Help with PU PD

[Graysor]

I am trying to use PU PD with my 7 mo to get her to sleep at bedtime,  as she won't feed to sleep anymore,  and I can't physically manage to hold and rock her for long enough any more.  Shush pat doesn't work either.  She couldn't care less about the shhing and patting. 

I  have tried before,  but a bit  half heartedly,  and I need some advice on how to get it right. 

Questions are:

When to pick up?  She starts crying usually before being put down.  Do I just pick her straight back up again? 

After a number of PUs and PDs she is usually more enraged and further from sleep than ever.  So much so that when I pick her up she doesn't stop crying.  She carries on for say 15 mins till she is basically crying in her sleep.  What do I do then? 

Help gratefully received,  thanks!

[becj86]

First off, best to get your routine right, so you know is reasonable to expect her to sleep. What's your routine currently?

Any medical issues?

Crying before being put down suggests a few other potential issues - under tired, scared of bedroom to name a few.

Have a read of this: Pick Up/Put Down (PU/PD) - Everything you ever needed to know!

Oh, and how does she go to sleep for naps?

[Graysor]

Thanks for the reply.  To answer your questions :
Routine is very variable because her wake up time and length of nap is different every day.  But I try to stick to 2.5 hours awake time between naps. She doesn't give obvious tired cues  (  never has ) so this is my best guess for timing.
No medical issues. 
She's not scared of the cot, she will happily sit in it and play for a few minutes during the day when I go to the bathroom etc.
Naps are either in the sling or pushchair,  she's never managed cot naps. And I don't have the energy to fight this at the moment. 

[becj86]

Right, at 7 months, average A time is actually around 3hr+ so she might need a bit more A time before she's tired - could be why you're not seeing cues.

I can't say why she's upset at BT - could be she's overtired from too many short naps or undertired from A time of 2.5hr. It really does help to have a somewhat less variable daytime routine to help get the nights sorted out.

[Graysor]

OK thanks.  I'll try to extend her awake time during the day.  But she is usually starting to get very grumpy and grizzly by about 2 hours so I'm not sure how it will go.

I wish we could have a more reliable routine in the day. But sometimes whatever I do I can't extend a short nap. And wake up time can vary hugely depending on whether I can resettle at all after 5 am which obviously impacts on nap timing and generally how tired she is. 

[becj86]

wake up time can vary hugely depending on whether I can resettle at all after 5 am which obviously impacts on nap timing and generally how tired she is.

Yes, however, the short A time particularly first thing in the morning is likely to be a major reason for waking at 5 happy and ready to play after a short night - because she knows she'll get a nap before she's properly tired. Pushing that first A time, difficult as it is with a cranky baby, makes all the difference for most babies.