VERY picky 21m DS refusing proper meals

[clairebear79]

I apologise now b/c this will be lengthy.

DS is 21.5 months old, & is VERY picky about his lunchtime & teatime meals.  Basically he refuses to eat most things that are offered aside from a limited selection of 'favourites'.   It has gone on for so long now (approx 10 months) I'm not sure how to get us back on the right track.

So I'll tell you what he does eat most days   :

7.30am Breakfast - cereal/porridge followed by some fresh fruit eg blueberries.  He ALWAYS eats it, & usually asks for more - it is never refused.

10.00am Snack - Banana/grapes/apple or other fresh fruit.  We cut out his PM snack several months ago in a bid to make sure he is hungry for tea.

12.00pm Lunch - wholemeal toast,along with some corn crisps (eg skips/pom bears) & some grapes/chunks of apple. Occasionally he has sandwiches but he won't eat anything except jam or cheese (which he can only tolerate small amounts of b/c he is MPI).  Any other fillings he picks out & just eats the bread.  I am struggling for ideas for sandwich fillings or for any other lunch ideas so if anyone can inspire me then please do.

5pm Tea - meatballs, chicken nuggets, sausages or fishfingers.  Served with pasta, rice, cous cous or potatoes (none of which he will eat, unless the potatoes are of the chipped variety ).  I usually serve veggies on his plate but he never ever touches them.  He hasn't eaten these since he was about 10 months old.  So basically he eats meat or fishfingers & that's it, unless I give him chips, which I now do quite often just so he's eating something.    Occasionally we have pizza.  For dessert he has a pot of jelly or fruit puree.

7.30pm Bottle - 8oz coconut milk


As you can see, tea time is the meal we struggle most with.  He won't eat any form of plain meat eg roast chicken breast or roast beef.  He seems to like his food really dry so if I serve it with any kind of sauce eg tomato/cheese/gravy he completely refuses.  Won't eat bolognese or lasagne or anything else in a tomato sauce (TBH though he never really liked tomato sauces even when we were weaning him)  Won't eat shepherds pie or stew/casserole anymore (although he did at one stage).  So its plain meat or nothing.

I am now really struggling with what to serve as accompaniments these days, esp. since he will no longer eat pasta or potatoes (which he used to love).  Oh and he now refuses to eat eggs too.

When I cook him anything alternative, he won't even try the food I offer, he just looks at what I have plated up, shakes his head & says 'no' & he point blank refuses to even taste it.  I wouldn't mind so much if I felt he was trying it but he's not.  Then of course there's the wastage.  I try not to stress about it & never try to force him to eat anything as I don't want mealtimes to become a battle.  But it really IS starting to concern me.

Because I have spent SO long struggling to find things he WILL eat, I am ashamed to admit that for the last few months I have fallen into the trap of most days, offering him what I know he will eat, rather than giving something which I know he'll refuse & him have to go hungry.  I hate letting him go hungry b/c it often leads to him EWing the next day.  Anyone who's read any of my posts will know we've had terrible trouble with EW for a long time & I'm so frightened to let anything upset his sleep.  But I suspect that in doing this I am compounding the problem.  

What's most annoying of all is that at nursery (he goes 1 day/week) he eats shepherds pie, sausage casserole, corned beef hash, all with veg.  This week he even ate chilli con carne.  And they offer jam sandwiches if he refuses what they give him, which I don't do at home.  If he can eat proper meals at nursery, then surely he can eat it at home

So...tonight, I cooked chicken curry & rice.  I know he has eaten this at nursery, so I gave him some too.  He completely refused, tipped the food off the plate & then he asked for a yoghurt.  We said no.  So DH has the bright idea to try & bribe him by saying 'you can have a yoghurt if you eat some chicken curry.'  So DS obligingly opens up his mouth & eats the piece of chicken.  And then demands 'yoghurt!'. Since DS did what was asked of him, we felt it was unfair not to keep to our side of the deal, so he got his pudding.  Darn it outsmarted by a toddler!    Seriously though, I don't want to have to resort to bribes.  Is it really the only way

So I'm looking for some constructive advice on how to get out of this 'situation' we find ourselves in.  I'd really like him to eating a better variety of foods & just eat some proper meals - is that so much to ask???  Am I being unrealistic to expect a toddler to eat what we eat???

With regard to the refusals - how do I know if he's just being stubborn versus actually disliking something  And are we taking the right approach in letting him go hungry?  Is it just a case of keeping it up for the foreseeable future & when he's hungry enough, he will start to eat what we offer

Also on days like today, where we are giving new foods, is it fair to make him go hungry if he doesn't eat it?  Should I make him an alternative?  Or should I cook him something he likes eg nuggets along side a small dollop of curry & see if he eats it, so I introduce it as a small portion rather than a full dish IYSWIM?  

I've also considered if maybe I need to make him feel more grown up - so we've bought some big boy cutlery & plates & are contemplating ditching the highchair in favour of a booster seat (although he's quite happy to sit in highchair) - do you think that would help?

If anyone managed to get to the end of this & has any suggestions/advice I'd really appreciate it.

xx

[ZacsMumme]

OMG this could be me writing this, dinner is the worst in our house too just following along

[Hedgehog17]

*Hugs* Claire 

He's doing a lot better than my DS right now - we're back on stage 1 or 2 purees mostly as he just won't chew anything while his teeth are bugging him 

I do insist that he tries at least a spoonful, and often he'll decide that he actually is hungry and will eat the rest of the meal 

Don't worry too much about it affecting his sleep - DS ate and drank very little yesterday and I was expecting NW, but he went through until 8.20am when I got him up!

My worries are more that DS is just not getting enough food - he's basically having what a child 1 year younger would be having  That said, when he's like this he barely moves off the sofa and sleeps tons so I guess he's just about coping on it  It's not right though 

As to whether they should be eating what us adults eat - the books all say they should, but IRL a lot of toddlers don't, especially when they are teething / ill which seems to be pretty much constantly 

Hope some others who've BTDT can add something? 

[stardust599]

We're in the exact same boat too. DD will eat any fruit or cereal, plain sandwiches, toast, homemade pizza, pasta bolognese (only dolmio though!), fishfingers, wee willie winky sausages, carrots, peas. And thats it! No meals, soups, casseroles, potatoes, rice etc.  If she sees them on her plate she cries and says no and throws the whole plate away.  For the last 2 months i've just been giving her what she likes to avoid the hassle :-(  LO also gets upset in the highchair and dont want to make it worse.

We have decided to try twice a week from now on x

[Katet]

Both my children have been limited eaters, although DS1 hasn't been since he was 8yo... long time getting there.

For at least 2 years Ds2 rarely ate dinner/evening meal, if he did it was half an apple or half a slice of bread. I just made sure he ate bigger meals earlier in the day as at that age it is the food in 24hours that leads to hunger, not the food at bedtime.  Also from around 18mo/2yo children often "live on air".

What I found really has worked for us is 5 foods on the plate & 4 must have been eaten to get more of a favourite food/extra or dessert. So at 2yo Dinner was often some sausage, grated cheese, grapes/saltanas, green bean & pasta/1/2 slice of bread. As they got older it became more like serve of our meal & extras, now with DS2 (just turned 7) who doesn't eat potatoes (unless chips/fries) I give pasta/rice or a corn thin with the meat component & 4-5 veg - being older now they have to eat 5 things from the plate - I normally serve at least 3 veg +potato/pasta/rice for a meal & then something like bolognaise counts as 3 (meat, tomato,onion) & with pasta & salad it is pretty easy to get 5 things.

I know that there are people (we had one at preschool giving a talk) who say children need to taste about 5 times... well with my 2 (& both DH & I were limited eaters as children) it is more like 100 times.

FWIW DS1's favourite foods at the moment are roasted cauliflower, grilled fish & curried sausages.

I didn't start what we did until about 2.5yo, but I would give a really small portion of a "liked food" & I'd also try giving some new foods at breakfast when he may be more receptive to it... it is only habit that we eat the way we do & recently our Sunday's have been "topsy turvey days"... today it was sausage rolls for breakfast & oven roasted veg for lunch & cereal for dinner... it is a cold & wet winter day today & well that was how it happened.

[ZacsMumme]

I have to say Claire, I do also worry about sleep, and lack of food, but it never affects Zs sleep. He just always eats a good breakie! I find with Z icing highly energetic that he needs snacks and good breakie and lunch but by the end of the day he is just ready to chill and sleep

I've been trying to fuss less, and I do think a lot of our issues are as hedgehog describes...teething related.

I have a great recipe for you to try Hun, this is how I get veges into Z. Along with chip sized potato, kumera and pumpkin, and carrot sized roasted veges you can change the veges really too and it freezes really well.
 http://recipefinder.msn.co.nz/article.aspx?id=765119

Also, I just offer every day, one day he will eat those veges

[clairebear79]

Thanks ladies.  I don't think teething is to blame here, but more that he is learning that I will just make him the foods he likes for an easy life, which I know I have to stop doing.  Its difficult at this age though, b/c I feel he's still a wee bit young to comprehend a rule like katet suggested.  Definitely something to keep in mind & introduce soon though.

I think you are right about the sleep not being affected so much now.  I have kept sleep logs since O was tiny, & in last few months every time he skipped dinner he EW'd the next day.  It was there on my sleep log in black & white so I was convinced it was related.  But the other night after his refusal to eat tea & only having a fruit jelly, he STTN so that disproved the theory!!!

Sara - interesting recipe - I'll def give it a try! I had to google 'kumara' though as had no idea what it was - its sweet potato where we live!  He used to love it as a baby but I tried offering sweet potato 'chips' a few weeks ago & he point blank refused to try them, even though they are yummy!  Will keep on trying though!x

[Katet]

  Its difficult at this age though, b/c I feel he's still a wee bit young to comprehend a rule like katet suggested.  Definitely something to keep in mind & introduce soon though.

At that age (actually I think they were a bit older when I started) it wasn't a rule so much as a habit for me. A way to make sure that I offered a balanced variety of foods at each meal & that they got the idea that they couldn't fill up on just plain pasta, but needed to have some fruit (cos at that age veg was a no go)  or cheese too. Also about exposure the more times you offer things & they get exposed the more chance of them trying... if you offer 5, then more chances than if you only offer 2 KWIM.

[clairebear79]

Also about exposure the more times you offer things & they get exposed the more chance of them trying... if you offer 5, then more chances than if you only offer 2 KWIM.

That makes a lot of sense.  So more veggies on the plate!

MIL & FIL came over earlier to talk to me about his eating because they too are struggling with what to feed him when they look after him (1 day/week).  He is doing exactly the same at their house, refusing to even try foods & only eating very limited foods.  But they are offering an alternative if he refuses.  They too have been making him what they know he likes, but its so few things now we are all getting stuck.  It is literally processed meat and nothing else.

We have decided we may have to take the hard-line with him, so have come up with a bit of a plan.  We have agreed that we all need to be consistent in our approach & I am going to ask nursery to do the same.  There are to be no alternatives offered by MIL or nursery if he refuses his meal, we will only re-offer what has been cooked.  We are not going to just give him foods we know he will eat, although he will have something on his plate that he definitely does like, in a limited serving, so he can't completely fill up on just that.  We will offer a variety of veg (thanks kate!).  And if he refuses to try it but immediately asks for dessert, we have agreed to say 'you CAN have a jelly/yoghurt/biscuit IF you eat your dinner', so we are telling him what he'll get if he does do something (positive reinforcement) rather than saying 'no you can't have a dessert because you didn't eat your dinner' (negative).  If he point blank refuses to eat then he gets no dinner.

We tried this approach the last 2 days, this is what happened.

Last night, I made meatballs, which I know he likes.  But I decided to serve them coated in a wee bit of tomato sauce, which is something he would usually refuse.  I reserved 3 without sauce just in case.  When I gave them to him he looked at them & said 'proper meatballs'.  Darn that smart kid!!!  He knew I'd tampered with his meatballs!  He completely refused to even taste the tomato coated ones, so DH gave him the 3 plain ones, which he wolfed.  He asked for more, so we told him if he wanted more, he could eat the ones on his plate.  He said 'no' & asked for a yoghurt.  We told him he could have one if he ate some of the remaining meatballs.  He ate a piece, then DH asked can you eat this piece? & he did, & we kept on with that til it was all gone.  He didn't eat any of the pasta or veg but eating the sauce covered meatballs was a start.  So he got his pot of fruity jelly.

Tonight, has been a lot tougher.  I made chicken supreme (chicken in white sauce) with rice & veg.  I didn't chop it up, I served it exactly like ours.  When I put his plate down he started to scream & cry.  I asked if he was going to try his dinner & he said no & went to throw it, so we took the plate from his tray.  He immediately started yelling for pudding , and we told him 'you can have your fruity jelly pot, when you've eaten your dinner' and he screamed & tantrumed, and cried, asking for jelly over & over.  We stayed firm with our stance, & once we'd finished our tea, his was still on the plate untouched.  He continued to beg & scream & cry for 1.5hrs, and eventually, at 6.45pm, he said 'Ollie eat chicken and rice' so I reheated his dinner, put it infront of him & he tucked in.  He ate all the chicken (in the sauce), tasted the rice but didn't have very much, and left his veg.

When he had finished we praised him & let him have his jelly.     

I feel like we may have made a wee bit of a breakthrough, but I'm a little unsure if the approach is right with regard to the dessert. Does it sound reasonable   Are we forcing the issue too much   I don't want to make things worse but something HAS to change.

One thing I'm not really sure of is how much of his dinner we should expect him to eat, before giving dessert.  We feel he should at least make a reasonable effort to try it, and eat some of it, but how much is enough?  One bite of each food on his plate?  Or half of his dinner?  All of it?
I feel this is particularly important, b/c he's already proven that if we say one bite he will do literally that.  Also, b/c he is having a tendency to eat his meat but nothing else, should we insist he has to try everything on his plate???

Any thoughts would be much appreciated.x

[Truly Blessed]

Hi Claire and Everyone,

DS Sam has been through this but come out of the other side. Here is what I did:

1. Had a nervous breakdown and obsessed every day.

2. Posted on BW to find he was 1 of 100.000 LO doing the same thing.

 .

But seriously. I offered a decent sized portion of the things he would eat which were minimal. So for eg:

potato and carrot waffle (processed  )

corned beef

so he has carbs and meat, such as they were.

Then every meal I would offer a vegetable. I served meals in a compartment plate so that he didn't freak about the mystery food touching the other foods. Most of the time I would throw the veg in the bin. But I just kept trying. I felt like I may as well put the money straight in the garbage  .

At snack times I would try and ensure to get his 5 a day in him with the varied fruit that he never ever went off. And he has always had a multivitamin syrup with omega 3 so I could rest assured he would be okay.

Often I would put a vegetable or a new food in a bowl for myself and sit down with it. Then he would ask what I had and I would say 'Oh this is sweetcorn (or whatever) and it's Mammy's not Sam's then he would want to try it and he would. Often he didn't like it, but it was a good way to get him to try it and gave me a chance to praise him for for trying. The thing I forced myself to stop doing was to offer a conveyor belt of foods because he was just waiting to see if the next thing was better and serious money was being wasted.

Claire: As you know I did go down the 'Eat this or there's nothing else route' take him down from the chair and reheat it if he told me he was hungry and it did work, most of the time. BUT: I found it too stressful a method to maintain because on the times when he would dig his heels in I was too concerned to send him to bed hungry (like we need an extra factor to stop them from sleeping!  ) so I would give him cereal or something. So for that reason I found that the other way worked best. I also cut out too many high calorie snacks because sugar just fills them up, so I would keep it to rice cakes, or crackers etc.

So in the last month Sam has had a complete turn around.  For example I served up

Chicken breast
mashed potato
yorkshire pudding
broccoli
cauliflower
carrots
garden peas

The first thing he ate was the Broccoli!   and he ate every piece of veg.

I would never in a million years have seen this happening. I like to think that the familiarity of the food eventually worked to this effect but who knows  

I researched a lot on this subject (surprise surprise I am a google addict) and I found a really good 'Peadiatric nutritional site' The best piece of advice which stayed with me is this:

IT IS NOT OUR JOB TO MAKE OUR CHILDREN EAT. BUT IT IS OUR JOB TO OFFER THEM HEALTHY FOODS REGULARLY AND GIVE THEM A CHANCE TO CHANGE THEIR MINDS.

I think we all react pretty much the same because usually our picky toddlers were incredibly good eaters as babies 'Oh he/she eats anything' sort of thing. Sam was and I know so was Oliver, Claire, and I remember telling you to enjoy it while it lasts   sorry. So we panic 'Oh my goodness what's happened  ! you know   then we offer everything and anything to try and put it right, it's a knee jerk reaction, then before you know it you've created a 'little picky monster'  

I hope this helps and gives you hope that there is light at the end of the tunnel  

Vicki.x.

[clairebear79]

Thanks hun.

I had already taken on board some of your suggestions so he's already having the abidec, afternoon snack is gone, morning snack is usually 1/2 banana or apple & we are not offering him alternatives every time he turns his nose up, b/c like you say, its a bloomin waste of money for one thing!

As you know I did go down the 'Eat this or there's nothing else route' take him down from the chair and reheat it if he told me he was hungry and it did work, most of the time. BUT: I found it too stressful a method to maintain because on the times when he would dig his heels in I was too concerned to send him to bed hungry (like we need an extra factor to stop them from sleeping!  ) so I would give him cereal or something. So for that reason I found that the other way worked best.

Ah so it proved to be a difficult approach to maintain then?  It does go against the grain to send them to bed hungry.  We have done this numerous times now though, b/c if he refuses what else can we do?!  He starts asking for yoghurts & biscuits & I am not about to give him those foods. 

Often I would put a vegetable or a new food in a bowl for myself and sit down with it. Then he would ask what I had and I would say 'Oh this is sweetcorn (or whatever) and it's Mammy's not Sam's then he would want to try it and he would. Often he didn't like it, but it was a good way to get him to try it and gave me a chance to praise him for for trying.

I like this idea - so shall def give it a try! 

What are your thoughts about us using dessert as leverage then?  We aren't directly bribing him by offering pudding in return for him eating his dinner.  Its more he asks for pudding, & we say he can have it, if he eats his dinner.  Is that a bad idea?  I am worried we could end up making mealtimes too stressful by taking this approach.

Today for eg I did a homemade lasagne & garlic bread, which we've had many times before but DS has always refused to eat. DH wanted chips & I didn't want to cook them as I knew this would be all DS would want to eat, but I reluctantly agreed we would cook a few, & DS could have a small serving, so he's getting something he likes, but not enough to fill him up.  Of course he ate a piece of garlic bread, then all his chips, then asked for more.  I told him they were all gone & if he was still hungry he could eat his lasagne.  He poked & prodded it but didn't eat it, & then asked for a cookie (I'd been baking).  We tried the same tack as yesterday, 'you can have a cookie, when you have eaten your dinner.'  Because its a new food we were'nt sure how far to go in terms of insisting he ate it.  In the end we agreed it would be enough for him to taste it.  He immediately agreed, ate one mouthful & then demanded his cookie.  We got him to take another spoonful but he spat it out.  Then he had his cookie.  Thing is kids are smart - is he going to know if he eats one bite but refuses the rest, he'll still get his pud   So is this a completely bad idea? 

IT IS NOT OUR JOB TO MAKE OUR CHILDREN EAT. BUT IT IS OUR JOB TO OFFER THEM HEALTHY FOODS REGULARLY AND GIVE THEM A CHANCE TO CHANGE THEIR MINDS.

This is very true.  So keeping this in mind, is it it perhaps a better approach to serve the food, say nothing, not even ask him if he's going to eat it, and if he doesn't just take it away, without even making a point of having him at least try it?  He will eat it when he is ready & the less pressure/cajoling/bribing the better?  If so, how do we respond when he asks for pudding?  Still say no, or does he get it, b.c he's chosen to only eat that bit??? To give him cereal as a meal substitute, would, IMO be almost like a pudding to him, so I don't really want to go down that route yk?

[ZacsMumme]

Thanks Vicki, we are also doing a lot of what you are now reccommending. I love the idea of eating a vege and seeing if he is interested, though usually he's not

I cut Zs bottle before his nap to 100mls and this has already helped, he had a good helping of tea last night.

It's so hard,ESP when I need snacks to get me through the day with him grouchy when out.they are my secret weapon

[Truly Blessed]

What are your thoughts about us using dessert as leverage then?

This ^^^ I think I cracked. What I started to do not long ago (maybe it has helped us get to where we are) is to ask of him something realistic. So obviously saying if you eat ALL you dinner you can have pudding is too high an expectation, you will undoubtedly have a losing battle on your hands. But what you can do is take a small portion of lasagne and a small amount of veg, and separate it from the rest of the food. Then tell him 'All you need to eat is this much, and you can have pudding' then I would explain 'Because pudding is nice but it doesn't make you strong like Daddy, but this veg..etc does' Sam would then eat it and that shows him Mammy is in charge, and also means that he is eating/tasting the food he needs. If on occasion he refused, then it was game over and out of the chair (I NEVER make false threats, it the only thing I have never compromised on LOL   But then what I would do is to offer a healthy snack at supper time, because it is far enough separated from Dinner time to mean you haven't backed down in his eyes, but he won't go to bed hungry and he will be more hungry by then hopefully teaching him to eat his Dinner. If you prefer you can introduce a supper time snack as a standard thing to safe gaurd the situation YK 

Hope this helps 

(X)

[Truly Blessed]

I cut Zs bottle before his nap to 100mls and this has already helped, he had a good helping of tea last night.

^ This helped us too Sara.

It's so hard,ESP when I need snacks to get me through the day with him grouchy when out.they are my secret weapon

Aha I hear you. If he likes them flavoured rice cakes all the way or a maize type crisp snack, basically anything low in sugar IME that's the stuff that fills them up.  Hope you're feeling well 

(X)

[clairebear79]

Thanks so much hun.  That makes a lot of sense.  I knew it was unrealistic to expect all of it to be eaten, like I said - a reasonable effort is enough, its just knowing how to quantify that!  I like the idea of giving him just some of the 'disliked' food rather than all of it - its certainly better than asking him to have one bite & not enough to put him off completely.
 
We are already following through with our threats, so are good on that score.  I think he is cottoning on as well, b.c tonight he didn't protest for long at all before he ate what we asked of him.  So hopefully we are making some tiny steps. 

Sara - I also found cutting out daytime bottles made a HUGE difference to how much Oliver ate.  Just the BT one to get rid of now! 

Vicki I am thinking your idea of a healthy snack at suppertime might be a way of getting him to drop his bottle too.  Hopefully a cup of milk & a rice cake or something will be more enticing than his bot bot!