10 month old seemingly un-trainable

[1sttimeima]

I've read around the forum a little bit and have found similar situations, but it seems like my case is a bit drastic.

My daughter is almost 10 months old, and aside from knowing that night time is for sleeping, she's basically lacking all basic sleeping abilities! We've been trying to work with her on falling asleep on her own on and off since she was 3 months old, but it just seems like this child doesn't want to sleep. She's a relatively happy and content girl during awake daytime hours-- not grumpy or groggy. There have been short periods when she's slept reasonably at night (3-5 hour stretches and relatively easy to put back to sleep): at 3 months and 6 months. Here's how things are going right now. We're going crazy:

(We try to start bedtime at around 7pm, but we can't get her to sleep until 10pm with lots of night waking, so she doens't typically get up for the day until 10am! We usually give up either after 3 hours of struggling at the beginning of the night, or after 2 hours of fighting in the middle of the night, and she ends up in bed with us...)

7:30am Wake up to BF, then back to sleep
10am Up for the day, play in bed
10:30am Breakfast
11:45am-12:45pm Nap in bed with a parent (after we give up...)
1pm Lunch
2:30pm Snack
3:30-4pm Nap in crib (after a lot of work...)
5pm Dinner
7pm Pajamas, read story, brush teeth, lullaby, etc.
7:30pm Start long process of trying to get her to sleep
10:30pm Give up and take her to our bed
12:30am Wake up, BF
3am Wake up, BF
7:30am Wake up, BF


I know her first A time is really short, but she's really tired by then. It's probaby because her sleep is so interrupted at night. We have been trying to get her sleepy, and put her in her bed awake, but she has so far only once put herself to sleep that way once, after many hours of struggling.

If we do get her to nap in her own crib, she only sleeps for 20-40 minutes.

We're at a loss!!

[newkidontheblock]

Hi honey:) First of all {hugs} You guys must be exhausted. More than happy to help you tackle these issues. To be completely honest, I don't think that your daughter is lacking sleep abilities  I just think that your current routine is not quite right for her.

A few suggestions to begin with -- Firstly, I think you should fix a set wake up & bed time. This is essential when getting back on track. Aim for a 12 -12.5 hour day.  Although she is tired, I suggest you do not put her back to bed after she wakes at 7.30. This is reinforcing your night wakings as she sees this as a continuation of night sleep. Start your day from that point and do whatever it takes to keep her up for the next A time.

Next I think you need to increase your A times. 1.45/ 2 A is more appropriate for a 2 month old. At 10 months, her A should be closer to 4 hours. That is why you are struggling to get her down for naps. She is simply not tired. And this in turn is affecting her nights. She needs more A time during the day to be properly tired by the end of it.
Average A times- BOOKMARK ME!!
I think to begin with you should observe your LO and watch for her sleepy cues. If she is fighting the nap, she is not tired enough. She seems very under tired for nap 1 & then gets madly over tired as the day progresses. Usually I would say add 10 -15 minutes to your A every few days and hold at that point to allow her to adjust but I think you will have to add quite a lot at one shot to make a difference. Of course once you stretch to a new time, hold at that point to let her body adjust. Basically, keep pushing your A time & aim for 2 naps of 1.5 - 2 hours each. If naps are bad, go for an earlier bed time to reduce OT. Once you get her A to a time appropriate for her age, we can reassess and work on the other issues.

How does that sound? First step?

[1sttimeima]

newkidontheblock, thank you sooo much for your sensitive and super helpful reply. I'm going to sound like a madwoman now:

After the worst weeks we've had (including most of the newborn stage!), where our daughter hasn't slept for more than ~2 hours, and only while being held... My husband and MIL decided to do whatever needed to be done to get her to sleep. They tried rocking her to sleep, holding her, etc. while I was out for a couple of hours. Nothing helped and she kept screaming. When I got home at 9:30pm I nursed her and decided to put her in her crib and sit by for a few minutes. She was calm, so I walked out. SHE PUT HERSELF TO SLEEP. For twelve hours. She woke up at 6am, whined for a minute, and PUT HERSELF TO SLEEP AGAIN. I just put her down for her first nap of the day. AND WALKED AWAY.

I don't know what happened. Could it be that just posting in the BW Forum has flipped a switch for our mega-Spirited Baby who has never slept for more than 5 hours in a row in her 10 months of life?? I know this won't last forever, but I feel I need to contact the Vatican Miracles Commission (too bad I'm Jewish).

I will use this momentum and combine it with your great advice. I stretched out her A time a little bit this morning, but needed to balance that with pushing her bedtime back slowly towards 7pm. We try for 7, but it's been taking until 10pm+ to get her to sleep. So I'm shooting for 3 hours of A time in the morning until we push her bedtime back and then keep her A time between 3 and 4 hours. I think if she goes to sleep really late again, I'll do the unthinkable and wake her up a bit earlier each day, aiming for 7:30am.

I loved a lot of the information I picked up on here about cues and different kinds of cries. Thanks for turning my attention back to that. I only put her down for a nap when she started getting antsy and sucking her thumb this morning, and it really helped.

It's proven: my baby knows how to get herself to sleep and to stay asleep, and I'll continue supporting her in doing that. Thank you so much!!

[newkidontheblock]

Haha:) Such great news! Good luck with stretching out her A. She can get very OT in the process, so don't be afraid to put her to sleep much earlier than you normally would. Let me know if you need any more guidance

Xx