5 mo bad napper had a routine now lost ???

[annette.xx]

Yep I would do as Kara suggested and do a 3 hr first A time always regardless of tired signs etc just to see if you can set his body clock up to 3hrs - then as 3 hrs would be the max A time shave 30 mins off after a short nap to make it 2.5hrs A ...

im having a rough 2 days cos of this teething he has gotten all OT and NW screaming and EW yesterday and again today then for the first time in ages I got a 30 min am nap definately OT after my usual 2hr A time - he was rubbing his face off at 1 hr 15 but that would have just been ridiculosly short so I pushed through it - then continued with another 30 min OT nap then got a long nap for a third which I had to do or bedtime would have been at 4pm!!!!

Nik Nik - your routine is very similar to mine actually just I think I need to be more flexible like you are seems to work for you! and if im reading this correctly then you have around 3.5hrs day sleep - my day sleep varies so much and I have been working more on just getting 9hrs A in the day but seems you have 8.5hrs roughly in a day - im wondering if thats where I am going wrong cos I was thinking too much daysleep to cause the most problems but im beggining to wonder if actually he needs less A in the day - he does get cranky for that last stretch...

my routine varies depending on nap lengths - I have been letting him nap long naps and somedays I have tried capping them to get earlier bedtime using the 2,3,4 but that just leaves him OT...

If long naps like this;

wake 6
2 hrs
nap 8 - 10
3 hrs
nap 1 - 3
4 hrs
bed - 7

if I cap naps its like this

wake 6
2 hrs
nap 8 - 9.30
3 hrs
nap 12.30 - 2
4hrs
bed 6pm

he does so much better on the longer naps but seems to disrupt his night more so think the long day causes OT problems cos bedtimes too late maybe?

anyway all thats out the window for now until I get caught up...im thinking Priya that you got such a short 30 min nap after 2 hrs like I got today becuase of the OT monster!!

Annette.xx

[shresmummy]

Annette I hope your lo is feeling better.

 I keep giving teething as the reason for a lot of his strange behaviour but I see no sign of them yet. wish they would hurry up already!

I gave 3 hr a go today but he only took a 1 hr nap and woke up happy. Then I wasn't sure what to do.

Wake 6:05
Nap 9:05 - 10 woke happy
Nap 12:35 - 1:15 woke happyish
Nap 3:20 - 4 once again happy
Bedtime 6:45

we had a few nws although one of the better nights in a while. Nws were 7:30, and 8:15 both were quick resettles. Then only woke at 10 for his feed.

Why was his night better? Is it because after a short nap he did nearly 2.5 hr? I think I put him down too soon beforethe 2nd nap. But he was rubbing his eyes and he went down so well. But was a ut nap I think isnt it?

Call me crazy but as you suggested a few days ago Annette I wonder if he is going to do another A time increase (I haven't even figured this one out yet!!)  I am no longer getting the longer naps but he is relatively happy. I wish I could get dropping the 3 rd nap over and done with! He is almost 30 weeks!

[*Kara*]

Mine started making huge leaps in A time right around 7 months too... I really think it's a transitional time for them.  They aren't mobile enough to burn themselves out quite yet so they can stay up for what seems like waaaay too long!  Alexandra is almost 9 months and doesn't crawl yet... I haven't tried to push her for a while but I bet she could easily do a 4 hr morning A time now!  She does 4hr - 4hr 15 before bed so it really would surprise me at all.

I figure that they will start shortening those A times again once they are on the move and are exploring more - otherwise we will all be doing the 2-1 at 10 months

[sherry lynn]

Annette - have you tried a 12.5 hour day. That is what Emory prefers, and that's the only thing I really try to stick to with him. I don't put him down before the day has reached 12.5.

Pryia *hugs* it's amazing how hard this all can be. I think that he is taking a long last nap shows that he has to be really tired to take a good nap. Not sure what you should do with that info, but it's just an observation.

[annette.xx]

yeah Priya I just reckon go with whatever works and dont worry about the start time for day or how long the nap was just go for another nap when you think hes ready again and muddle through best you can!!

thats my thinking today cos DS is OT with teething and stuff so im just muddling through using tired signs to guide me until I get out of it - 2,3,4 has gone out the window for the last few days cos there is no way on earth he can do a 4hr last A time at the moment - well yesterday I did 1hr 45 first A cos he was seriously sleepy and he went down a dream and napped for 2hrs!! I figured I may as well as he is in EW nightmares at the moment im just letting him catch the sleep where he can - today he didnt seem too tired (think I caught him up well yesterday and I stupidly pushed him to 2 hrs 30 to see if I could get him out of OT and I got a 30 min OT first nap!! then just 2hrs later he was rubbing his head on me so I put him down and he went straight to sleep and napped until I woke him 2.5hrs later...

he is practising trying to crawl and I think its wearing him out alot so Im just letting him do whatever and doing 3 naps until he seems rested again - when that will be I dont know but until then I will just have to play it by ear!

Annette.xx

[shresmummy]

Hi ladies, well something weird and unexpected has happened the past 2 days. I did 3 hrs in the am cos I think he got out of that ot loop he was in. I got a 1.5 hr nap and then I did another nearly 3 hr a time and got a 1 hr pm nap yesterday and .....wait for it.....
A 1hr20 min pm np today the first time in his life! Knowing my luck will prob be the last time! But the nights have been really unsettled and he has been waking ravenous earlier.

Whatdo you think of these 2 days?

Sunday
Wake 6:45
Nap 9:40-11:05!
Nap 1:55-2:55
Bed 5:45 (went to sleep very well but woke in 30 mins)
Nw 6:15, then really unsettled till 6:45. Would kep waking every 10 mins fussing fidgeting. Then slept till 7:15 and same thing till 7:40. Then slept till 9:30 and woke screaming refused to resettle without feed. Took full feed of 150 ml (5oz).Fussed and restless till 10:45. Normally he settles straight after. Also woke at 1, 4.

Monday
Wake 5:50 (sigh!)
Nap 8:40-9:40 woke crying but managed o resettle till 10:10
Nap 1:05-2:25!
Bed 6
Nws 6:35, then unsettled till 7:15 then woke 7:45, then 9 and refused to settle till I fed at 9:30. Once again took full feed. But then has resettled well. Fingers xxx for a goodnight.

Why are his nights so awful o you think? He goes to sleep just fine but then wakes in 30 min and stuffs around for nearly 45 mins. Do you think he is treating a 5:45/6 pm bt like a nap?

What do you think I should do? Is he ut or ot at bt? I am doing ,3 hr till bed. Should I try more? I couldn't possibly try less without a 5 pm bt!!or should I go back to a cn? I so don't want to o that unless the pm nap is short.

Also what's th deal do you think with suddenly wanting a feed t 9:30 pm? He used to go till 11pm. He is genuinely hungry nd will not settle without it.  Plus he takes a full feed.

Annette I hope your lo gets over the teething related ot fast! I thought we were teething but no ign f anything yet! I am not so sure anymore. My lo is also starting to rock on his knees trying to crawl much to dd's amusement!

[sherry lynn]

Priya - to be honest, that is exactly what our days/nights looked like when we first dropped the catnap. My personal opinion is it's tough right now, but it's good that you are getting in two good naps. Emory put in an extra feed in the early evenings as well. I think I eventually had to get tough and do pat/sh or pu/pd to get rid of it, but I didn't bother until we were on two solid naps. It was very rare for both of my boys to take 2x1.5 (or longer naps) I'm just going to throw that out there. I tried and tried and tried with Lyle and it just never happened. With Emory, I just excepted it much earlier on and I was the better for it. And to be honest, on the rare occasion that he did have an awesome nap day the nights were worse. So I took that as becareful what you wish for   Glad you are getting some good naps.
Is he going down independently at all during the day?

[shresmummy]

We had another good day today very similar to yesterday with a 1hr15 min am nap and a 1h20 min pm nap. I did bt at 5:50ish which was 2.5 hr A time after the pm nap.

Fingers xxxxx for a good night.

I wonde whether that extra evening feed is because they are up longer now and feel hungrier? Either way as you said sherry I iwill also ride it out until he s consistently on 2 naps..Then I will work on getting rid of the feed. I would love it f he just had 2 1.5hr naps. That would put me over the moon! Maybe he will get there?

He is mostly going down independently. That is he needs to e very sleepy after the wind down...but he puts himself to sleep when I lay him in the cot and he is very sleepy.

[annette.xx]

wow your routine is looking fab to me!

hows it going so far?

I got a 45 min pm nap yesterday so I think its time for me to start extending A times cos he didnt seem tired enough when I just put him down for todays pm nap so im sure I will be seeing him again anytime soon with a early wake!!!

Kara I think you are soooo right when you say they suddenly have a huge leap in A times at 7 months - just a week ago he could barely handle the 3hrs before pm nap and was a screaming mess by 2hr 45 A time now hes still happy right until I put him down! Im upto 2hrs 30 A before am nap now but thinking maybe I should extend it a touch as hes still taking a nice long nap here with the short A but I think that then affects his second nap maybe? who knows!!!

Annette.xx

[sherry lynn]

I forgot to say that most days I did get in one good nap (1.5 or more) And sometimes it was the first nap, sometimes it was the second. Was never really consistent with it.

Priya - I hope things settle down for you soon for you. But things are definatly looking up for you. I know the 3rd or 4th day is when it seems to go bust so good luck today

[*Kara*]

Agree with Sherry - things are always messy with NW when naps are dropped.  Give it a week or so to smooth back out while he adjusts.

Annette - I would push it a little bit if it is messing with your second nap   That's usually my sign that A times are off... that second nap is a dead giveaway... I get refusals something awful if DD needs an A time change

[j.and.e]

we are fully on 2 naps now, with earliest bt 6pm. I managd a 20 min cn after pm nap refusal, but pretty much whatever happens we do 2 naps with bt moved btwn 6 and 7. We have 1 nf which i moved to a bottle and he has 3oz, so we are planning to reduce over this wk till its gone. He sometimes wakes 1nce but cud be 2 or 3 times, usually early (before 10). His bottle is the next waking (anytime btwn 10 and 12). He wakes around 6, happy until about 6.30. I aim for nap 9am (but cud be anything btwn 8.45 and 9.30). He usually does 1.15. Then nap 2 about 3hrs later, but we are often out so this can be variable and sometimes a short nap. He is also pulling up, cruising around the cot and teething, so OT and routine is a factor, but lots of reasons for our NWs! Thankfully usually quiet btwn 12 and 6 (touch wood) so i get a gd nite! Xx

[shresmummy]

Sherry you were so right! Things went a bit bust today as you predicted...almost as if he was saying "here's what you thought you had but here we go again with the short napping mum!"

He did a 55 min am nap. Then I kept him up for 2.5 hrs though he was rubbing his eyes since the 2hr mark. I got a 1h10min nap and he woke at 2pm. Was this ut or ot? This was a really awkward time to end the pm nap.

Anyway I did bt at 5:45 pm, he fell asleep by 6. He was up after 30 mins and took another 20 mins to resettled. But since 7 he has had a good night wakingonly at 10:20 for his feed! then resettling straight back. Fingers xxx the rest of the night.

Wonder if his better night is just a result of his body adjusting? Or the nearly 4 hrA time before bed? He had a 11 hr day today cos he only woke at 6:40am but due to the short am nap I had to move it up.

J and e sound like we moved to 2 naps at the same time! And you seem to have a good routine going. Is your am nap always only 1h15 min? And when you have a long pm nap how long is it? Also, if you get a short pm nap how long an A time do you have before bed?

[annette.xx]

thanks J an e for sharing your routine - it sounds fab!

Kara - I have increased to 2.5hrs first A and got good naps 2 days in row and last night I got just 1 NW at 2am quick feed then down again until 6am! bedtime was 7.30 so just 10.5hrs nightsleep so I am going to work on keeping bedtime a bit earlier maybe between 6 - 7 to encourage a longer stretch of nightsleep...but i have to say he was a pleasure this morning so yesterdays routine worked well to keep him rested but just have to figure out how to make his day 13.5hrs to balance the nightsleep!!!

only problem is im just never knowing what to do as the waketimes are so variable - like today was 6am so I just did 2.5hrs as usual but now bedtime is going to end up being at around 6pm and I fear a 5am wake tomorrow?!!

Im considering setting first nap at around 9.30am and working from there to try and get consistancy cos the feeding to sleep at early wakings no longer works! I think you may be right Kara about nudging A times more - maybe I should have still pushed him to at least 9am this morning which would have been a 3hr A time and only do the 2.5 if he wakes up later if that makes any sense??!!

[j.and.e]

shresmummy, think our bubs are about the same age, 24/12 (urs is 28th?) I find after a bad pm nap (less than an hour) I go out with the boys. E is usually happy and distracted and may take a 15 min cn in car or buggy, then we do E bt. I try to keep pm nap at 1pm at the earliest, and am nap at 9am at the earliest to ensure we dont go to bed before 6, even if naps suck! I dont usually get wake up before 6 am, altho did get one 5.30 am. Yuck. 1.15 seems a usual am nap for him, but today he only did 1h (after 3h A time). 1hr plus seems Ok for him thou as he is happy and copes with next A. Am waiting for a tooth to come thru and hope naps and Nws improve after that. Am happy that i can get out with ds1 morning and pm so we can make the most of the summer! XX