Help Teezee! Nightwakings- 6 or more a night!

[Elphyrafire]

Hi there- I read how you help others with your suggestions. Maybe you can help us?
My DS is 4 1/2 months old. He wakes up during the 12 hour sleeping block about 6 times or more and for one of the wakings he wants to stay awake. Just reading this board I am realizing he maybe needs more naps? What do you think? He is BF's and gets cereal once a day. I tried stopping cereal and it didn't help.

7:00- awake for the day, nurse
play- exersaucer or jolly jumper or mat or whatever
9:00-9:30 nap
10:00 nurse
Activity play/ walk outside etc.
12:30- 1:00- nap
1;00- nurse
Activity
3:30-4:00 nap
activity
4:00pm nurse then cereal-
Activity- usually jolly jumper
7:00- 8:00 pm we read his cues to tell when he's tired: put him in crib and falls asleep on his own 90%of the time
* 9:00- wakes up crying- can usually pat him to sleep
10-or 11- wakes up to eat
Here's where it falls apart: A typical night-not always the same times
*1:00 am- wakes up crying
*2:30- wide awake- playtime- fingers in mouth- can usually nurse to sleep
*4:00- wakes up and STAYS up for 45 mins laughing and "chatting" to self. After 30 mins we swing him to sleep in his swing
*6:00am- awake to eat
7:00 am awake for the day

Please- any suggestions would be helpful. Also, how do you get them to have longer naps?

[teezee]

i think it would def be a big help to you if you got lo on a 4 hr routine.  that way, he wouldn't need to nurse as often (meaning the nighttime too ) as he will be eating when he is hungrier and will be able to sustain himself for longer periods also.  this very well could help with some of the night wakings, and even the nap issues as lo won't be waking early from a nap hungry. start trying to stretch it out 15 min or whatever lo can handle every few days until you get to about 4 hrs. if you would like in the meantime, give lo some water (mine never took water in a bottle but did take water from a straw ) right before naptime as then lo's belly will be full although it will be digested quicker than milk/formula and he will be hungry for a 'full' feeding when he wakes (and hopefully won't wake early). once you have his belly nice and full, then chances are he is waking out of habit, and you could try a few different methods to lengthen them..wake to sleep, pu/pd, shhing or patting...your choice - whatever you feel comfortable doing.

you may want to try giving cereal in the morning as well as it 'may' be causing some discomfort for lo while he is sleeping and not being active. i gave cereal at night at first but it did work much better during the morning or afternoon after i switched.

i also think lo may be a bit overtired as 3.5 to 4hrs A time right before bed i think is too long for lo. have you tried putting him to be at earlier say at 6:30 or 7? you may want to do that until you get the naps sorted out as overtired lo's tend to wake after the first few hrs of being put down.  once naps are stretched out and the routine is therefore stretched out and put forward, the evening catnap will be later and lo will probably be able to make it to at least a 7:30 bedtime kwim? i def wouldn't give lo 'more' naps - but would opt for the earlier bedtime - if you do more naps lo will not learn to lengthen the existing naps.  between 6 and 8 months lo's tend to drop the catnap anyway, so adding a nap or two def won't solve your problem.

hth! if you need anything else let me know... my lo is now chirping after her nap and it is time for her to nurse!

[Kimberly®]

I'm Not Teezee.. but I may have some helpfull tips for you.

First I'd suggest you drop the cereal until you have night sleeping figured out. 4.5 months is really early to start.
then shorten the time your LO is awake first thing in the AM, 2 hours may be to long. Get your LO down by 8-8:30am and try pat/shush to extend naps.
Start with quieter activities first thing in the AM like mat time or tummy time and the Jumper or saucer in the afternoon, so more energy is used in the PM. try for no more then 1.5 hours of wake time to start. You LO may be overtired and thats why he's only having short naps.
Move bedtime to 7pm with a steady routine starting at about 6:30pm. Use only quiet activities like massage and reading. Don't use the saucer or jumper as they'll overstimulate your LO making sleep time harder.
Try getting a dreamfeed in at about 10:30 if your LO hasn't woken.
When he wont sleep try pat/shush or PU/PD to settle not the swing as that will become a prop.

Try a routine similar to

7am wake eat
7:30 activity
8:30 nap
10:30 wake (if hungry feed if no light activity like reading or singing)
11 eat.
11:30 Activity
12:30 nap
2:30 wake (if hungry feed if not light activity)
3 feed
3:30 activity
4:30 cat nap (no more then 45 minutes)
5:15 light activity (you can throw in a cluster feed here too)
6:15-6:30 (depending on babies mood) Start bedtime routine.
    a good one is Bath, reading singing or massage (only one as all 3 would over stimulate) then feed
7pm bed for the night
10:30 dreamfeed

then if your LO wake in the night use pat/shush or PU/PD to settle.

One note however is that if your LO is not fussing don't try either PU/PD or pat/shush. Let him learn to settle himself. The key is consistency. If your LO is playing I know its hard to sleep but if you go to him you'll only make it worse. Given a few days to learn to settle he'll start to do so and will resume sleeping on his own.

Adjust this routine to your life and needs. Its a flexable routine but its a solid one.

HTH

[Elphyrafire]

Thanks ladies- I will start by starting the 4hour EASY. I'm not sure how/if that extends naptime for longer than 45 mins but maybe? Guess I just thought that  you should pack more calories in in the day rather than less... hence more feedingins. But clearly this hasn't worked so far.
 I was just reading on the EASY forum that signs for your l.o. to start 4 hours are:
not hungry at 3 hours
freq night wakings
45 min naps
etc.
 Yes Yes and double yes. Plus add that DS is a crankpot all day long.

Oh I hope it helps- even to get him back to 6 hours in a row- (did I mention he used to do that?)

Thanks for your time!


PS_ Teezee- if you read this... please tell me more about the STRAW. Bottle feeding is a whole other isssue (ie: he refuses).

[teezee]

as far as bottle feeding - you just have to be consistant in offering it if you want lo to learn how to take it.  i had a problem with lo even taking bm from it - but i would offer it a couple times a day (without letting me or her get frusterated) and if she wouldn't take it then i offered the breast - after a month or so she took it regularly.

as far as the straw cup - i tried a sippy but it really did make a mess (and it's going to..) but i did want her to be able to get some water out of it as she still would not take it from a bottle, so i introduced the straw cup.  some ppl say to use a juice box type of thing so you can show lo to suck by squeezing it kwim? i used a cup with a straw cut down a bit, when i first gave it to her she chewed it then i showed her what i did with it. she still chewed it so i covered one end with my finger after some water was in it and put it in her mouth and let go and she started sucking to try and get more. i did this a couple times and took turns taking drinks myself and she got it.  i practiced this at least once a day with her started at about 4.5 months.

also, just wanted to mention - i was in a bit of a rush yesterday and didn't realize your lo was so young - it is really not a good thing to start lo's on cereal or any other type of solids before six months - as that itself could play such a big part in your night wakings...due to gas, cramping, constipation, etc...i totally agree with karita in saying lay off the cereal and see if it helps - that with a 4 hr routine may help most of your problems.

good luck!!

[Elphyrafire]

Thanks Teezee,
I have stopped cereal as of now. I just gave in because of my mom and DH's mom telling me he needed it (he has doubled his birthweight and is almost 20 lbs now) and them saying that's why he isn't sleeping through yet. So I just thought I'd try it. Obviously it didn't work!
It won't hurt to take him off it. He did like it and ate it all up but if that is what is causing his nightwakings then forget it.

I am trying to extend his naps doing the wake-to-sleep method and it has made him sleep about 20 mins more that usual, which is awesome. Also, last night, at your suggestion I put him to bed at 6:30. He lied there for awhile not doing anything and then drifted to sleep around 7:30. AT least he wasn't crying.
So thanks a lot for your good advice. I hope the 4 hour schedule and no cereal  will make a difference!

[Kimberly®]

I'm so happy to hear that things are going well so far.

I completely understand the pressure to feed solids early my dad is VERY old school and tried to have me start solids at 2 weeks old  When she started sleeping through he figured it was because I gave her solids (which I didn't) and to this day he still gives me a hard time about it.

Keep steady with the bedtime and your LO will show you the way. If after a week she's still awake till 7:30 try 7 and see where that gets you. For most LO's earlier is better, but not for all.

[teezee]

my whole family is old school..and with the pressure of my family...and my damn dr - i gave cereal to my lo at 4 months and it was the biggest parenting mistake i have made! i took her off after a month - after realizing that in fact the cereal was the cause (it didn't really have an bad effects until a week or so after i started her on it, so i didn't connect the two right away). anyway, keep us posted on how things are going!