleep chart or whatever" and we kept our conversation to the bare minimum.he could see us thru the gate. the first night was tough but each night go better and in a few days he was back to STTN!!!! while we were doing this one of us slept down the hall in our guest room and the OH slept downstairs. my DH took the first shift on the weekend and then i stayed up there the rest of the week.

[FroggyMom]

Will give update in a bit as I don't have much time right now. 

Heather, I have a quick question for you regarding the tot clock.  I had come across this the other day, and I thought it looked like  good idea.  It is a little expensive though so I could not decide if it would be worth it.  Did your DS seem to respond well to it?  One concern I have is what is they want to sleep later than the wake up time where the clock turns yellow?  For example, if it is set for 7 am, does the clock just change to yellow at 7 am quietly?  Or does it automatically play wake up music and wake him up even if he is still sleeping?  Thanks!

[nona]

Yes there are different settings.  It helped in combination with the chart for us and when he was older. We just got rid of it and now use a Lego clock.

[FroggyMom]

Yes there are different settings.  It helped in combination with the chart for us and when he was older. We just got rid of it and now use a Lego clock.

By different settings, do you mean you can program it to only turn yellow at the wake up time but make no noise.  As long as it won't wake him up when he's still sleeping even if it's past wake up time, I would LOVE to try this clock...so just want to be sure!  Thanks!

[FroggyMom]

I'd have likely done 45 minutes then push bedtime out.  What did you end up doing? 

Shiv, I ended up giving him 1 hour, and he woke up on his own anyway.  I then did have to push bedtime out because I wanted to be sure he was tired.  I think we did 9 pm bedtime that night.

Yesterday, I did a no nap day.  He woke up at 7:20 am and was asleep by 7:40 pm.  It took him less than 10 min to fall asleep!    He did come out once at about 11:30 pm.  I then slept in his room the rest of the night, and he only got up to potty.  I haven't yet decided whether I will do a nap today.  I've done 2 nap days and 2 no nap days since Sunday.  I think I am going to try a mix of both for now and see how that goes.

Honestly Hun it is better to have a longer consolidated nights sleep than a nap and a rubbish night. YK?  I had to stop my 2yos nap before 2.5 at we were having ridiculous bedtime nonsense. I was loathed to lose my middle of the day time but the nap had to go. She has quiet time watching a show after lunch. Other people do books on cd or just quiet play.

You are right.  I do want him to have a good night.  How long do you do quiet time after lunch?

I'd make sure you are telling him you are only on his floor for x days so you can help him know his room is safe and then after that you are going back to your bed.  Just so it's not a shock when you move back to your own room!

Yes, I have been telling him all along.  I am also going to make him a chart and cross of the days today so he understands.  DH and I decided to give him a week with us on the floor and see what happens.  It has been 3 days thus far.  Does a week sound reasonable to you guys?  Too long?  Too short?

[nona]

Yes - a week
yes- can turn off sound. I never used it. Wish you cld borrow mine!

[FroggyMom]

Heather, thanks so much!  We did decide to order the tot clock.  It just came in and tonight is our first night using it.  It is also the end of a week, and my last night to sleep in his room with him.  I just left him drowsy in his room and told him the clock was blue right now so that means he needs to stay in his bed.  So far, he has stayed in his room.  I sure hope this clock helps us!

it is so confusing to know when to cap nap or get rid of it completely. maybe try for a week of naps now and then and see what happens? he is 3.5 right? at that age he can probably do w/o the nap but it will take some time adjusting.

Yes, DS will be 4 in December.  I have been doing about half the week naps and half the week no naps lately.  So, I will see how that works as well when I move out of his room tomorrow.

so after his 2nd tuck-in, we would say "remember the sleep rules" and we would NOT tuck him in again and he was expected to go back to his bed.

So, when you saw he was allowed 2 tuck-ins, does this mean after you tuck him in and shut the door.  He could come back out and ask for another one time?  Did you actually make a chart that pictured all of these activities?  And I don't think you are really mean, we have been sleeping on the floor in his room for one week now, and I am SO ready to go back to my room!  I'm hoping he gets the idea of the clock with me in there tonight so I can show it to him if he wakes up.  Then, tomorrow night we will see if anything has changed when I move back to my room!  Fingers crossed!

[michaeljacknnugg]

Fx for you this works fm! How did the night go?

[FroggyMom]

Thank you!  Well, my last night sleeping in his room went well!  He went to sleep and stayed asleep until about 1:45 am.  He woke up and needed to potty so I took him to potty, and he went right back to sleep in his bed.  He woke up at about 6:55 am (the clock was set for wake up time at 7 am) and asked if it was time to get up.  I pointed to the clock and told him no because the clock was still blue.  He laid in bed until he saw the clock change to yellow at 7 am and asked again if he could get up.  I said it's yellow, so you can get up!

He has been very excited and proud of his clock all day!  It is on the dresser in his room.  He has ran back and forth from the living room to his room several times to check his clock to be sure it's still yellow.  haha.  When it turned to blue to signal nap time this afternoon, he teared up a bit and got a little whiny about it.  We did our routine, and i tucked him in bed.  He said he needed to go potty, but I thought he was probably using this as an excuse to get up.  I took him to try, and he didn't have to really.  So, we had one stall attempt, but after that, I told him to stay in his bed until his clock turned yellow.  He did not come out and fell asleep shortly after for his nap.  He is still napping right now....

[michaeljacknnugg]

Hurrah, that sounds really positive! Well done you!

[nona]

we did use a chart with pictures & words & looked at it as we were getting ready for bed.

so after his 2nd tuck-in, we would say "remember the sleep rules" and we would NOT tuck him in again and he was expected to go back to his bed.

So, when you saw he was allowed 2 tuck-ins, does this mean after you tuck him in and shut the door.  He could come back out and ask for another one time?  Did you actually make a chart that pictured all of these activities?  And I don't think you are really mean, we have been sleeping on the floor in his room for one week now, and I am SO ready to go back to my room!  I'm hoping he gets the idea of the clock with me in there tonight so I can show it to him if he wakes up.  Then, tomorrow night we will see if anything has changed when I move back to my

after we tucked him in the first time (ie when he first climbs into bed), he is allowed to get up one more time for another "tuck in". he got up almost immediately after the first one *eyeroll*  - after this, if he got up, we did NOT tuck him in again. he had to put himself in his bed or whatever. he would ask to be tucked in again and we would say "remember the sleep chart", no more tuck in's. at first he went nuts bc we would not go back into the room. he would act like he could not get into bed bc he was physically disabled and would also tell us does not now how to put the blanket on top of himself and act like a crazy person trying to do it. it was quite the spectacle.  now, keep in mind, we were telling him to remember the chart thru the clear gates we had in his door way. we did not shut & lock the door bc my DS is kinda claustrophobic in that way  and can not handle being shut in his room. so having the clear gates in his doorway allowed him to see us but he still had to get himself back to bed.  hope that makes sense.

let me be honest and say we are currently having issues now . he keeps coming down stairs and crawling in our bed. i'm not sure what to do about it. his excuse is that he is scared, etc. but since he is older, it is a whole different can of worms.  it really gets to me bc i need my sleep and i'm being woken constantly by his thrashing. i would walk him upstairs but usually it has been a while before we know he is there bc he gets in on the other side of my DH who sometimes doesn't notice. we may have to lock our door at night and if he wants it he will have to knock and we will just take him upstairs.  anyway, try to nip it in the bed ASAP!!!