new to this - just starting - and a total mess

[rebecaq]

Hi there,

Just thought you'd like to know that babies don't do much other than sleep for the first 6 weeks. It's normal to be tough to put her on a routine right now.  I think it's great you're going through the motions but she won't really start to "get" it until the 6 week mark.

- Beca 

[deemum]

hi stacy just want to wish you all the best. my dd is 10 weeks now and i went through very similar problems to you at that stage. all i can say is the advice you have been given her about 2hr easy etc is worth trying, it worked for me. i was a mess some days and these message boards were a saviour. best of luck
Dee

[* Paula *]

Stacy,

How are a things going?

[eliana]

well...last night was good - went down no issues at 8 - dream feed at 11 and then another feed at 3 and 6 - but we are still not really able to follow the easy during the day - we try but its hit and miss....i did a yield - i think at best i have 3 oz both breasts - i have decided to bf during the day and supplement but only formula at night and i will pump in the middle of the night too.  i hope that the amount of BM that I am able to supply is benefiting her - i think in total all day she may get 6 oz's and that includes the 3 that i have pumped (from 2 pumping sessions) - last night in the middle of the night i was able to pump 2 oz so that is why i think i yield 3.

My days are feed, and then almost immediate she wants to sleep but then only for about 20 minutes and then activity, feed, sleep.....so i know its not perfect but we are still going to plug away.

thanks for the support!!

[* Paula *]

I am going to ask one of the BF mods to have a look at your post and see if they can give you some more advice.

Paula x

[finlays mam]

Hi eliana, is there a reason why your pead would recommend a bath x2 week?... just to say i have bathed my lo every night since he was born.  The reason for this is it gives him a lovely routine before bed and my hubbie loves getting involved.  The other thing is it really distracted fin if he was having a meltdown.  some top tips tho is when you put your lo in the bath gently put his feet in first so he knows whats coming. We use one of these plastic supports so your hands are free and he will also feel 'safe' lastly, put a flannel/washcloth  or hand over his tummy and keep sponging warm water over, this also gives them the feeling of being safe.  i hadn't started EASY straight away but i did do this strict bedtime routine and Fin is great with it then we worked on the other aspects of his day. It would also relax fin 'coz we just do wind down as soon as he gets in the bath. Things are by no means perfect but we have a nice end to the day. 

just a thought

Debbie x

[ninasteven]

Hi!  My little wonder is 9 weeks old.  The first few weeks was rough trying to figure out a schedule. I must say, I have an angel baby.  However, some days he is not that way.  I was told not to bath him more than 2x a week as well.  Well, I think that is .  My baby LOVES the bath. Once he was having a particularly fussy evening and I had cluster fed till my boobs were raw, so I decided to give him a bath.  He played in the bath for 30min and loved it.  It tires him out.  He usually falls asleep for the next 7 hours within 30 min of the bath.  I have to swaddle him and rock him and then he is out.  So, I don't think having a bath every evening is bad for them. I am religious with it now.  We are living in an RV right now as we save for a house. So, schedules,etc, are tough due to a serious lack of space.  I agree that you need to follow your babies' clues.  Really pay attention and they will let you know what they need.  Ultimately, they have a dirty bum, they have gas, or they are hungry.  I just did those cycles and it eventually worked out.  However, it does seem like I just get a schedule going and it changes.   like now, he goes to bed at 7pm, DF at 2am then wide awake at 5am, wanting to play. I'm not jiggy with that schedule, so I am in the process of changing it. I could go on, baby is sleeping  instead I will shower!
Good luck to everyone, it does get easier.

[Samuel's mum]

Hi there
A bf mod here. So I'm just going to focus on the feeding aspect if that's OK.

I'd firstly say that although a yield can be a useful exercise in some ways it doesn't always represent what you are actually giving baby when they feed. A baby is so much more efficient at extracting milk because of the wave-like motion from their lower jaw and a pump really struggles to come close. Some people are successful pumpers but some nursing mothers don't even get a proper 'letdown'. I know many successful nursing mothers who struggle to even get an oz and hear their own baby glugging milk down for 15 minutes during a feed. So don't use a yield as the only indication of supply. There are good tips about pumping here:
http://www.pumpingmoms.org .However don't forget that the hormone prolactin which governs milk supply is stimulated by this wave-like motion and that means the more feeding at the breast you can do the better.

Any amount of breastmilk your baby gets makes a difference - even if it is only a few oz - but I bet it's more than you think.

I said that a yield isn't the best indicator of supply. Your baby is infact your main guide. I'd ask when you feed her do you hear clear swallowing noises and see a pause in her chin movements when she takes a swallow? Also how does a feed end? Does she break off seeming satisfied? Are you the one to end a feed? Do you feel she is falling asleep before a feed has finished? If you weren't supplementing I'd also ask you about wet nappies.

If she's waking up hungry after 20 minutes and you feel supply is an issue then there are a few things to consider:
Make sure you are eating and drinking enough yourself.
Do consider talking to a helpline (there are numbers on the bf FAQ page). They can talk to you about baby's latch (just incase it needs fine tuning) and give you good advice about how to boost your supply.
Although pumping is helpful and it's great you are pumping at night. It would help your supply and your prolactin levels if you did a night feed (prolactin levels are highest at night which is one positive thing about people who have to night feed!). You just might want to think about making perhaps the 3am a breastfeed if you can. You could ask the helpline more about that.
When you supplement just make sure you are offering the breast first. You might also want to consider something called breast compression which can make feeds more efficient and increase the fat content of your milk. You can read more about that here: http://www.kellymom.com/newman/15breast_compression.html

There is a mixed feeding thread on the bottle feeding board which you may find useful as you can talk to people about their experiences in combining formula and breastfeeding. Plenty of people mix feed successfully. If you want to try and return to more breastfeeding then I'm not sure what professional help you've had so far but it might be possible to increase your supply with some tips from a five minute conversation on a helpline. If you feel mixed feeding is the way forward then remember Tracy herself was very supportive of people who chose that route and you'll find plenty of people on these boards to help you.

[eliana]

Thank you so much for the post on BF, Emma.  I believe that I have tried everything possible to increase my supply including supplements, spending the day in bed doing nothing but feeding and sleeping to drinking brown beer and whatever else the LC suggested to me.

A few unknowns are that my baby was conceived by IVF and fertility issues can sometimes be a factor with supply per my LC and I also have an auto immune disease- while nothing is definite they say this may affect my supply....would you know anything about this?

my baby does not seem satisfied ever after a feed and that is hard for me to see - while i feel like my body is failing me (again!) i also worry about her calorie intake.  I still plan to put her on as often as I can and will pump daily to insure that she is getting at least 3-6oz of BM a day.

ON A DIFFERENT NOTE:

I think a bath is to stimulating for my LO - she seems to be WIDE AWAKE after!  Last night after her bath we did her nighttime routine and feed and put her down - but it took us 3 hours to settle her - by then it was time for the DF which she took but was still awake but fell asleep half way through and finished sleeping.....so i am still SO CONFUSED about her getting her down for the night - I almost think it may just be that she wants to be up until 10 or 11 - what should i do??

her days are good - with a "loose" 3 hour EASY -

She will be 6 wks on Wednesday.

Thank you all for all of your help and guidance.

Stacy

 

[finlays mam]

what time do you usually bath her?

Debbie x

[eliana]

at 7pm

[finlays mam]

i know you said you find the bath too stimulating but have you thought of doing it earlier and then wind down time becomes a little longer and it falls into the A time? we bath fin at 1815ish and he then goes down roughly at 1915ish but he also has a good kick around and splashes and he did this when he was weeks old... just a thought stacy, it doesn't suit everyone.

Debbie x

[Samuel's mum]

A few unknowns are that my baby was conceived by IVF and fertility issues can sometimes be a factor with supply per my LC and I also have an auto immune disease- while nothing is definite they say this may affect my supply....would you know anything about this?

I'm afraid I don't know much about this. I've never heard of a connection between IVF and lactation and I would have expected to have come across a reference to it (I've just finished a study module on supply issues for my course to be a breastfeeding counsellor). If your body had a pregnancy and gave birth then all the hormones required were produced. I'm not clear how there is a connection. I don't know anything about auto-immune disease.

I believe that I have tried everything possible to increase my supply including supplements, spending the day in bed doing nothing but feeding and sleeping to drinking brown beer and whatever else the LC suggested to me.

You've given it a lot of effort and you should feel proud of that. Even just a few oz a day does have clear benefits.

[eliana]

thank you for that - i really love BFing.

NOW - cross your fingers all, we have had a great day and it is 7:24 p.m. here and i have just got LO one down.  Let's see for how long!!

[tiki_mama]

Hi - Emma (Samuel's mum) asked me to have a look at your post as my DD was also conceived by IVF (ICSI actually).

Firstly, I understand how you feel when you refer to your 'body failing you (again)'. I have to say that IVF was the most emotionally draining experience I've ever had and even when you're successful (Congratulations by the way  ) you still don't feel like a 'normal' pregnant woman. Every little twitch or pain makes you freak out and you are never really 100% sure the baby's going to come out healthy, or even survive for that matter    Every emotion is more intense than those experienced by someone who's conceived naturally and It's very hard for people who haven't been through it to understand. So let me just give you a HUGE virtual hug because I do understand and will be here to support you through all of the many good and bad times you have whilst raising your precious little girl   

ok...as far as breastfeeding goes. I have b/f my DD exclusively since birth. I still feed her, but only twice a day as she's very well established on solids and is fast approaching 12 months! I had problems to start with, but they were due to the fact that my LO was 3 weeks early and she was under 6lbs and too teeny to feed properly. I had to pump and then feed her with a syringe or cup   I was never told at any point either during my treatment or while I was pregnant that I would have problems breastfeeding. As far as I know none of the drugs that we are given would affect this aspect of being a mum. Infact I would think that if anything they would increase your milk supply as they increase your hormone levels.

Perhaps the stresses of the treatment and worries during pregnancy have taken their toll and are negatively affecting your supply. The only way to get round this is to continue nursing your DD as often as possible and to try to relax. Don't get too caught up in the EASY routine. It's a fabulous system and will work wonders for you, but at this point you need to focus on your commitment to    b/fing your LO. Every woman can do it. There are very few physical reasons for not being able to (I hope Emma will agree) and I have a feeling that it's your brain that's giving you the problems and not your boobs 

If there's anything I can do to help you get over your feelings of 'failure' then feel free to PM me whenever. You can do it!!