Prepping for EASY

[yorkshire]

Hi

Planning to implement EASY in 3 weeks with boob addicted 6.5 monther.
Any way I can use these 3 weeks to lay some foundations that will help him adjust?
Tried Pantley Removal Plan but it just meant he ate less and/or wouldn't go to sleep.
He sometimes goes to sleep in the pram (but not for long) or the car, would it be worth doing more naps this way so he at least gets the experience of falling asleep off the boob more often (so he won't be so upset when this prop goes)
Should I pump all my milk and feed him from bottles to ensure he is getting enough in the day (he currently wakes and feeds all night).  But then how would I get him to sleep before the full on implementation with PUPD.

It all feels like chaos and is very exhausting.  Any ideas as to how I can use this time usefully would be much appreciated.  Of course I will spend much of it reading these boards!

Yorkshire

[rebecaq]

Hi sweetie,

I don't think replacing one prop with another is going to solve any problems. And then he'll have to let go of 2 props instead of one.

It seems that he's nursing to sleep, my recommendation is start getting him used to nursing after he sleeps, that's probably going to be your biggest battle.

Can you post what his day looks like?

- Beca 

[Kimberly®]

I agree, although you can try introducing a lovie, a small stuffed toy or blanket rather then the boob. Something your DC can control.

[yorkshire]

Thanks for your suppportive words.  His day is unpredictable but I seems to be like this:

6-6.30 wakes
8-9  BF to sleep
wakes often after 10, 20 or 30 minutes.  I go in, lie by him (he is on mattress), nurse him back to sleep.
Try to extend nap to at least one hour
10ish Activity
11.30 BF then solids (just tasters at the moment, only been going a week)
12 BF to sleep (again I try to extend his nap by nursing when he wakes and won't go back to sleep on his own)
1-2 Wakes, activity
4 ish BF to sleep (this usually only lasts half an hour)
5 ish Activity - often we go for  a walk
6 BF
6.15 Bath
After bath he cries when being dressed so cant read him a book.
Soft music, dark room, BF to sleep on mattress. 
Sleep around 6.45/7. Try to lift him into cot once asleep but he often wakes and have to go through whole BF on mattress cycle again.  I usually try this twice or three times, then give up and leave him on mattress.
Whilst he used to sleep through well till 4 or 5 he now wakes at random and numerous times throughout the night e.g."
9, 11, 12, 1, 1.30, 2, 4, 5.30
I bring him into my bed so I can get some sleep and I nurse him back each time.  Sometimes now it doesn't work and he talks and cries.
So by morning I am very tired andhe is not hungry because he has snacked all through the night.  What a mess!
I know I need to make the big change but, as I said I am waiting for help to do it.

I agree that I need to reverse the feeding/sleeping thing but the question is how? If not with PUPD which I am waiting to do when I go for it.  I could try a lovey but I know it won't be enough on its own, his BF to sleep habit is so entrenched.  Maybe there is nothing I can do until I do the whole thing properly.

I am trying to use a specific CD of lullabys at every sleep so he associates it with sleep so it might help when he no longer has boob.  I try reading a book when he is not crying but he often is.  He doesn't like being swaddled now although he did when he was very small.  I don't see how I can nurse after sleep as he currently can't get to sleep without it.

Oh dear.

Yorkshire.

[rebecaq]

Hi,

I know you feel overwhelmed, and {{{HUGS}}}

Hopefully we take care of small problems before you completely embark EASY.

You mentioned you're nursing on a mattress and then trying to get him in his cot. This is something that can be tackled before EASY. Nurse him in a comfortable chair in his room and then place him in his crib. Get him used to it before changing over to EASY.

Also, it's best to tackle problems one at a time. So once he's sleeping in his crib, which do you want to tackle first? Eating or sleeping? Personally I think the first thing should be eating because it's directly related to his sleep.

Since he is eating right before sleeping and isn't hungry as soon as he wakes up, try feeding him 30 mins after. Switch slowly and gradually the time in which he eats and when he requires his calories. After a few days or maybe weeks he will be nursing after sleep and not before. That way when you're tackling sleep you know it won't be because he's hungry and don't need to resort to nursing.

When you on EASY I think he needs a dreamfeed to get him a better night's sleep.

Also, remember that EASY is a routine, not  a schedule, so it won't be about watching the clock, it's more about a predictable routine that floows the E A S pattern.

- Beca 

[yorkshire]

Thanks Beca for your ideas.  I fee enthusiastic to try and tackle at least some problems prior to the big change.

The chair nursing I definitely feel I can try though in my experience so far, he is such a light sleeper (unless I let him sit there for 20 mins) that he usually wakes and becomes distressed.  Still I will try again.

Re. tackling the food/sleep issue.  I understand the idea to gradually shift feed times but, at the risk of sounding like a stuck record, I would then be at a loss as to how to get him to sleep night or day (prior to doing PUPD).  When he wakes at night should I try to soothe him in his cot whilst he cries for a while to see if he will settle without boob?  But if he cries a lot and then I nurse him (because I haven't started PUPD) I fear this would be counter productive and teach him to cry to get boob.  However, he just woke now an hour after putting him to bed and I actually managed to get him back (touch wood) by holding his arms down gently.

Re the dreamfeed, I was advised not to introduce it given that he will be 6.5 months when I start and I have started solids (though only last week).  I agree it seems a big jump to get him to go 11 hours without a feed when he has been getting a lot of his calories at night.  However, I am very scared to do this dreamfeed as I am sure he will wake, being the light sleeper he seems to be, and not sure he will go back to sleep.  Strangely although nursing is the only way he know happily to go to sleep, it is becoming less effective.  Sometimes in the night and day he eats, trying to go to sleep and it doesn't work for him - until eventually it does.

Any further thoughts very much appreciated.

Yorkshire.

[yorkshire]

Hi again

Just another thought, would it be worth me using the next couple of weeks to do PUPD for naps?  This might mean I can get the eating on schedule better and get him having more sleep in the day.  But if I don't do it at night as well will it just confuse him?  I don't see how I can change the daytime eating times till I can get him to sleep some other way in the day.  His naps are very short as well so maybe I should be trying to extend them?

I don't want to give him an aversion to his cot though by starting PUPD in a half-hearted way. 

Whaddaya think?

Yorkshire.

[despinatl]

WOW - I could have typed your posts!!! I completely feel your frustration & exhaustion.  It's so impossible to know where to start when there are so many things to work on. 
I just stumbled across this website (after another long night with little sleep).  I sometimes get to the point where I absolutely resent breastfeeding since my LO is so addicted to it.  I guess I should go pick up this book & see what it can do to help me.  I started keeping a journal 10 days ago to see if any kind of patterns emerged, but nothing really did (well, besides the fact my baby either has to be nursed or rocked to sleep and wakes up 4-5 times a night)

Anyhow - I'm right there with ya.  Good luck to you!

[rebecaq]

Yorkshire,

You're right about the dreamfeed, for some reason I thought he was younger, my bad    You could however try clusterfeeding in hopes to get more calories into him 

Have you taken the "Know Your Baby" quiz? It can help if we know his personality.

About getting him relaxed enough to sleep in his crib, this needs to be done without nursing or rocking. Do the 4S winddown and I totally agree with you that you need to start PU/PD to get him to extend his naps and learn to fall asleep independently.  If you're going to change your way of doing things then it needs to be consistant, meaning if he wakes at night and it's not time for a feed ( which he shouldn't be needing anymore ) then you get him back to sleep using PU/PD.  It's best to start on a weekend, and have someone who is NOT you help get him started. You have the boob, smell like milk, and have the cuddle factor he's going to be looking for. So he'll be thinking " Hey Mom!! This is not how we do things!" and PU/PD takes a lot of energy, which is easier is done by 2 people

The food/sleep issue, you're not going to teach him to cry for the boob, because when he's going to sleep he won't be hungry; once you start feeding after we wakes and not before sleep time. This where it's going to be hard or you, because it's your instinct to give him the boob to get him to sleep. But you have to keep reminding yourself "He is not hungry" and not give him the boob to sleep. Like I said above, he's going to cry for a different reason, that things are being done different.  The fact that you were ably to get him back to sleep last night without the boob is a step forward. He's telling me that he can handle falling asleep on his own

I'm looking forward to hearing how you're doing 

[rebecaq]

Hi Despinatl, Welcome to BW! 

First of all {{{HUGS}}} for going through a tough time with your lo. 

If you are going through similar problems to Yorkshire, then I hope that you can also make the commitment to EASY and help put your lo on a better routine.  I think it's great your keeping a journal to track your baby's day.

Are you familiar with any of the Baby Whisperer methods?

How old is you lo?

- Beca 

[yorkshire]

Hi Despinatl
I know how you are feeling - tired mostly.  My saving grace is that my lo is really nice company in the day and I'm going to bed really early.  Hope you are doing ok.
Beca
Thanks for your time and thoughts.  I see what you are saying about switching the feeding time, but can I just clarify, do you think it is a good idea to start PUPD now with naps but not at night (as I'm waiting for my enlisted help to arrive in a couple of weeks).  Or should I wait and do day and night at the same time?  I think you probably answered this but I'm in a bit of a sleep deprived stupor.  I'm doing a kind of cluster feeding - one around 5 or 6 then again around 6.30 or 7 prior to him falling asleep.

Unfortunately I don't think I will be able to get someone else to do any of the PUPD.  My partner isn't available and I feel it will be too much for my mum physically.  Mind you I'm worried whether I will be able to do it physically aswell.

I will do the Baby quiz and let you know.

Re. the 4 S winddown.  I haven't been swaddling as he doesn't seem to like it now - really wants his arms out. Should I persevere?

Cheers.

Yorkshire

[yorkshire]

How do I find the Baby Quiz?

I think he is a cross between Touchy and Textbook but not sure.  He jumps at noises and is a light sleeper so I think Touchy might win.

[rebecaq]

I think doing PU/PD should be consitant, both day and night. So it depends if you're willing to do it and they way to decide that is by asking yourself how much you're willing to put with.    PU/PD is very taxing, but it fixes things in the long run. So, personally, I would rather have a few hard days/weeks than to always have a baby who has trouble sleeping. that was my mantra when I was doing it " It will be better soon, it will be better soon" 

Sounds like you need a 3S windown!    Some babies don't like or need swaddling, and that's fine. Just do Setting the Stage Sitting Shush Pat. Reme,ber you can twaek things to fit your baby's needs.

Here is the link for the baby quiz 
https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=52283.0

[yorkshire]

Oh I got it wrong.  He is spirited with some textbook and a little touchy.

Wondering whether to try swaddling again?

[rebecaq]

Sweetie,

Santiago would come out of his swaddle while he was in the hospital the day he was born!! We never used it since, I did use a wedge though, but your lo is too big for it.

My recommendations? A white noise, for example a fan, a wave machine etc and to make sure the lowkey activity is VERY LOW KEY and that he "gets" it. Do I explain myself? I had to make the wind down very dramatic for Santiago so he would get it, I'd shout "We're colsing the blinds" and do it dramtically etc. And once the stage was set I would then sit with him and be very slow with my movements, very quiet and soothing with my voice. Sometimes windown would be 30 mins, and all before putting him in his crib!

Yikes, this sounds awful, and for a few weeks it was BUUUUT now that he's much older I walk in th room with him close the blinda and he immediately starts to rub his eyes and suck his fingers. So it definitely paid off!! 

We have a great group for Moms of Spirited Babies in the Birth Clubs