10.5mo - dropping night snacks

[seaflower]

Another question regarding night nursing...

DD goes to bed at 7:30pm and wakes several times during the night for snacks. We co-sleep and I nurse her back to sleep. I've posted on the EASY forum as we are trying to establish a routine at the moment, she eats well and generally has two naps. I don't mind nursing her ones a night, but 4-5 times is a bit too much.

I know you'll ask me how many times and for how long is she nursing, the truth is I don't know, I seem to fall asleep while she is still eating and wake up for the next feed Recently she sleeps 7:30pm till about 11:30-12am and then she is up every 2 hours or so. Big part of it is habit.

Where do I strart from? How do I drop the feeds? Do I reduce the time? Do I try and strech them every 3-4 hours and then work towards dropping them althogether? Do I offer her water instead? Thanks for reading, S.

[Samuel's mum]

Would you like to continue co-sleeping? If so you may want to read a book called 'The No-cry sleep solution for toddlers and pre-schoolers' by Elizabeth Pantley. She comes from an attachment parenting angle and describes cutting back on night nursing and dealing with co-sleeping. Some of her views fit well with Tracy's description of night weaning a toddler in the BW for Toddlers book.

It sounds as though your dd is using your boob to help her go back to sleep. The first step will be to try and give her the skills to fall asleep independently without boob (if you're establishing EASY that is obviously at the heart of it). It's important that you break off feeding well before naptime and the first going down so she is falling asleep without boob. That way if she does wake up at night there is greater chance she will be able to self-settle. Both BW for Toddlers and Pantley talk about a gradual removal system where you break off the feed while they are progressively more awake.

However this will not guarantee less nursing at night as if it's there she will relish the comfort and security. Some co-sleepers find that night nursing is very difficult to cut out completely. I'm not sure it will be easy for her to appreciate that nursing is allowed one time but not the next time.

Have a look at the props board too.
HTH

[seaflower]

Thanks for the quick reply, Samuel's mum! I've read the NCSS and found it brilliant. The GR did teach her to fall asleep without a feed (sometimes).

DD will fall asleep without the boob very often, and while in fact I love co-sleeping, think it is time to move her to her own room as she seems to be waking up from us walking/turning/etc. Few times when I let her nap in her pram in the other room she slept much better. In fact this morning she sleept 5:30-8:30am, something which hasnt happend in ages!

What worries me that when she wakes up I (or DH) will have to walk to her room, settle her back to sleep, etc... much more hassle than feeding her. In a way I'm sticking my head in the sand and trying to keep up what I'm used to, even though it is not working.

So, do I drop all feeds simultaniously (and offer water instead)? Or do I keep one-two feeds and then try and remove them at a later stage?

[daisymelan]

It is harder work to get them in their own bed, but within a few weeks you will both be sleeping very well and you will be grateful you went through the hard week or two.  I would try a time when you will be able to perhaps get some rest during the day if at all possible.  Or do it in shifts with your hubby so you each get some sleep.

I think I would structure times when you would be comfy feeding her.  Maybe a dreamfeed before you go to bed and then one more feed around 3am or something.  Whatever you think will work best.  But that's how I think I would tackle it.  Tracy says to start as you mean to go on, but I can appreciate how it would be hard for her to drop all at once. 

[Samuel's mum]

It sounds as though you're right to think about stopping co-sleeping but in the short term it's going to be tough. Your sleep cycles are fitting in with her's right now and you are naturally waking with her feeding. In a separate room your cycles will become out of sync. That means that while in the long term sleep for both of you will improve vastly, in the short term it's going to hurt.

I would personally suggest that your main tool is going to be your dh. I think if you are moving her into a separate room you could have your dh go to her at night to try and comfort her back to sleep. Then if you do still want to do one or two feeds for a while you can go in at the times he really feels she is hungry. Her body is used to getting calories through the night so it may take a little while to adjust although obviously she's physically capable of managing without feeds. After a while you can work on phasing all the night feeds and then when she no longer expects nursing on offer you could resume nighttime comforting as well. That's just my suggestion.

However you could try cold turkey with water too. I think whether you go cold turkey or not is up to you and how you know your LO. The process will probably be cleaner cut in some ways and almost certainly quicker. She'll need lots of comfort and it will be hard for you (and your dh) because you may not be the best person to provide it in the middle of the night when she's screaming for a feed.

I think whether you offer water or one/two feeds isn't the main focus of your preparation. The main issue is going to be her emotional response to what is happening. I would think now about what comforting methods you and your dh are wanting to use and make sure you're on the same page for those desperate middle of the night decisions. If he is going to call you in to feed maybe do it out of bed so it doesn't feel like co-sleeping and she will think of it as milk rather than what happened before. You could also introduce a lovey and hope that provides some comfort. I would introduce a lovey a few days at least before you attempt the next step.

Another possibility is to move a mattress into her room so for the first few nights she is in her room but one of you is there for comfort as she drifts off. In NCSS she talks about moving the mattress or chair further away day by day until it is out of the room. Her room may be a place she doesn't feel very secure in. Tracy talks about having playtimes in her cot and making sure she has positive associations with her bedroom.

This is moving more into a sleep post than a breastfeeding one! Some people on this site may have experience to share with you about using pick up /put down as a method of comforting an older baby. The first night will be very very tough. At its heart the principle is about not breaking 'trust' with your LO. I bet on the props board some people will have cold turkey experience.

Good Luck.