Started nursery and all gone wrong!

[choc]

Hi, sorry we have been away also! Thanks for the reply. Lo is waking pretty early and I am struggling to get him to a 10am.nap at the moment, he'd never make 11am.  Also for the pm nap we actually get in the house at 5.15 then by the time we have wind down etc it is pretty much 5.30 and get to late for a nap.
I have been doing something like this,
Wu often around 5am but dozes on and off til 6/6.30 when we get him up
S 10am and trying to cap at about 11am
S 1.30 to 3 then leave for school run
Bt 7.15
He has been on a 4 hour A for a while so I'm hoping that last A to bed will be OK. Problems I am having is he doesn't always do the whole 1.30 nap, sometimes it's 1.20. I think UT.
He is back to either having a night waking where he plays about for a bit then goes back to sleep til 6.30(we had been having these since January til about end of April) or he sleeps through to 5ish (which were having after the nws stopped. Now he switches between the 2). Sometimes he only has 9hr30 to 10hr of proper sleep and then another hour of dozing on and off.
Any thoughts on what i'm doing with the routine?

[choc]

Just a quick one to say we had a day visiting friends yesterday and sleep routine went out the window in the afternoon. We had a great night though 8pm til 7. 30 am! I know its not something we can repeat but is there any info I can take from it?
Wu 5am dozed on and off til 6.15
Oob 6.15
S 9.30 as I just couldn't keep him awake any longer
Wu 11 which was strange, I thought he would do a mega nap as he seemed soo tired  and fell asleep on his bottle!
S 2 til 2.30 travelling to friends in car
S 7 to 7.15 ish travelling home in car
Bt 8pm (it's usually 7.15 to 7.30)
Then slept right through til 7.30 with a tiny wakeup at 4.45.
Anything I can take from this?!

[becj86]

Maybe you could try a long AM/short PM routine, something like this:

1.5hr (or capped at 2hr max>) nap starting around 10/10:30-11:30/12 depending upon WU
CN on school run - 3-3:30 (is that possible?)
or UT one from 2:15-3 if he'll take it - I think I'd try for say 10min and if he's not taking the nap, cross fingers for a car CN
Then BT say 7:30.

WDYT?

[choc]

That is basically what we were doing before he started nursery! Except the second nap was more like 4pm til 4.45ish. I was wondering if that late nap was impacting on his night sleep. Also his nursery naps last week were only between 40 mins and 1 hour (starting at 10am) Which is an annoying time because he was still a little undertired to go to sleep at 1.30pm but if I put him down later I would have to wake him at 3 so would be a short nap or he would wait til after school run and be OT! 

[becj86]

Also his nursery naps last week were only between 40 mins and 1 hour (starting at 10am)

Maybe worth trying 10:30 at nursery then to see if you can get a longer nap?

[choc]

Thanks bec. I have been thinking about this all weekend driving myself mad and I think the only way forward really is short am long pm (lunchtime!) the main reason being that I collect him from nursery around 12. 30 so as I start pushing the nap back (and entering 2:1) I will be stuck once we get past an 11am nap. With a short am he can gradually drop that and keep the lunchtime nap when he gets home. Would that work? What would that look like do you think in easy?

Or have I got this all wrong? I am driving myself insane. Naturally I think i want to do long am short pm but can't see how it will work long term. I think he naturally does this and it would mean not waking him from maps which I think is what puts me off short am. I would probably have to wake him which I hate.  But I can't see how it would work long term when I collect him at 12.30.

I'm going round in circles. 

[becj86]

Is it you that has a nursery that won't cap the nap? If so, short AM will still be too long to give you a long PM nap starting around 12:30 or even 1. You'd have to cap it at 20 or 30min, I think

You could try to do a purposely OT short nap if you're really set on the short AM/long PM I guess...

Long nap at 11 then jump to 12:30 is not really ideal, I see what you're concerned about there. Let me have a think on that one, its really that you've got to get that long nap between 12:30 and 2:45 between picking him up and school run. Short AM/long PM is good for that because you can just cap the AM nap shorter and shorter til it drops and keep the long nap relatively stable. If nursery won't cap though, that's going to be tricky. How many days is he at nursery?

[choc]

My nursery has a company policy of not waking from naps but after talking to the girls in Los room said they will 'gently rouse' him, by going in and opening the door etc. I think they just aren't allowed to say they're doing it as have been taken over by a new company with new rules.
So I think short am it has to be really. I can realistically get him down for 1pm til 3. So what time would you suggest for first nap? I need to be careful of ew. After 2 good night's of 6m45 to 7.30 wake ups we were back to 5am today. Only 9hr30 night.

[becj86]

Its hard to decide, really - just have to run it as late as possible to avoid the EW and cross fingers he's not OT and grumpy from when he is woken til nap time again... I reckon you could probably leave it at 10 and make it shorter - cap at 30min and see how that goes. You may have to make it later or shorter or both but if they will cap, give that a go.

[choc]

Ok I will start with that. Thanks so much for your help!