Anyone want to talk about 3:2 nap transition? Part 3

[Mom2012]

I tried for a third nap 2hr 20min later and tried for 25 min to get him to sleep. No luck!!! Is that an appropriate time after a 30min nap?

[Mom2012]

Well I'm thinking the 10min increase was perfect for the morning nap. It's been 3 days and he's taking naps that are at least 1hr 30min. However, second nap is still about 30min. He's taking longer to fall asleep also. Does that mean I should increase again just for that nap? It seems like the A time increases so quickly.

[jessmum46]

It really can at this age.  30 min naps can be OT, though sometimes we see them if UT.  If your gut instinct is to push the A then try it for 3-4 days, if it backfires you can always pull back again x

[LittleSplasherMum]

Hi all, we are trying to cut the third nap but I'm not sure I'm doing the right thing 
Ds is 9 months in a couple of days, he started fighting the third nap between 6 and 7 months and it was getting later and later and we were having EWs. One day he didn't go down at all for the last nap, so we put him down at 6.30 and he slept till 6! we were pretty amazed so thought that was the solution. Then we went on holiday for two weeks (he was 8 months) and he could not stay up for more than 2.30 hours, so back to three naps, but it was ok, he slept till 6 most days.
Now we have been back for about two weeks and started increasing his awake time again. Some days we have only two naps and he goes to sleep early, other days we have to have another nap. The problem now is that he's starting waking at 5am again! I have read lots of posts in here and it seems that it's quite normal to have EWs during this transition.
Now my question is: do I keep giving him the nap if his second nap ends too early or do I try to cut the nap completely and try to stretch the awake time until we can get back to a proper BT (7-7.30)? As of yesterday we are on 2.55 awake time.
At the moment his routine is pretty much like this:
if he wakes at 6:
6.30 eat, then breakfast about an hour later
8.55 nap, usually about an hour
10 wake, 10.30 lunch
13ish nap, another hour or a bit more (we don't tend to get more than 1h20 apart from rare occasions when he sleeps for 2h, but could be also 30 mins here)
so now, if he sleeps till 2 or later I usually don't give him another nap and put him down by 6/6.15

Yesterday he woke at 5.15, kept him up till 8.10, slept two hours, but then he went down for his second nap at 13.05 and only slept 30 min ( I was expecting this because of his long morning nap), so managed to get another 25 min nap between 16.30 and 17 bed at 18.25

Also, what is the latest he should have the third nap, I'm thinking 4/4.30?

Thank you very much in advance!

[jessmum46]

Hi LSM, you may get more replies if you post a thread out on the main naps board as this support thread is t very active right now.

But just in general I'd say push to get rid of that catnap, your LO can probably handle more awake time than you think especially as you aren't getting full naps (1.5h+) with the A times you are offering.  I would push for a minimum of 3h first thing and then push that 10 mins every 3-4 days until you are consistently getting a longer nap.  The 1h ish nap is probably UT, he goes to sleep easily because he is used to short A times but isn't tired enough to complete a good two sleep cycles.  If you get a bit brave and push things I think you'll be done with this transition sooner rather than later as 9 months is pretty late to still be on 3 naps .

I would tend to opt for early bedtime unless both the first and second naps have been a complete disaster.  In which case offer a very short catnap to get you to a reasonable bedtime but only 15-20 mins.  There's no absolutes about what time to offer it but you'll need a good 1.5-2h A time afterwards so bear that in mind x

[LittleSplasherMum]

Thank you jessmum46 for your kind reply. I did post a thread and got some advice, pretty much what you said! As from yesterday no CN and 3h+ awake time. We'll continue on the other thread, thanks again!

[Laura_kap]

Hello,

my 2nd LO is having a hard time with the 3-2 transition…she is just a mess lately.
She is 9 months - just getting over a cold, and has just cut her first 2 bottom teeth.  She is a spirited/angel type….my son was such a textbook, you could set a clock to his transitions/naps/milestones etc….she is throwing me for a loop!

She was sleeping 7-7 from 3-7 months with a dream feed - then when I tried to drop the dream feed, she went a bit off…but still made it most of the night (she is a thumb sucker at night, so she tends to self sooth)  however recently she's started early waking

typical day right now looks like this:
3:30am waking (sometimes I feed her if she looks famished, otherwise try to identify issue play, teeth etc
4:30-6:00 - falls back asleep most days….Breastfeed

Breakfast - solids (cereal, fruit - 2-3oz)

8-8:30 Nap  - usually 45min-1.5 hrs

10am - Snack - Breastfeed (fussy usually too busy to take much of a feeding, even in a quiet room)

11:00 - Lunch (3 oz solids, fruit, veg, protein, oats)

12:30-1pm - 2nd nap - 45min to 1.5 hours = waking around 2pm…..

3pm - Snack - breastfeed

(sometimes I still try to get her to take a catnap, but she usually just fusses and cries for 20-30 mins)

4:30 - dinner 3oz protein, grains, fruit, veg

6:00 - bedtime routine including breastfeed

* Some nights she will fall asleep right away at wish…other nights she flops and fusses until 8-8:30pm….
she has been pretty good at self soothing and putter herself to sleep, I've been doing sush-pat etc…trying not to accidental parent her out of her good sleep habits…bit with a 2.5 year old making noise and wanting attention…its so hard!

I'm hoping this is teething pain/9 month growth spurt issues messing with her….but It's been on like this for a few weeks now…I don't want it to become habit….any thoughts?

help appreciated!

thank you parents

[jessmum46]

Have a quick look at the post above, I think you are in a very similar situation!  I would just start pushing her two naps later in the day to even the day up a bit and stop her being so tired by bedtime.  She doesn't need a catnap at her age, that is likely causing problems for you.  So aim more like:

WU 6
Nap 9 ideally for 1.5-2h
Nap 1.30/2ish
BT 6.30pm ish

[Laura_kap]

thanks - but by 9, she is usually fitful and overtired…hard to get down for a nap that late…

I wish I could do naps at 9 and 1…that would make my early bed/early rise situation better…but hard to get it to happen, any thoughts on that?



as per her spirited/angle nature…when she's on, she is good as gold…then she snaps into spirited mode and bucks, screams for attention etc…when she is OT or OS…..is 0 or 100 with her…no in between! lol

[jessmum46]

I'm a fan of the quick shift to be honest, so for daylight savings I just move everything 1h, meals, naps, BT all at once and deal with the mess for a day or two.  A bit tough but kind of gets them there quicker than messing about!  But you can do a gradual shift, so just extend first A by 10-15 mins every few days until you get to where you want to be x

[H7]

My little one is 5 months and 1 week and thanks to following EASY from 8 weeks she's been a great sleeper sleeping through til 7 since she was about 12 weeks. However the last 2 weeks she's been waking at different times chatting. First week it was short bursts up to 20 min at 1/3/4am which gradually shifted to a 5am chatty wake up. First night for 20 min, then 40, then an hr and then an hour and a half 2 days in a row. Tried lots of stuff over the 2 weeks to set her back but nothing seemed to work but the last two days she's only had 2 naps and it's got better.

Wednesday she had 1hr 45 nap in the morning and 2hr 20 in afternoon which i woke her up from at 3.40 and then she went through til bedtime at 6.15. Thurs morning was better as she woke up at 5.10 chatty til 5.30 then slept til 6.15 left her chatting and got her up at 6.45.

Thursday she had a 1 hr morning nap and I decided to let her sleep til she woke from afternoon nap and she slept for 2hr 45 waking at 3. I put her to bed at 6pm and she slept through til 6am 😃

So seems like she's aiming to drop the cat nap but she seems really young to do that and it also means bedtime is really early and I'd like her to start the day at 7am not 6am.

Any advice on the transition would b really appreciated. Also what would you do at the 6am wake up ... leave til 7am as she's happily chatting away? Even though she slept 12hrs??

[Martini~]

Hi Honey! 5 mo is not so early for a nap transition and if your two other naps are good it's possible. To make her survive you can either push A times so the nap are more equally divided through the day. The thing which I did as pushing A tired DS soo much and two looong naps gave him paradoxically more sleep (2+2) than 1.5+1,5+15-20min, was capping the first nap for a period of time and having short-long-short routine. When he was readu we move to 2 naps routine at 7-8 months.

Ahhh, and I would cap the first nap not the second. It better to have longer sleep in the middle of the day and shorter naps in the morning prevent EWU.

[H7]

She's now been asleep 1hr 45 for her morning nap. Was going to wake her but then decided to leave her and now thinking I should wake her.

Although wouldn't a

7am wake up
9am nap
11am wake up
1.15pm nap
3pm wake up
6pm bed

Be an ok routine? Although ideally I'd rather a 6.30/7 bedtime.

She did only have 1hr yesterday as her first nap and then woke later this morning so maybe I should have capped today's! ! Always feel like I'm 2nd guessing myself and never sure what to do.

Ideally I'd like to stretch the first nap to 9.30 start time as feel that would then push the day forward.

[Martini~]

The routine could be fine... but!!! Firstly try to sum up the total sleep during 24/h. With nap transitions, even with one nap less and some A times longer, overall sum of A/S shouldn't be shorter/longer than on 3 naps routine, IYKWIM? So with routine you proposed she would have (I will sum sleep): 2:00+1:45+13:00 = 16:45h of sleep per 24h. If that's similar to what she has before, that's fine. If more, I wouldn't go for that routine....

[H7]

Ta. That's a really good way to look at it.

Before her sleep became all muddled she was sleeping 16 1/4 hours 12 hours at night plus 4hr 15 from naps.

Utlimately I'd like to aim for a 6.30/7 bedtime so if I did that would work out the total amount of sleep aspect.

Today she's only had 3hr 45 nap time from 2 naps which is what she also had yesterday as well with 12hrs sleep so 15hr 45 total sleep.

So nap time total is shorter than previously.

She looks so tired now tho more so than this time yesterday not sure how she will stay awake till 6 but going to start bedtime routine at 5.15 so hopefully that will be a wind down for her and currently she is just calmly lying on her mat with some toys.

I could put her down now for a 30 min cat nap but 5.15 just seems too late for that?? Do u think I'm best off sticking with the two naps and earlier bedtime?

Recently when trying to put her down for a cat a she really screams and then when she's finally asleep she's tough to wake and stares daggers as if too say I'm down for the night thanks especially after hubby had her on Sunday and all the nap fighting meant she eventually napped at 5.30 and he woke her at 6 but she was not happy!