Screaming at 4's for naps

[Mum2lucy]

Hi

I was wondering if anyone can help me.
My 15week old lo screams before naps. Generally she goes to sleep independently and has been doing really well. She either sleeps through the night or wake for one feed at about 4am. She is ebf. However before her naps she screams. I can calm the screaming down with the 4 s's but it seems it is the 'sitting' part that gets her more annoyed. If I put her down in her cot quite quickly after the swaddle, she stops crying faster. However I'm concerned that then produces an inadequate sleep ritual for naps. She usually only naps for 40/45 mins and they are very hard to extend. My nap ritual is a few songs, blind down, say bye to the sun, swaddle and then sitting (when the screaming starts). It isn't mantra crying, more a full blown scream.

She has reflux which is medicated - don't think this is an issue for this.

My easy usually looks like

Up 7am ish
A 7.00 - 7.15 (nappy change etc before feed due to reflux)
E 7.15 - 7.30
S 8.45 - 9.30
A 9.30 - 10.00 (due to short naps)

E 10.00
A 10.15
S 12.00 (shh patt till next feeding if doesn't sleep or extra A)

E 13.00
A 13.15
S 2.45

E 16.00 (depends if she naps before, this feed can be later)
A 16.15
S 6/6.30pm - short cap nap usually only 20mins

E 7pm ish bed

Any ideas on how to minimise the screaming? It makes nap time quite stressful for both of us!

Thanks
Xx

[Mum2lucy]

Just realised that my schedule wasn't really detailed enough and prob not an accurate picture.

Here was yesterday's

7.20 e
7.30 a
8.15 s (seems short a but lo yawned)
9.00 a (45min nap so Up and more A, nappy etc done before feed due to reflux)

10.10 e
10.15 a
12-13.20 s (shh patt to extend after 40mins)
13.20-13.30 a (nappy etc)

13.30 e
13.40 a
14.55 - 16.35 s (straight through, no intervention)
16.35 - 16.45 a (nappy etc)

16.45 e
17.00 a (no sleep after this until bed due timings of it)

18.45 e (wouldn't take much as too tired)
18.50 s (bed for the night)

[creations]

Hello and welcome to BW forums

It could well be that she just doesn't like to sit!  Mine liked a super short wind down, when I tried the longer WD with all the ritual aspect for a few days he blew a fuse.  He liked to play right up to nap time then prob 3 mins max between playing and sleep, I took him into his room, sang a verse of a song and put him down (I couldn't do any of the curtain shutting etc). If he appeared to need it I sang 2 verses but there were times he was pushing away form me before the first verse was finished, to show me he wanted to get to bed.
Whilst she may seem very tired because she starts screaming if you delay her bed by doing sitting it also looks like she could do with a longer A time to be fully tired and more able to transition to the next sleep cycle (with help initially), it could be a relatively simple case of not starting the WD so early, so the A is longer, but once WD starts she wants it short and to the point.

A times at this age are around 1hr 30 to 1hr 45
Average A times- BOOKMARK ME!

Was she awake from 9am to 12pm? That seems a very long time to go without a nap for this age.

At this age LOs are more alert and sleep cues can become confusing, a yawn can indicate the need for a change of activity, scene or toy (ie it is boredom) so move rooms or change what you do with her and extend the A for a later nap, then I suggest being in the room to help transition at 40 min so that she doesn't fully wake but has help with you soothing her.  Are you familiar with W2S, Wake to Sleep? It looks like you are already using this method to try to extend the nap so you can continue with that.

hope this helps

[Mum2lucy]

Thanks for your reply! 😄

I tried going in at the 40mins and trying to ease the transition but her eyes popped open and when she sees me, she gets more alert so my shh pat didn't work and I gave up after 25mins of tears. I have tried wake to sleep, going in around 30mins and giving her a wee nudge which I thought was working but it seems to have stopped working for now. I'll just have to keep trying with both methods and hope it works eventually 😄

Maybe she doesn't like the sitting part anymore. She is still crying after the swaddle but I'm just putting her in to her crib straight away and she seems to cry for less time doing this.

The 3 hour spell in the easy above was because I had to go to something and she unfortunately had to come so it meant that she didn't sleep. I find it hard to get her to sleep if we are out and about (she would much rather take in the world 😄) I find that usually just now her awake time is 2hrs which is hopefully ok?

Thanks again xx

[creations]

Might there be something else bothering her? For instance if the swaddle blanket is a little cold when you first swaddle her perhaps she is sensitive to this and it leads to crying?

Is the first A time usually 2hrs or a lot shorter?  Above it looks shorter, is this the nap you always find difficult to extend?

[Mum2lucy]

Hiya,

I've been keeping her up for 2hrs unless she shows obvious tired signs for the past few days. Yesterday I got 2 X 1hr 40mjns and 1 X 1hr which was fantastic.
I've upped the morning activity time to 2hrs and have ignored a few early yawns and changed activity and you are correct, it wasn't tired signs so thanks.

I've cut the sitting time down with her to maybe a minute. She still crud but it has been for about 1min so guess that's just her settling down and it isn't screaming like it was.

Progress it seems... Yay! 😄

[creations]

What a lovely update
Thank you for taking the time to post.

I'm so glad to hear things have improved and the naps are getting better.  I recommend you take note that your LO likes a longer A time than the 'guidance' times (see the link above I gave you), either the top end of guidance or the guidance time of a slightly older LO. This may help you over the coming months so you don't fall behind on A times leading to UT and short naps or nap refusal.  Some LOs (mine) liked a very long first A time and a little shorter the rest of the day, this would also be fine.  When you discover what your baby does well on it is well worth making a note for future reference. It also helps us here to know the individual preferences of a LO so that you get the best possible support.

If she doesn't like the sitting btw, you can cut it out. Maybe just swaddle (if you still are) and stand a moment then lay her in her cot?  Mine didn't like me to sit at all.

You'll see her getting more and more aware and interacting with you more now too as she's getting that bit older

[michaeljacknnugg]

She sounds similar to my DS - screamed before all naps for a couple of months because he couldn't work out how to go to sleep.

Is she by any chance spirited?

The swaddle went early for us as he just hated it. I ended up watching his cues and only providing as much assistance as he needed for each nap, backing off whenever I could. He was sleeping independently by six months and is a great sleeper to this day - just doesn't need much of the stuff!

[Mum2lucy]

Thanks for the replies again.

She is a mostly a text book baby with a little bit of touchy and Angel (both were same second rating).

I've cut the sitting out and placed her in the cot. The crying is much less as she just puts herself to sleep now with a few tears (usually 2mins top)

I had thought that she was at the top or above average activity times.
This week it has seemed that 2hrs isn't long enough - do you think she could move up activity times that quickly? I've been trying 2hrs 5mins - 2hrs 10mins as she is showing no tired signs at 2hrs and I was again getting 40min sleeps.

I'm still swaddling. I find she has a much more settled sleep when swaddled but I'm considering trying to get her away from this as it won't be long until she is rolling

Xx

[creations]

Activity times increase quite quickly between 4-6 months (have a look on the link above) so if you are starting to see her UT at 2hrs or even 2hrs 10 mins it's fine to increase it to a time where she can sleep well.  Don't forget the guidance times are just guidance, and some LOs will be at the top end or above, it's fine so long as your routine is working for you