don't make food a battleground

[Inara]

But what does that mean, exactly?  I don't want to "force" my daughter to eat food I know she doesn't like, but I also don't want her to exclusively eat processed foods, either.  So what approach is recommended if you give your child dinner, and they ask for something else?  My daughter is 18 months old.  For a while we've been able to do well with setting things up for success - giving her things we know she likes, but that are good, to forestall protest.  But sometimes, and more lately, she'll object even if we KNOW she likes it.  When she was younger we'd just end the meal, and then resume maybe 15 minutes later with a different food, figuring she wouldn't make the connection.  But she's old enough now that I figure she can get the concept, so three times now when that's happened I've told her she needs to eat at least one bite before she can have anything else (she's requesting things like pear or banana, not fish sticks.  Yet.).  All three times, once she'd had that first bite she then remember she loved it, ate it all, and asked for more.  But the first time her fussing lasted only a minute.  The second a few minutes.  Tonight she really went nuts over it, but we'd already made our statement so stuck it through.  I don't want to go through this every night, but I likewise don't want to teach her that if she complains she can have what she wants.  So what does everyone do?

[~Sarah~]

No ideas, but I need to follow.  DS is getting worse and I have not put ANY pressure on him.

[Peek-a-boo]

For dinner, we make one meal, we make sure that there is at least some portion of it that each child has eaten in the past.  We serve it and when they are done--even if they've eaten nothing--we let them ask to be excused.  We don't make alternative food options.  If they ask for food later, we cheerfully offer to warm up left overs from dinner, but there is no other food offered. 

We don't make a battle ground in that we don't argue, bribe, coax, etc to try to get them to eat what is served, but we also don't become short order cooks and whip up something new to suit their whim.

I do think it's important to keep up the setting-up-for-success strategies by offering a variety of foods at each meal--some old some new, always at least one thing you know LO will eat. 

[Katet]

Both DH & I were limited eaters, my brother wasn't... but is now as an adult, while I eat almost everything now as an adult

My 'rule' for meals has always been to have 5 things on a plate a mix of 1-2 I know will get eaten, 1-2 should be eaten & 1-2 that probably won't get eaten... at least 4 things have to have been attempted before more of the prefered food is given.

My Ds1 (7.5y) won't eat fish certain ways (only really eats calamari) but he has tried it, DS2 loves fish, so say on the night we have fish that I have done differently or he hasn't eaten before I will put the fish, potatoes, beans, lettuce, cheese he will generally eat all but the fish, but as he won't have the protein from fish, he has it from cheese. DS2 won't eat chicken casserole, so for DS2 (5) I put it on (if I'm doing a new recipe) with say rice, 2 veg & ham, so he gets protien from the ham. Sometimes the veg does or doesn't get eaten but they don't get more potato/ham, cheese or what ever without eating the all 4 of the foods I know they do eat regularly.

So my suggestion would be put the meal out with say 1/4 pear or banana & some of other foods & then you know they have eaten something, but if they want more of them they need to eat more of the other foods.

My logic of allowing them to leave an item on the plate is that they have learnt not to make a fuss about a food they don't like & to just leave it on the side of their plates if they go to someone elses place ... it is nice to be able to say to a friend family, "if they dont' like it they will just leave it on the side of their plate" & know their won't be a fuss of "I don't like it" & also I was brought up on the school of "eat ALL of the food on your plate" & having been at a restaurant last night... that isn't a healthy option when the serves are huge, so I kind of feel I am also teaching them to eat appropriately to appetite rather than what I think they should.

A toddler won't starve themselves & they do get to a stage they live on "air" & also I've found (until he started school) that DS2 ate 80% of his food before 1pm, so I stopped worrying if he didn't eat anything for the evening meal.

[~Sarah~]

That is great and all and that is what I do (for the most part) but what do you do when they stop eating the foods they have eaten before?
DS is 23mo and we are now down to: frzen corn and peas, nuts, any cracker (but he is only allowed these at playgroup or if we are out shopping to try to get him to eat other stuff), yogurt, eggy toast, cheese. He used to eat PBJ, but now just licks off the topping, same with grilled chz, he even sucks the butter off toast.  He will eat fresh fruit (most of it) but absoltely NO meat...none!  I have tried every shape and form. Not even nuggets...I even tried McDonalds buger (which is against every food belief I haveK and that wouldn't even get touched.  For a few months around 18mo he ate imitation crab...but now won't touch it.

Blah...after writing this I think I should start my own thread :p

[We Three]

Amelia won't eat meat either, never has (and I hated it when I was pg, so go figure! She even hated it before she was born LOL!) and she is really healthy.  I REALLY followed a "start as you mean to go on" approach with foods...if she were to go on a hunger strike and only eat toast, well we have the best bread there is with 3 grams of fiber per slice! If she will only eat pasta, the only kind I bought was whole grain with flax seed...waffles are organic whole grain, etc. 
With meat...well, I figure there are tons of vegetarians and they can be healthy.  She eats eggs, chick peas, yogurt, milk, cheese, tons of fresh vegetables and fruit. I still offer meat...she just recently ate a few pieces of meatloaf because I gave her a "dipping pond" of ketchup.  And she will eat my "noodle soup" which is really chicken noodle soup, but the chicken is ground into dust so she doesn't see it.  She recently asked for a "Daddy sandwhich" for lunch...sliced turkey and cheese.    So you never know!

[Peek-a-boo]

Sarah--I'd just keep offering in small portions so you don't feel bad about the waste and, like Ann, make sure each item offered is of high nutritional value, so whatever he does pick he's getting some nutrients.

If it's something LO has eaten in the past, even if it's been a while, then I consider it a viable option for the--this is your dinner option item.

For me, the only time we don't just give the kids what we're eating for dinner is if it's a chewy meat--like roast, steak, etc.  Then we make them an alternative meat. 

[~Sarah~]

Thanks girls and honestly I am doing all of the things you said.  I am an organic mom(hence the horror I felt at McD's) and I also do non-GMO's, so what he gets is high quality.

I actually give him everything we eat (tried the ketchup dip, he just eats the ketchup) on the big portion of his plate and on the sides he gets a veg he will eat and fruit.  SAme thing, I keep his plate the way he leaves it and if he asks for food later he gets what is left..although I will give him a slice of cheese or toast if he has not had much othe stuff during the day.

Honestly I don't make it a big deal to him never say "You have to eat this"  the only thing I might ask is that he just try to lick it...for some reason he will do this, but will not take bites.  So I figure I will start small and keep trying.

he only time we don't just give the kids what we're eating for dinner is if it's a chewy meat--like roast, steak, etc.  Then we make them an alternative meat.

Funny thing is with DD (11mo) she LOVES all these things (did BLW with her)  She is all carnivore all the time!   But honestly she will eat anything you put in fornt of her without a fuss. Oh well, I'll keep trying

[Shdef]

For dinner, we make one meal, we make sure that there is at least some portion of it that each child has eaten in the past.  We serve it and when they are done--even if they've eaten nothing--we let them ask to be excused.  We don't make alternative food options.  If they ask for food later, we cheerfully offer to warm up left overs from dinner, but there is no other food offered. 

Yeah, that. And yes, Scotty lived off apples, cucumber and fresh air for a year 

But it's good now

[Peek-a-boo]

Truly, their caloric needs drop so much at this age as their growth levels off, I think they just need way less food than we think.  The old dieting adage is that your stomach is the size of your fist, so size quantity of food is all you need to fill it.  Look at a two-year old's fist.  It's not very big. 

I find that my kids really only eat two meals a day.  They eat one big meal (usually breakfast) and then spread out the equivalent of a meal (in my mind) over a lunch they pick at, a dinner they pick at, and a little snack or two.  Periodically they go through growth spurts when they will eat a lot and they also tend to try new things then too.  I find it helps to limit juice intake so they use their calories for food and also to be careful not to let snacks get out of control.  DD is trying to live on pretzels as the moment, so I've stopped buying them. 

[Katet]

Truly, their caloric needs drop so much at this age as their growth levels off, I think they just need way less food than we think.  The old dieting adage is that your stomach is the size of your fist, so size quantity of food is all you need to fill it.  Look at a two-year old's fist.  It's not very big. 

totally agree with that.

A few things to note.

look at food across a week not a day, if they have protein (excluding dairy) 2-3 times/week then they are getting enough, if they eat 1/2 an apple as a toddler that is 2 fruit serves, 1 slice of bread is 4 slices for an adult... so if you translate that all to adult quantities, then a toddler living on 2 slices of bread, 2 whole peices of fruit, some veg, and then dairy, you actually have given them their food for the day.

Also how much milk is a big thing. my friend with a 2yo was commenting on his food intake... his milk intake was 900 ml(30 oz) is about 60% of the food intake of a 2yo, no wonder not wanting to eat much.

This is an interesting point I found a while back on the Australian huggies site to help my friend as her DD was Breast fed, but her DS wasn't & she never knew what her DD took at 18mo because she was still BF...
Just small amounts of energy-dense milk can fill a little tummy quickly. Feeling sated, your little one might turn away from other foods and meals, thereby causing them to become deficient in other nutrients. For example, toddlers and young children require between 1200 and 1500 calories a day. If a two-year-old drinks just 300ml of milk, they’ve consumed 20% of all their calories for that day – from just one food source.
Too much calcium – which can add up quickly in a child’s case – can interfere with iron absorption, which in turn has been linked to fussy eating.

[~Sarah~]

Too much calcium – which can add up quickly in a child’s case – can interfere with iron absorption, which in turn has been linked to fussy eating.

Very interesting!  I have known that we do quite a bit of dairy and I have been limiting for awhile but he still may get up to 24oz some days (just straight milk not including cheese or yogurt) but most days around 16oz

DH and I had fish and chips for lunch (take out) and DS asked for some he put it in his mouth spit it out (too hot for his liking..more than luke warm) but then picked it back up and ate it!!  I was beside myself with shock!

The big difference...he had a SUPER physically active morning.  I sometimes think this might play into the problem as well.  Winter here so a lot of indoor not using big muscle group kind of play.  Plus with my 11mo we can't go outside if it is too cold etc.. S
So maybe he just is not building enough hunger through play??  I also can tell if he is not getting enough big muscle play as he sleeps poor as well.

Opening my own eyes through this discussion...Thanks all!!

[We Three]

TOTALLY agree with the milk point.  My dd suffers from chronic constipation, and has for her entire life...when I studies what she was eating, it was all good stuff, enough fiber, etc. BUT...with 3 servings of milk a day, plus a yogurt and some occasional cheese, she was far more than doubling her calcium needs for the day. Now I see to it that she never exceeds 16 ounces of milk a day...and seriously I also think it's why she has such a great appetite! 

[Mom to M&M]

ITA on the milk point and that helped some with DD BUT DS is a picky eater, with a low appetite and already only drinks 12 ounces milk/day tops plus most days a yogurt. I'm hoping as it gets warmer out and he has more physical activity and outdoor time/fresh air it might help some. Otherwise I just try to make the little he does eat healthy - though he recently dropped fresh fruit it seems...

[Tweakster]

I don't make alternate meals, and no time to make meals that have 4 or 5 different offerings.  There's only 3 of us, 2 of us working full-time and commuting and most of the time DH and I have had a big lunch (we do most of our protein and grains at lunch) and are only really interested in sandwiches or whatever for dinner.  On weekends I might make a larger meal, a family favourite or whatever.  No one really cares if I cook or not so I don't bother most of the time.  Maybe when DS is older he'll be more interested in what is served and then he can help :-) 

I pick F up after daycare and most days he's already had a second breakfast at daycare, a snack, a lunch and 2 additional snacks before I pick him up.  So I will often just offered cut up veg or fruit or pasta (which he will normally eat in a pinch) or scrambled eggs or just toast.  I often serve just toast with different toppings.  Cheese. 

If I cook we eat at the table, if not then it's just little bowls of various things on the table he can nibble on while he plays.

When shopping I am very cautious about sugar content and sodium and other things.  I have heard enough about HFCS to do my head in.  So we look for things without sugar, organic or not, and whole grains.  Fresh fruit and veg.  And that's pretty much it.

If he's not ill or teething (which is finally over!), he'll eat very nearly adult portions of food.  He's always asking for more even if he still has food on his plate!  We're not quite sure what to do about that one lol 

He honestly does not need much but if you offer food he will most likely eat it.  I'm thinking of stopping offering so many snacks (which we tend to use as distraction when we are out) or at least waiting until he asks for it.  This whole serving thing is getting old :-)

I just really don't worry about it much.  When he totally goes off food I do tend to freak out a bit, but he always comes back to it again.  So they are just phases and we go with the flow.  He's in no danger of starving for sure and is a big eater when he does eat.

Both DH and I are extremely picky and don't have exotic palates so we have a very boring rotation of food.  But it covers everything we're supposed to have.  And I think the same will go for DS.  We're just not a food family, partially from how DH and I grew up and partially because the lack of time.

The whole 'leave it on the side of the plate' never worked for me as a kid, I got teased and tormented for being 'picky' no matter what house I was at.  Eventually I just stopped wanting to go to houses for dinner because of the whole stress of it.  I don't want my kid to be a picky eater but I also feel like a person should decide for themselves what they like and don't like.  And there were times where I would literally rather not eat than to eat what was on offer.  I've managed to make it through life thus far, as has DH and so I know DS will too, whatever he decides :-)