EWs:Tips on teaching your child how to sleep past 5:30am :(

[Grants]

Hi ladies, It is me again  

DS is a chronic early riser. He is always up between 5 and 5:30am. I have tried everything to change it and nothing works. Late naps doesn’t make a difference and makes BT very difficult as he needs a long A time before BT. I hate the idea of late BTs as we end up not having time for ourselves and DS doesn’t tack on anyway and wakes up at 5:30am regardless of late BT. He has a Groclock for 10 months and it doesn’t work to keep him in bed. His nights are normally between 9.5 and 10.5 hours but if and when we do a late BT he sleeps less and is still up at 5:30am.

Anyway…we are at a point that we accept his EWs. We just go to bed earlier to be able to cope with the early start. However, DS used to wake up happy and in a good mood. But now he is soooo miserable and cranky in the mornings. Today he was crying for everything, lying on the floor in the dark. This morning after been up for only 20 minutes he said to us “more sleep”. It was 5:50am and it was pitch black, instead of staying in bed and sleep he chooses to get up and be cranky . This morning after he said that he needed more sleep we tried to rock him, put him in our bed. He just wouldn’t take it. Then he said “go downstairs” . So to a certain extent he knows he is tired but he doesn’t know how to sleep past 5:30am Any tips? I just don’t know what else to do? I’m hoping that one day he just decides to sleep past 5:30am ….

[*Becky*]

so with the clock - what does he do? What time is it set for? What do you do when he wakes early?

[anna*]

What Becky said - I think the Groclock only works if you have a solid strategy for what you will do when he wakes before the sunshine.

[Grants]

We leave him for about 15 or 20 mins at most. But we can't leave him for too long as he screams the house down. So the clock was set for 5:45am for a long time, as he used to have NWs, but I have changed it this week for 5:30am as he is STTN and is waking up between 5 and 5:10am instead if 5:30. I even cover the clock with a muslim square in the hope that the yellow light of Mr Sunshine won't disturb him. But he always wakes up before the light and won't go back to sleep

[anna*]

Personally I think it's because he knows if he screams you'll come and get him...
I know how horrible it is (believe me, I've been there) but honestly at this age it can be a power struggle thing.

[Grants]

I don't think it's a power struggle TBH. I do have my power struggles with him. BT and picky eating are the main power struggles we have. But his inability to fall asleep again in the morning seems to be a genuine problem. We have tried setting the clock for past 6am. He screamed the house down, cried really hard and was deeply upset. We did this for 4 days. We didn't go in before the clock and left him for longer. It didn't change his response and after the forth day I just set the clock to a shorter wait. I just can't bear the drama at that time in morning and we also have neighbours to consider . Plus the whole screaming and crying was not helping him to fall asleep again .How many days are you suggesting to leave him crying until he gets it? He is tired. He needs the sleep but he just doesn't know how to go back to sleep in the morning  

[anna*]

Does he know how to put himself back to sleep - does he know how to get into bed by himself and put his covers back on? Can you rehearse with him - role play - so he knows what to do when he wakes up and sees the moon? Have you tried wake to sleep? Ruled out two year molars?

Thing is, whether he goes back to sleep or not isn't really the point. What he needs to do is know how to stay quiet until he sees the sun. If he is genuinely hard wired to wake at 5am, there's not much you can do about that - but he is old enough to play quietly for a while, and to learn that screaming because he wants to get up is not OK.

[*Becky*]

Thing is, whether he goes back to sleep or not isn't really the point. What he needs to do is know how to stay quiet until he sees the sun. If he is genuinely hard wired to wake at 5am, there's not much you can do about that - but he is old enough to play quietly for a while, and to learn that screaming because he wants to get up is not OK.

this.
We probably went through 2-3 months of issues like this before H accepted the clock and tbh sometimes it was not pretty but for us it was non-negotiable. Sunshine not up then you stay in your room.

[Grants]

Anna, he is still in his cot so he can't get out, thank God for that! He does know how to fall asleep independently. He also knows how to put his covers back on. Our moon is completely off. He is sensitive to light so we don't have a night light otherwise it would disturb him. He knows/accept the clock. We have the clock for 10 months. He does know how to stay quiet for about 20 mins but after that he just doesn't want to wait.

Anna and Becky How long do your Los wait for the clock? Isn't it unreasonable to expect a 2 YO to wait in the dark for 45 mins until the clock? I know angels or even textbooks would happily wait for a hour but is it reasonable to expect it from a spirited ? How long would you say for his age and temperament ?

[anna*]

Anna and Becky How long do your Los wait for the clock? Isn't it unreasonable to expect a 2 YO to wait in the dark for 45 mins until the clock? I know angels or even textbooks would happily wait for a hour but is it reasonable to expect it from a spirited ? How long would you say for his age and temperament ?

I think if he can manage 20 mins then set the clock for 20 mins after his normal wake up time and get a good run of several days where he stays quiet until the sunshine, and gets loads of praise for doing so. Set up a good run of success. Then push the time out s-l-o-w-l-y... 5 mins every 3 days or so... until you're up to maybe 40 mins.

Does he have something to occupy him when he wakes? Maybe you could sneak some books into his cot when you go to bed so that when he wakes early he does have something to look at.

If he's eventually getting to say 40 mins waiting, and he's still not falling back to sleep, then I think it's either molars, or just a hardwired early bird.

[Grants]

That's exactly what I do. I set the clock for about 15-20 mins after his wake up time and he does get loads of praise for waiting. It's hard to get consistency with him though. He is an irregular child. Irregular for everything: hunger, bowel movements, wake up time etc... *sign*  

Deep down I know he is a hardwired early bird. We sort of accepted that when he was waking up in a good mood but now he clearly needs more sleep as his behaviour is shocking in the mornings but he won't relax and sleep again after he had a ' full night of sleep'

[shivi]

hi Grants,

20 mins after not before his wake-up time is important for sure.

with Oscar, things went to pot AFTER the molars were through.

How much overall sleep is he getting?

Emma is a totally different type of spirited, her evenings go to pot when OT or UT but her mornings are usually fab.

When Ozzie was waking at the crack of dawn we'd do the 20,30,40 mins extension but at 6am (with a 5-5.30 wake up) we'd take him down for brekkie. Oscar was very independent - used to playing by himself very well from early on. This helped the EWings. Emma wouldn't be so good, even now she screams out for us the minute she wakes up...

S x

[Tweakster]

Deep down I know he is a hardwired early bird.

It's easier if you accept this.  DH and I have.  F stays in his room, and does his thing, until sunshine is on.  If he screams and kicks up a fuss (rare) then we just remind him that it's quiet time until the sun is on.  And that's all.  I'm ok with the screaming though.  Consistency has been our only friend through this EW malarkey and sad to say it hasn't gotten better.  Any nap transition or change sets us back and we end up back to 5:30 again.  We do what we can to tweak and optimize his night, but at the end of the day, we can't make him sleep longer at night.  We just can't.

I do still agree with the ladies, things got marginally better for us after teeth, only just fell apart recently.  So there's hope

[Grants]

Thanks for sharing Shiv Yes. I set the clock for  20 mins*after* his wake up time. I have edited it. I didn’t realise I wrote that. Lol

quote author=shivi link=topic=217522.msg2321299#msg2321299 date=1316370746]How much overall sleep is he getting?[/quote]

He normally gets 10 hours night and 1 hour nap (and sometimes, once or twice a week, I try to offer him an earlier and longer nap at home to keep the OT away).He was much happier this morning as he had a better night, no NWs, than the night before.

Quote from: Grants on Yesterday at 02:04:56 PMDeep down I know he is a hardwired early bird.It's easier if you accept this.  DH and I have.

We had accepted it. But he has been in an awful mood in the mornings. So it was hard for him and us to cope with the behaviour. Remember that video you posted of F in the morning Wendy? He was acting like that And I was shocked to hear him saying “more sleep” just after  been awake for 20 mins    But this morning he was better! Phew. He is also going through a GS and I do think his molars are moving under the gums *sign* 

If he is genuinely hard wired to wake at 5am, there's not much you can do about that -

This^^^^

We do what we can to tweak and optimize his night, but at the end of the day, we can't make him sleep longer at night.  We just can't.

And this ^^^^^

I *know* he is an early riser. It was just the bad behaviour and crankiness that was worrying me. But if you ladies tell me that there isn’t anything I can do to help that . So be it.. It is one of those things....

[barbaraz78]

Grants, I don't remember: why his nap is for 1 h and not more? Does he wake up by himself? Isn't it possible that he only needs to catch up, and he can't do it in the morning because of the EW, so he would need a longer nap?