Fed up with the 2-1 switch-need some help!

[jcsmom]

I figured I would create a new thread for some more help. My son will be 17months on the 9th of August and has been going through the 2-1 since the day of his first birthday. No matter what time I put him down for a nap, it is never right as he is so inconsistent. I just never know anymore what time he should nap, go to bed etc. This week, I decided to log to see if I could find a pattern and the only pattern I see is that he is still as inconsistent as ever. Can I ask some of you to look this over and tell me what you think? Yesterday after 5 hours A time at 11:30, he slept 2 hours. Today after 5.5 at 11:30 he slept 49 mins. What gives?
Sat. 26th
wake: 6am (after going down at 6:15pm)
nap: 12-1:15pm
bed:6:30 no NWs

Sun 27th
wake:6am
nap 12-12:36
bed: 6:10pm no NWs

Mon 28th
wake: 6:10 am
nap 12-12:38
bed:5:55pm nw at 5:am

Tues: wake 5:16am
nap 9:43-10:03
nap 12:00-2:00
bed: 6:33pm no NW

Wed
wake: 5:33am
nap 9:40-10:09
nap 12-1:33
bed 6:45pm NW from 9:49-10:20

Thurs:
wake 6:15am
nap 9:43-10:03
nap 12:07-1:15pm
bed 6:30 NW at 11-11:30

Fri
wake 6:55am
nap 11:30-12:46
bed 6:30 no NWs

Sat
wake 6:25am
nap 11:30-1:30
bed 7pm no NWs

Today
wake 6am
nap 11:15 in bed cried until 11:27 wake 12:15 have been doing wi/wo since. OT or UT from so much sleep yesterday?
Seems after logging that the total average for 24 hours is 12 hours and 57 mins. So pretty much what I predicted. Can someone please go through this and help me be more consistent. Please, before I loose my mind!

[coopers_mommy]

I have no advice for you as we are also currently going through this, but I will be checking your thread as you can also check mine for maybe some help there (Sarah/Anyone PLEASE HELP!) 

I do want to send hugs your way...from what I hear, it gets better!

[deckchariot]

The 2 to 1 switch is really a bear!!  I'm sorry it's so rough!  Thanks for posting a week's routine to look at - his naps do seem a bit all over the place  - but there's quite a bit a varying with the A times too.  I know you're probably trying to adjust for him, but I've found that any adjustment in my dd's routine always take a few days to really sort out.

Total sleep at 18 mos is about 11.5 hrs at night and 2 hrs in the day.  I know your ds isn't 18 mos yet, but he's probably somewhere close to that ballpark.  Has he generally been on the low end of sleep?  So if he's waking at 6:30, then your routine from yesterday looks pretty good - nap at 11:30, to bed at 7.  I'd try to stick to that routine for at least 3 days and see what happens with naps.  I know you tried that today and it's not working, but try again tomorrow with 5 hrs of A time and see. 

If he's generally needed less sleep than average, and you're seeing that he's averaging about 13 hrs of sleep total in a 24 hr period, then you could push to 5.5 hrs of A time and see how that goes.  You could then go with either a 7 or 7:30 bedtime depending on how long he naps.

hth
michelle

[jcsmom]

Thanks for replying. Sometimes I just feel like I can't get there. I have tried for days on end to stick to a routine but with his varying nap lengths, wake up in the am and thus bedtime it has been really hard. I used to stick to the clock for his naps and it worked when on 2 naps. He was still inconsistent with nap length on 2 naps but everyday, the total was about the same.

I have been trying to stick to 6am wake 11:1530-1:15/30 nap 7pm bedtime. Problem is, one night he will sleep 12 hours, short nap then early to bed or he will sleep 12 hours plus a 2 hour nap then the next day do 11 plus a short nap. He has always needed much less sleep than his peers. About 30-45mins less than average from about 4 months onward, it has stayed this way. He also moves from being OT to UT in a matter of a day which is why I think I got the short nap today.He was UT not OT. The last 2 days he has gotten more than average with almost 14 hours in 24 both days.

So my questions:
1) Should I just stick with the same nap time and bedtime for a few days in hopes that this forces more consistency even if OT sets in a bit?
2) I know most people wouldn't but should I the day after a decent night/nap should I wake him in order to protect the next day's nap? If he sleeps 12 hours, even to make up for yesterday's lost sleep, his naps run short then bedtime is early then the cycle continues KWIM?
3) Based on yesterday, would I assume that if he wakes at 6am a nap at 11:00-1pm then bed at 7 would suffice? When I pushed him to 12 it totally backfired.

[deckchariot]

it looks like you know your little guy really well - so that's actually the best thing for trying to make it through this switch (not that that helps much right now!) Let's see if I can answer your questions:

1. I would stick with the same hours of A time - that may mean different clock times - for naps and bedtime for at least 3 -5 days to see if that helps.  Since he's always been on the low end of sleep, I'd go with 5.5 hrs of am A time, then nap, then do 5.5 hrs til bedtime and see how that goes.  So if he wakes at 6, nap at 11:30 (hopefully til 1:30), then bedtime at 7.
2.  Since you know that a 12 hr night messes up his day sleep, then yes, I would wake him after an 11 hr night - unless you want to try to extend your day (so it starts later than 6), then I'd wake him at the hour you want to start the day and run your 5.5 hr A time from there.
3.  Pushing him til 12 for a nap would be 6 hrs of A time, and that's probably still a bit much.  I think you probably could have pushed him til 11:30 though.

does that help?  I wish I could make this easier!!!!

[jcsmom]

Thanks again Michelle for replying. I just want to cry as just when things go good, they mess up again the next day. Since I wrote last he has had one good day, then one bad day. Since I last wrote here is what has happened:
Sat
wake 6:30 nap 11:30-1:30 bedtime 7pm no NW
Sun
wake 6am nap 11:30-12:19 booooo I pushed too late I think bedtime 6:30 ( it was too late but we had to go out and had no other choice)no NW
Mon
6am woke him (big mistake as it started this OT cycle again)
nap 11:15-1:05 bedtime 6:45 no NW

Today
EW at 5:20am
nap 11:15-12 woke and cried for a minute woke for good at 12:30 so now OT for sure. So bedtime at 6pm and hope for a 12 hour night?

So you think that I should stick to A times and not clock times? Like today his nap should've been at 10:50 right due to the EW? He was so tired by 11:15  so I know this is why he had an OT nap. It was my fault as we had a mommy group that I needed to go to for MY sanity!

[RACHPEM]

Hi Jc's mom.  We are still struggling over here with Maya, it seems our little ones are connected somehow!!! We get a good day then a bad one, I just wish we got more of the former!  I still dont know which way to go re: clock or A times we are doing clock times at the mo, but are still getting nw's. Will it ever end? I would love to go to bed at an adult hour and know Maya will sleep through, surely it is not too much to ask??
hope you get a good night, sending my love (not my luck as I dont appear to have any, lol!!)
Rachael xx

[jcsmom]

Ahhh, we meet again (and again and again LOL!) Sorry to hear that you are still having problems with Maya. Our little monkeys are making us work, aren't they? Most days I feel like a zombie. I used to go to bed at 9pm but lately I have been staying up later to enjoy the weather, so now I am paying for it!

I think I am going to take deckchariot's advice and stick to A times. We haven't done this since he was about 7months old. But what harm could it do. I know that after 5-5.25 hours A time he takes a good nap but not after 6. So if he wakes at 5:30 and I wait until his by the clock nap at 11:30 it's waaaaay too late and then I get a short nap and early to bed then early to rise not due to early to bed but due to OT. I know it worked for lesorl so I am hoping it will work for us. After reviewing my logs, I do see that after this much A time he has a nice long nap for the most part.

Thanks for sending the love. I really need some right now! Are M's NWs long? We had brutally long and frequent NW's from about 6-10 months then again from 12-14 months all due to accumulated OT. Could this be the case for you? Anyway, lets keep each other company in our misery!

[lesorl]

hey jcsmom- my vote is for A times.  we've had the most success with them...

and i still think the afternoon A time is too long.  if you look at your last few days, when pushing towards 5.5 hours you get an EW.  if you then try to keep the nap at 11:30am, your little guy is way OT.

[jcsmom]

I am going to for sure try it tomorrow. 5.5 A time seems to work if he has had a good nap, if not then we get an EW. Yesterday though he slept almost 2 hours for his nap but was acting tired at like 5:30 pm. Weird. The day before though, he slept only 45 mins and was totally fine until 6:30. I just don't get it. Fingers crossed for a 12 hour night. I am going to try 6 wake 11:15( or 5.25 after waking)-1:15 nap and 6:45 bed ( or 5.5 max after nap, earlier if nap less than 1.5 hours). At this point anything is worth trying since clock times for sure don't work. I have tried for oh, 5 months!

[coopers_mommy]

Just sending some stregthening words your way....Good luck...keep us posted on how it goes.  I enjoy reading other peoples stories as we are still going through the same thing!

[lilmonkey]

May I lurk as well?  We have been at this transition since 10 mos now and I am about to throw in the towel.  I thought that it would be simple as dd's transition was fairly easy.   

[newmama12]

May I lurk, as well? We've been on the transition for about 3 weeks now and it's not as easy as I thought it would be.

[jcsmom]

Misery loves company, so welcome! LOL. It is nice to know that I am not alone. I have really struggled with my son's sleep since he was born battling 30-45 min naps, long NWs, EWs etc. You name it, we've had it! I have been going through the transition since 12 months or earlier if you count nap refusals and short naps/EWs due to UT etc.

Last night I put him down at 6pm. He could've gone at 5:30pm but it just wasn't possible. He was off at 6:06pm and I heard him call "momma" at 5:30am. Not bad, I thought, then he was quiet. I heard "momma" again at 6:00 am then quiet then again at 6:20am! I assume he was sleeping as once he is awake, he is loud and calls for us over and over. I am going to give him a nap at 11:30am since we have had the most luck with about 5-5.25 A time and hope that since he is rested from last night it will be a nice long one.

[deckchariot]

hang in there ladies!!!  The switch is certainly a trying time - believe me!!!  Here's a support thread you can check out as well:  http://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=129650.0

I would definitely go with A times rather than clock times.  The key is figuring out roughly how much day & night sleep your bubs need, then work the day around that (ie.  11 hr night, 2 hr nap, 12 hr night 2.5 hr nap etc).  The EWs are part the gig with the switch......if the first nap is really bad and your lo is up really early, you can offer a catnap in the afternoon or do early bedtime (or both!).  Hang in there!!!