Really unsure of what to do to help him :(

[Kfro]

Hi,

My little boy is 6 months old. Up until he was four months old he was a champion sleeper at night but his naps were awful. Then the four month regression hit us and everything was horrendous! I managed to get his naps back on track by spending a lot of time in his room and doing a modified version of ssh pat. I managed to get him doing two long naps and a cat nap and we were able to move to a four hour easy. His naps went a little wonky when I weaned the swaddle but I got him back on track. Recently we have been approaching the 3-2 transition and I have been gradually increasing his a time. We are currently at 2 hours 50 minutes (apart from his last a before bed which is usually 2 hours 40) and have managed a fair few two nap days. He is having a lot of night wakings however. The past couple of nights he has gone down easily at bedtime and has put himself to sleep within ten minutes but has then woken up three to four times within the first four hours of the night. Some of these can be settled using just my voice and some require a couple of pupd. He then sleeps a good stretch until he has his nf. Yesterday was the first day of needing a cn for quite a few days and he slept well for the first two and a half hours and then woke up every hour for three hours. He then had a good five hour stretch but woke up at four thirty and was messing about in his crib. I fed him and put him back down but fifty minutes later he was still messing about so I had to go back in to help him settle (using ssh pat). Are these wakings due to overtiredness that is inevitable during the transition and I just need to push through them? Do they mean I should reduce his a times back down? Or are they more likely to be discomfort? He has just started on solids and is also recovering from a cold so wasn't sure if these could be a factor? He is also rolling about all over the place and has just decided that he wants to sleep on his tummy (I always put him down on his back but he rolls onto his tummy before I have even closed the door to his room). He seems to move about a lot in his sleep and sometimes inadvertently rolls back onto his back and this upsets him. So you see I am very confused about what the problem is and just want to make sure that I am helping him get the sleep he needs. The maximum sleep he seems to ever get is 14 hours in 24 and I notice this is the lower end of the scale so I am worried it isn't enough.

Thank you in advance to anyone who can help x

[newkidontheblock]

We are currently at 2 hours 50 minutes (apart from his last a before bed which is usually 2 hours 40) and have managed a fair few two nap days. He is having a lot of night wakings however. The past couple of nights he has gone down easily at bedtime and has put himself to sleep within ten minutes but has then woken up three to four times within the first four hours of the night.

Oh, we had this exact same thing happen during the 3-2! I was stumped as she would nap well and go off to sleep just fine..but then we'd get wakings between BT & DF. It was the Ot that had accumulated as an inevitable part of this transition. It had nothing to even do with the day in question but many days over time. In fact, I soon realised, that it wasn't just about good naps & being in bed on time but I had to look at the total amount of day sleep she was getting.  After totalling up her day sleep, we realised that on days when she had slept 3+ hours, we did not have any NWs but if it was less, we'd have this occurring. It took two weeks of consistently long naps to get over the OT but I still had to keep an eye on sleep totals after that. Just keep moving forward, honey, and maybe try to see what his necessary amount of day sleep is and take it from there.

Hope this helps you out:)

[Kfro]

Thank you so much for your reply.

From looking at my logs I think he needs between 3 hours 30 and 3 hours 45. I will give this a go. If he wakes from his second nap and he hasn't had this amount would you try for a catnap to make up the extra day sleep? Even if an ebt could be achieved?

[newkidontheblock]

I would avoid the catnap altogether as it will only increase the length of day yk? So if need 3.30-45 sleep in 12 hours (that seems like a lot though -- what is the total sleep in 24 hours?), if you find it coming short, go for an earlier bedtime and reduce the length of day. That worked great for us!

[Kfro]

He has been hovering around 14 hours. On days where he has had more than 3 hours 45 minutes he has done shorter nights so I have figured that was too much day sleep. Less than 3.5 seemed to result in more early night wakings but I only seem to get between ten and ten and a half hour nights regardless

[newkidontheblock]

There are many babies that get by with shorter nights and make it up with day sleep. The reason I was asking is that it won't be easy (will it?) to get 3.30 day sleep with 2 naps. You would *have* to get a 2 hour nap + 1.5. I wonder if gradually he will do longer nights after he is done with this transition

[Kfro]

A longer night would be lovely! I would love him to do eleven hours but I haven't found the perfect amount of day sleep that leads to that yet!

Yes it does mean a 2 hour nap and a 1.5 hour nap. I don't always get that but days where I do tend to lead to better nights. Once he is on a 3 hour a time I will likely have to limit it though as otherwise the day will get too long.

It all just feels very messy at the moment and I am never sure whether I should keep pushing his a times so that we can get to three hours and then see if it will stabilise. I'm just worried about pushing him too far when he seems to already be getting overtired.

[newkidontheblock]

So hold at this point then. If you are getting 1.5 hour nap lengths, that's fair enough. If they start shortening, you can slowly increase by 5-10 minutes?

[Kfro]

Ok.

This might be a stupid question but is it possible for him to be having nw's early in the night due to ot from the transition and be having wakings in the early morning due to needing his first a time to be increased? Or is it more likely that the early morning waking is due to ot too?

[Kfro]

He had a good night last night and only cried out at 315 at which point I fed him and then he went straight back to sleep.... But he was up and raring to go at 5! I left him in his cot until six but he made no attempt to go back to sleep. If this is due to needing a bump in his first a how do I go about it when he was playing in his cot for an hour? If I count this time as a time he will be going down very early and surely that will only encourage the early waking?

[newkidontheblock]

I'm not so experienced to be sure of anything, hun. My understand is that EMWs can be reinforced by the first nap of the day being too early -- basically, they see it as a continuation of night sleep. I wouldn't think that would count with an A of 3 hours+
IMO, 3 hours is already on the higher side for a 5 mo, and if you are getting long naps and he is settling independently, then your timings are fine. Would you like to post your routine?

ETA
Just saw your post:) Glad you had a good night but bleh for EW. When he WU, he played for an hour without needing you? What is normal WU? Let's have a look at your routine..maybe there is a clue in there

[Kfro]

He is six months not five. Yesterday's easy was:

Wu 630
E650
A 7-920
S 920-1120
E 1125
A 1135-210
S 210-345
E 350
E 550
S 625 (in bed at 615 but took ten mins to settle.

He is having solids one hour after the first and second milk feeds

[newkidontheblock]

Only time for a quick post - will post on your routine later. But I did find A times jumping so very quickly between 5 & 6 months. We went from 2.10 to 3.20 in 3 weeks, I think

[newkidontheblock]

Your day looks perfect, hun. How I envy your long naps! We were lucky to get even one good nap at that time! You really feel an increase is needed, even with the 2 hour nap?

[Kfro]

I just don't know anymore. I couldn't work out why he was waking so much at night when I felt his day was ok. I thought it might be that he is on the lsn side and could only do 10.5 hour night max meaning that he needs a longer day than the one he has when we do two naps. Therefore I need to keep pushing his a times up. I have really messed up over the past couple of days though and he is massively overtired now so pushing a times is impossible.