Author Topic: Feels like we will never get there  (Read 901 times)

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Offline Love, laughter, & PJs

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Feels like we will never get there
« on: October 07, 2014, 00:26:55 am »
(Feel free to move, I wasn't sure the best place for it)

11m old in a couple of days and it honestly feels like we will never get to independent sleep. Both of my others I could lay down in the crib and walk away by this age. Now, a lot of that is that we let things go with nursing to sleep, etc etc much longer since she didn't have a room in the old house, we were moving, etc. But we've been working on her sleep for over 3m now and she's still screaming the house down at every sleep. We did revery back to rocking her a lot, which I know was not helping. We are committed now, though. I feel like if we don't get on this it will only get harder and harder. I am taking her on a work trip with me in 3 weeks (my mom is coming to help with her) so she needs to be able to be put down more easily and by someone besides DH and I. A timeline always puts the pressure on!

So, we have a number of issues. I think the biggest is that she just does not know how to fall asleep on her own and she is SO determined that she not do so. She screams and screams, she just does not calm. So when we don't rock her we shh/pat. I am sure that is a prop now. I try to do it more lightly and stop before she's fully asleep but she goes right back into full on screaming.

The last couple of nights I've tried GW, which worked well with my other kids. She screams so hard she is gasping for breath. It's horrible. I can never move towards the door because she never even stops for a moment. Both times I ended up patting her after she screamed nonstop for almost an hour. I'm not sure if that's getting us anywhere? It feels like she will scream forever. :(

Naps DH has been able to pat her down without too much trouble. I asked him to try to lighten it up but I'm not sure how much he's doing that.

We are also in the 2-1, which complicates things. Here's how the last couple of days have looked

7ish: A
10:35 - S
11:10 - A
2:05 - S
3:40 - A
6:45 - brought her up
7:50 - S

I just don't know what to do with a kid who screams and just makes no indication she's going to stop. My others would cry and then kind of wind it down until they were quiet and fell asleep. But she just goes on and on and is so determined about it.

Not sure there's a discrete question here but I'm just at my wits end and I don't know what to do next! TIA for any thoughts.

ETA:  I remembered another issue I haven't been able to sort out. DD just wants to nurse every time she wakes. When I'm working evenings (get home between 1 and 3am) or overnights after a night or two she gets down to waking twice a night, sleeping 5 or 6 hours in a stretch. But when I'm home she wakes progressively more frequently. Usually every 2-3 hours. She will nurse and either be back asleep or cry for 30 seconds in the crib and be asleep. If DH goes in and we try to not feed her she might cry for two hours. It's awful. So I end up feeding her because it's easier. But now we are back up to 4 or so NFs which is just insanity. But I don't know what to do! My others startit sleeping more on their own at night at this age, if I remember right, but no sign of that here. :(
« Last Edit: October 07, 2014, 02:46:34 am by Love, laughter, & PJs »
*Kate*



Offline Lindsay27

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2014, 13:00:21 pm »
My first thought is that she's UT, with possible a UT/OT loop happening.  Her first A time is a bit short for her age so I think that's why you are getting a lot of resistance.  I think if you want to do a short AM/long PM scenario, the first nap should only be about 30mins (capped) so that the second nap is long an restorative.  Alternatively, you can make the push to 1 nap - so try an 11:3 0nap and then do an EBT.  The 2-1 is really tricky and awkward I found, a hard transition for sure!

As for the nursing at night, I think that is absolutely a prop issue, and it is going to be hard, but I think you'll just have to be committed to dealing with it head on.  I would maybe pick one of the NFs (that you know she isn't hungry) and commit to not feeding for that NW.  I know you said it's awful because she will cry for a long period, so you will need to expect that.  Does she have a lovey or take a paci that could help soothe her?  You may even need to plop a mattress on the floor beside her and camp out there to help calm her and then eventually work on GW (but that will take some time).  It might be best to start that during a weekend or a period of time where it is possible for you to maybe rest the next day :)



Offline weaver

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2014, 13:20:47 pm »
Kate, have you thought about how her personality might be affecting her sleep habits?

The BW "Know Your Baby Quiz"
The Five Types - Everyday Moments

Something I find really useful when planning how to tackle sleep issues.
*Anne*, loving mama to a honeybee (2010) and a sweetpea (2012).  BF for 4 proud years.


Offline Love, laughter, & PJs

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2014, 15:26:25 pm »
Thanks, Lindsay. That first A time has always been short for her. If I let her she'll do an hour and a half on that A time. She's weird like that! But I've been trying to shorten that first nap so she'll do a longer second one. I've thought about pushing her all the way to 1 nap but I don't think she's quite ready. I struggle with the 2nd A time after the short nap, though. It's so hard to get it right. Today she was up at 6:12 (after being up 4 times through the night :P) and fell asleep in the carrier on our walk at 9:34, slept until 10:08. Not sure when I'm going to put her down again? 1:30 maybe? I feel like too late and she'll be OT but too early and she'll need bed at 5 something this evening. :/

I know you're right about nursing at night. It's SO hard. We went through a phase a couple of months ago where we decided I wouldn't nurse her if it hadn't been 4h. She screamed and screamed for hours at a time. DH would get frustrated and we could never get her down and I ended up nursing her and it felt like all the crying was for nothing. So we reverted back to this. :P I guess it's worth a try again. I'm not sure what else we have to try. It's just so hard to be up with her screaming for 3 hours at a time and she's still not asleep and by that point she's probably legitimately hungry and will not go to sleep but if I nurse her it's like we are undoing what we were trying to do, yk?

Anne, that's a good reminder. She's mostly textbook with some grumpy thrown in. During the day she's pretty delightful and easygoing most of the time. It's really just sleep times that are such a disaster.
*Kate*



Offline Love, laughter, & PJs

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2014, 23:31:10 pm »
Ok, so today had some success!

6:15 - A
9:35 - S in the wrap
10:10 - A
1:05 - S (DH said it was easy and she went down on her own!! Maybe the first time ever. Took about 15 min of her flopping around in her crib)
3 - A
6:45 - took her up, she was MAD, screamed a lot
7:15 - he patted her down

So, more A time after the 2h nap, you think? Or less? I couldn't tell if she was UT or OT at BT. She seemed good before she went up. Rubbed her eyes maybe once but otherwise was crawling around, playing, babbling.

I think I will work on the independent sleep issue for naps and BT and then try to tackle the night nursings. As much as I hate being up so much :/
*Kate*



Offline Love, laughter, & PJs

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2014, 01:19:09 am »
And why didn't I remember the curse of the positive post?!? :P

Up at 8:55 screaming. Still screaming. Grr! Still not sure if this is UT or OT (I mean certainly right now she sounds OT but the early evening wakeup in general, she hasn't done this in a long time)
*Kate*



Offline Lindsay27

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2014, 12:57:04 pm »
Hmmm, the day looks pretty good to me so the 8:55 screaming is a bit odd.  Waking after BT is typically and OT sign, but the A times look okay.  For us, our last A was usually a bit shorter, so maybe try a 6:30 BT?



Offline Love, laughter, & PJs

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2014, 13:31:43 pm »
Ok I'll try that tonight. It took an hour and a half to get her back. Then she woke up 15 min later so I fed her then. Then she slept 5h, which is amazing for her. I was all excited. Then she was up 90 min later, then 45 min after that. So up at 6 for the day. Argh. 930 now so I'll try for the short nap in a minute. This is so hard! :'(
*Kate*



Offline Lindsay27

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2014, 14:32:39 pm »
Do you think there is teething going on?  Are you still medicating - finding it helping at all?



Offline Love, laughter, & PJs

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Re: Feels like we will never get there
« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2014, 14:54:27 pm »
She just finally busted through her top two after 2m of working on them! Could be more coming but not sure. I medcate pretty frequently, not sure it helps :P But if she's losing it I will do it to try
*Kate*