I can't take another night like last night :(

[Carys' mom]

 
For the past week or so, our 22-mo dd has been giving us a hard time going down for bed. She has gone through phases of this in the past, but I don't know why this suddenly started again. Dh is doing wi/wo as I write. This isn't the worst part though. Last night she woke at 2am and wouldn't go back to sleep until 5am! Dh tried wi/wo for quite a while, but caved and held her. To give him a break, I came into her room and tried to get her to go down, but she wouldn't, so I finally brought her downstairs (I know, bad idea.) I gave her some milk and sat in the rocker recliner until she fell asleep, then brought her back to her room and put her down. The reason for the milk is because she hasn't been eating all that much, and I was thinking maybe the problem was hunger. But now I think it might be teething again. Did I mention how much I hate teething?

Anyway, tomorrow dh is going out of town until Tuesday for work, and I'm afraid I'm not going to be able to handle her without him . My mom is coming to stay with dd and me while dh is away, but she's less able to handle dd's crying than me, so she won't be of much help in that area. Any ideas on what I can do??? This is horrible, and I'm exhausted. We gave her pain meds for the teething at some point when she woke last night, but it didn't seem to help. We gave her some before bed tonight too, but I don't hold out much hope for it helping. Please help ...

[Carys' mom]

I take it back - putting her to bed is HORRIFIC 

Dh is STILL doing wi/wo, and it's been about an hour and 15 min. She's hysterical crying. 

[Diegos Mama]

Is she teething?  My two year old was waking for hunger whilst his two year molars were coming through as he wasn't eating well throughout the day.

How was she sleeping prior to the disruption?

[Carys' mom]

Laura,
Thanks for the reply. Before the disruption last night, she had been sleeping pretty well with no night wakings for the past couple weeks, except for the night before last she woke once, but went back down for my dh when he went in. I'm almost positive it's teething (second year molars) combined with separation anxiety. I don't know what else it could be. By the way, she still is not asleep after 2 hours of trying to put her to bed.  

[katriona]

Melanie,

I have no advice for you, just having gone through the first year molars with DS, but I just wanted to offer you some {{hugs}}. It sounds like you're having such a tough time.

You're a great mum, and your DD knows that you love her, even if she's going through a rough patch right now.

Hope things improve some 

Katy

[Carys' mom]

Thanks for the support Katy - I really appreciate it.

Well, last night was, I think, the worst night we've ever had with Carys. She finally went to sleep past MIDNIGHT . We gave up on wi/wo, and kept trying to rock her to sleep in the rocking chair in her room and/or the rocker recliner downstairs. My dh tried multiple times - she fell asleep - but as soon as he put her down in the crib, she cried blood murder. I eventually brought her downstairs to the recliner and waited a good 20 minutes after she fell asleep before I took her up. After putting her down, she slept for 5.5 hours and woke at 5:30am . I took her down to the recliner again, and she ended up sleeping on my lap for another couple hours. Dh and I agreed that while he's gone, I should try to put her down as we normally do, and if she kicks up a fuss, I will just take her down to the recliner and rock her to sleep. When he gets back, we'll sort out the sleep training.

I am so at the end of my rope with this.

[katriona]

oh, that sounds soo awful. i think you and DH are right -- do what you can to get her to sleep while he's away, and tackle it when he comes back, and you can both support each other.

she really is having a tough time. (and so are you  ) perhaps something like gradual withdrawal would work better here rather than wi/wo. it would take longer, but would mean less tears.

are you able to look into her mouth to see if anything's going on? what pain meds were you giving? ibuprofen or paracetamol? teething gel? teething tabs?

big {{hugs}}

katy

[Erin M]

Hi Melanie--
I've been there with you fairly recently, my dd is about 3 weeks younger than yours, but we went through something like this not too long ago -- a couple thoughts:
First off, if her sleep is that awful, you're in a miserable overtired cycle right now.   She's probably screaming at bedtime because she's overtired.  Someone (I think it was Laura) mentioned that when her ds was overtired like that, she'd drive them around mid-morning to let them catch an quick nap so they'd be ok for their midday nap -- which worked perfectly one day when dd1 woke at 5 AM ready to start the day -- she slept for about 20 minutes close to 11 and then was able to take her regular nap around 1:30 which meant she was doing better at bedtime -- this from a kid who would NEVER nap more than once a day since she went to one nap around a year. 

From what I've read, early wakings are usually due to overtiredness and oh those after-midnight wakings are awful.  Nothing that we do will get dd1 back to sleep if she wakes up anywhere after about 1 AM - seems like she just has to tire herself out and she'll go back to sleep (after about 2 hours  ) -- I try to keep her in her crib unless she gets super upset.  It's hard though, the way I look at it, if she wakes at 2 AM, she's been asleep for 6 hours, which would make her pretty rested.

If you think it's teeth I would give something for pain right when she wakes up and then sit with her while it kicks in.  How verbal is she?  Ours is super verbal so usually I'll lay on her floor and explain to her "it's nighttime, everyone is sleeping -- Mommy is sleeping and Daddy is sleeping and baby sister is sleeping...and I run through our whole family/friends...as well as all  her stuffed animals.  I'll sing her songs/tell her stories very quietly as long as it's not getting her more riled up.  Basically, I think I'm keeping her in a somewhat sleepy state of mind and keeping her in her bed without her screaming all at the same time. 

Basically, I've found that overtiredness is really the culprit -- try to keep her nap consistent and put her down a bit early for bed if you can.  We've had to occassional early waking here (we've also got a new baby, so mass confusion everywhere), but we haven't had a middle of the night 2 hour party session for awhile (knock wood). 

Hang in there, I know it's SO hard to have these middle of the night issues -- when they're up for hours and all you want to do is sleep.

[Carys' mom]

Hi Erin,
Thank you so much for your reply. We are definitely in an overtired cycle. We're in even worse shape now. Carys refused to take her nap today, so she's even more overtired. I'm going to put her to bed early tonight (6:30pm) - at least I will TRY to put her to bed at that time.

In answer to your question, Carys is pretty verbal. I'll try what you said about giving her the pain meds right away and talk about who else is asleep. We've been giving her ibuprofen because it usually helps, but it doesn't seem to be helping lately.

I'm so dreading tonight because dh is gone now, and I'm exhausted more than ever because of the lack of sleep and because I'm in the first stages of pregnancy. Wish me luck...

[Diegos Mama]

I'd stay with her and use PD as necessary. Be careful with Ibuprofen as it can upset tummies if not given with food. 

Do you think separation anxiety is the culprit?  Could it be enhanced by her not feeling well?  From my experience wi/wo made sep. anxiety worse with my kids.  I stayed with them until they fell asleep, or used the mattress on the floor as needed, then slowly weaned off of that. 

She sounds spiritied.  Do you have a good windown routine?  Will she understand if you tell her you're going to stay with her and you lay on the floor next to her crib.  Emilio used to pop up and check that I was still there a million times.  Then he gradually gained confidence that I was indeed going to be there when he checked, so he just started checking less.  Soon enough he'd only check once or twice and settle right down.  I would wiggle right out of the room on my back slooooooowly and he'd be okay.  It was a very gradual process though.

I do believe that I had to start with putting him down over and over though at the beginning and sometimes holding him down firmly, but as lovingly as one can muster with a thrashing two year old (  ) -- I'm actually hold him against the side of the crib up against the bumpers on his side and say, 'suck, suck, suck' over and over which is his cue to suck his thumb and he'd settle.  Then over a few days I'd settle him and then lay on the floor... then eventually did my wiggle routine out the door.

I think you need to take a step backwards and work first on her gaining confidence in sleeping again, and if it works with you being there, do it.  Then ever so slowly you wean your presence, each day making an itty bitty change with your presence... so gradual she doesn't notice is the key.   I actually think the sleep glitches with the toddlers are harder than with the babies!  Ugh!

[Carys' mom]

Well, last night was much better in terms of the amount of sleep we all got thank goodness . She went to sleep about 6:20pm and slept until 3:10am without any wakings (yay!). Then I got her to sleep again, and she slept until 5:30am. I'll take that over the previous night! I used accidental parenting to get her to sleep, but that's the plan until dh gets back Tuesday night.

Laura - I'll try to answer your questions.

Do you think separation anxiety is the culprit?  Could it be enhanced by her not feeling well?

Yes! I think she gets SA much worse when she's not feeling well. And that's definitely happening now.

She sounds spiritied.  Do you have a good windown routine?  Will she understand if you tell her you're going to stay with her and you lay on the floor next to her crib.

She is a very spirited girl - it's very frustrating sometimes, especially because she's so different from my personality . We do have a windown routine. Usually, it involves a bath, then putting on pjs, giving medicine if necessary and brushing teeth, then dh usually reads her a couple books in her room and sometimes lets her play quietly for a few minutes if she seems like she needs more of a windown. Then, dh and dd say night-night to her stuffed animals and whatever else dd wants to say goodnight to. He then puts her down awake. Lately, about a minute after dh leaves the room, she'll get up and throw her animals out of the crib and scream for him.

Last night when I tried to read books to her in her room after getting her ready for bed, she wouldn't even let me do that. She went to the door and started crying and saying "downstairs". We are probably going to have to try the gradual withdrawal thing, but I don't know if it will work. It used to work to lie down by her crib, but now she just throws her animals at us and screams until we pick her up. And doing Put Down is a nightmare with her, which is why we went to doing wi/wo. She's also not a good self soother - she was never one to suck her thumb or use a paci. I really feel like I'm in a losing battle .

[Erin M]

Well, last night was much better in terms of the amount of sleep we all got thank goodness

Well, that's an improvement

about a minute after dh leaves the room, she'll get up and throw her animals out of the crib and scream for him.

We have very similar girls.

It used to work to lie down by her crib, but now she just throws her animals at us and screams until we pick her up.

Very, very similar girls.  This is actually why I started talking to her, singing, etc, anything to keep her from screaming to be picked up and throwing her animals around.  I actually started laying all her animals down in her crib so she would lay down too.  (..."and bunny is laying down, and Elmo is laying down" LOL)

Last night when I tried to read books to her in her room after getting her ready for bed, she wouldn't even let me do that. She went to the door and started crying and saying "downstairs".

Ours did this too, she stopped sitting still for books, so I'd "read" her a few from memory or sing her a song -- basically left it up to her a little bit.  "Do you want to hear a story?  Do you want Mommy to sing you a song?"  I'm sure last night she was super overtired anyway since you said she wouldn't nap.  Hope things improve. 

[andibig]

Mel
Honey sorry you are having such a rough time.you don't need me to tell you that we went through a really rough patch of sleep with Sasha . what with tummy bugs, teething and oh lets just add a cold into the mix as well i don't think she slept through for well over a month.
one thing we did find that helped was changing her meds (for teething).our HV said that some meds can have the opp effect and make some LOs hyper and unable to sleep (IYKWIM).
but i agree tackle the sleep training when DH is back (it was actually DH that managed to break the NW!! in our house).quite frankly when DD was bad some nights i would put her in the bed with me so we could both get some sleep.ok so i knew i would have to start again but you do what you have to do some nights.

Sending hugs and loads of support to you

[Carys' mom]

Thanks again Andrea - I appreciate the support. About the meds, what do you give Sasha for teething pain? I don't think Tylenol would be strong enough to help. I don't like giving her so much ibuprofen (motrin), but don't know what else to give.

I would love to be able to take Carys into bed with me in those desperate moments to get some sleep, but she screams and cries if I try to do that. Apparently if she's uncomfortable, I have to be, too.

[Elisabeth and Victorias mummy]

I do not have a 2 year old but I do have a teething 11 month old ho is doing the exact same thing, try tempra.