Author Topic: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)  (Read 3253 times)

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Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #45 on: September 08, 2016, 18:37:12 pm »
Oh no I forgot about the clock change.. My DD is waking around 5-5.30 too atm..I can't face a 4am wu!

Glad things have settled a bit for you routine wise for now.  Let me know how the day shifting goes,I might need to try it myself!

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Offline jessmum46

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #46 on: September 09, 2016, 06:42:46 am »
I've always found a big jump shift the best way to go - rocky couple of days then everything seems to adjust better than a slow approach x
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Offline ecwinters

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #47 on: September 09, 2016, 08:53:48 am »
Scottishmummy - oh no poor you!  Do yo have a catnap as well before the main nap?  Well hopefully they will both shift brilliantly!  I really don't want 4:00am either.

Jessmum46 - if I did a jump of half an hour (to try and get him to WU at about 6ish) when what do I do - just shift everything out in the day by half an hour? If I put him to bed half an hour later 'cold turkey' I'm pretty sure he'd still wake up at his normal time, or even earlier.  I thought about doing 15 minutes every 3-4 days but maybe that's too slow?





Offline jessmum46

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #48 on: September 09, 2016, 13:08:12 pm »
Yes that's what I've done for DST, literally just shifted everything an hour all at once.  So catnap an hour later, main nap an hour later, bedtime an hour later plus all meals an hour later as well.  Usually we are back on track within 2-3 days, compared to the 1-2 weeks I imagine it would take to shift more gradually.  LO will likely wake at usual time first day or so, but they accumulate tiredness quickly and so the 'crash' and shift seems to happen fairly soon.  I know a gradual approach can work, just don't have much personal experience with it :). Mine have both done well with the cold turkey approach, as long as you don't expect it to be perfect on day one!
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Offline ecwinters

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #49 on: September 11, 2016, 08:54:11 am »
Something is still not quite right with what I'm doing...he's been OT for the past two days and waking up about 5am.  Even with his early bed time it's still not giving him enough sleep.  So, what I'm doing is this:

WU-who knows!?  5am/5:30am if we're lucky
Catnap-9:45-10:05
Nap-I put him into his cot at 12:10 but he's taking 20-25 minutes to go down usually.  Yesterday he did 12:30-2:00pm but sometimes I only get 1 hour 15 minutes from him.
Bed around 6pm (+ or - 10 mins) and asleep by 6:30 at the latest but usually before. 

I'm wondering if he finds the gap between the catnap and the nap a bit of a struggle.  Scottishmummy - I know you do a catnap too (and have EWU) - what is your routine please?

At the moment, the aim is to give him enough sleep rather than try and shift the day - I'd like to get him settled a bit before shifting the day but of course there will come a time when I'll have to do it anyway!

Thanks!

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #50 on: September 12, 2016, 12:40:06 pm »
Hi there!

Our routine at the moment is v similar to yours:

Wu: usually around 5-5.45
Nap 1: 9.45/50-10
Nap 2: 1-wake (usually sometime between 2.30-3.30)
BT: 7-7.30 depending on how long she slept for 2nd nap

But our wu is early too, so I don't think my routine is right either.

Looking at yours..the long time to settle and 1hr15 for 2nd nap suggests UT to me. I'd either try the first nap shorter or the 2nd nap later, which would give you a later BT too and maybe a later wake up?? (In theory!)

I'm wondering whether I should push DD to 1 nap tbh, but she is exhausted by 9.30/45, always falls asleep then in the car or buggy (we're often heading out then) & going to 1 nap would mean keeping a grumpy baby going then starting it around 11.30/12ish which is impossible with nursery pick up & with DD's nursery routine on the day she's there :-(
"Touchy/Spirited" DS


"Textbook" DD



Offline ecwinters

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #51 on: September 13, 2016, 12:10:50 pm »
Thanks!  It's so tricky isn't it! 

I know people always say push/cap the first nap to get rid of EWUs but it's never worked for us in the past.  DS seems to be going through a cycle of a couple of OT days, then he'll catch up at night and wake later, and then the next day will be lovely...but then he'll get OT again and wake earlier.  My instinct is to move his catnap earlier - to 9:30am and then his longer sleep to about 12ish, but keep bedtime the same.  I'm just not sure though!

Like you, I don't think DS can do 1 nap all the time yet.  I guess it's just a juggling act until they can.  I hate him being this tired though!  Poor you though - I don't even have the complication of nursery pick ups!  If you managed to shift your day, would it improve things?

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #52 on: September 13, 2016, 19:27:06 pm »
Yeah, I'd like to try shifting the whole day but DD is exhausted by 9.30/45, so it's tricky.

Are you still trying to get a stable routine then shift the day later? If so & you've tried the CN at 9.45 for a few days now, maybe you could, shift it earlier and see how it goes?
"Touchy/Spirited" DS


"Textbook" DD



Offline ecwinters

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #53 on: September 14, 2016, 08:00:04 am »
Yes, I was trying to get a stable routine and then shift the whole day, but DS has just been getting so so tired!  I've never seen him this grumpy - he's either crying at anything or so OT that he's hyper. 

This morning hit a new low as he woke at 4:05am! A 10 hour night only which is always a disaster night for him.   I left him in his cot until 6am and he DID NOT RESETTLE!  Can you believe it?!  I went in twice as he called mama but otherwise he just chatted or tried to go back to sleep and then failed! 

As I have no idea what on earth to do with him, I am trying for a nap now - but have no idea if he'll go down.  He's shrieking away still.  I may just let him sleep if he goes down - can't face giving him a 20 minute catnap as it's obviously not working.

DH is working in the US at the moment, so it's just me and DS - I'm at a bit of a loss to be honest!!  I've been reading some other posts on this board and clearly lots of other people are struggling with the same thing.  I hope somebody finds something which works soon!

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #54 on: September 14, 2016, 19:35:33 pm »
Oh no! An EW and on your own too, that's very tough.

How did the rest of the day go & what did the day before the v EW look like?

I really hope you get a better night tonight and catch up sleep for everyone

Xxx
"Touchy/Spirited" DS


"Textbook" DD



Offline ecwinters

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #55 on: September 14, 2016, 20:09:14 pm »
Hi
Hmm - not great!

Slept from 9:00-10:10 and woke up pretty miserable.
I tried for another nap at 2:00pm and he went down at 2:30pm after a lot of playing around but only did 35 minutes!  Assume it was OT. 
In his cot for bed at 5:30pm as I honestly had no idea when to put him down - asleep at 6:15pm after talking...talking...talking! 

I think it's accumulated OT as yesterday was pretty normal:
WU: 5:15
Catnap: 9:45-10:05
Nap: 12:25-1:50
Then asleep at 6:00/05pm

His nights have been gradually getting worse with this catnap, so I'm assuming that he either doesn't like it or it comes far too late in the day for him.  It's so hard, as when he used to get OT (about 2 months ago even), you could give him 2 longer (1 hour plus) naps in a day and an early bed time and he'd catch up.  But he just doesn't want to nap late in the afternoons anymore!

Off to bed now as I'm pretty sure it will be 4am again tomorrow!  Hope you get a nice late wake up tomorrow :)

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #56 on: September 14, 2016, 20:22:11 pm »
Oh no, I hope you get a good sleep and a better night.....

It sounds like you're really not happy with the catnap.  Honestly, if it's not suiting you or him, maybe go back to trying for a long morning nap and seeing if you can get a pm CN - and if you need to try to APOP it if he won't sleep in the cot- maybe in the car or buggy if that would work?

And maybe set a bedtime window...so say, between 6-7pm...6 of you feel he's OT or slept poorly and trying to get closer to 7 in aim for a later wake up on better nap days? That sometimes helps with trying to work out BT on days when it feels like routine has gone out the window.

I hope tomorrow is better for you xxx
"Touchy/Spirited" DS


"Textbook" DD



Offline ecwinters

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #57 on: September 15, 2016, 20:02:35 pm »
Thanks!
He seemed happier and less tired this morning - woke at 5:15 ish which is still dreadful but over an hour later than the day before!!!

As I was literally at a loss to know what to do, I gave him a 20 minute catnap as usual, but earlier (put him down for 9 and he went down 9:10-9:30).  Then tried for main nap at 11:40 (in his cot then) but didn't go down until 12:10 - was quite happy rolling around.  But only did 1 hour 10 minutes - woke crying mama! 

So up at 1:20pm and in bed at 5:40pm and asleep by 6pm. 

I don't think I can push him to more than 5.5 hours in the afternoon, especially on a rubbish 1 hour 10 nap.  It's not a lot of sleep in the day is it - 1 hour and 30 minutes?  When he was on 2 naps he'd do 2-2.5 hours.  Is it usual for them to have less sleep in the day on 1 nap?  I was kind of hoping he'd start to nap for 2-2.5 hours in one go!  No wonder he's getting tired!

Do you really think a later bedtime will make him wake later?  He used to go to bed around 7 and wake about 6 (about 2-3 months ago) but it's just crept earlier and earlier - made worse by him refusing the pm nap quite often and then me putting him down at 5:30pm!  I feel I'm putting him down so early but then I look at his WU time and it's nearly a 13 hour day anyway...

Hope we both get to one nap soon!  There's so much going on for DS at the moment - he's growing a canine (one more to go after this then he has 16 teeth so maybe we'll get a break!?).  Also clearly going through a huge language development thing - spent 10 minutes in his cot last night trying to say 'digger' properly!!!  He's just talking, talking talking...
And of course dad being in the US doesn't help as he's clearly missing him a lot :(

Thanks for your help. 


Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #58 on: September 16, 2016, 18:46:10 pm »
Hmmm, my gut feeling is that an earlier nap might just keep the EW longer..I do think EW, early nap and early bed gets into a cycle of ongoing EW.

It des sound like he's going through a big developmental spurt too which throw sleep off.

Is he about 17 mo now? Have you considered just trying for the 1 nap? Or trying long am/short pm e.g. With EW do you think he could get to 10 and let him sleep as long as he wanted? Then try a late pm CN and then gradually push the first nap later until it's closer to the middle of the day?

DD has done longer nights and woken later (6.30/7ish) the last couple of days but mainly because she isn't sleeping well at childcare now I'm back to work and either refuses am nap or takes short naps ..but she is getting v sad and OT by BT..your LO is a good 6months or so older though and might cope with one nap better.
"Touchy/Spirited" DS


"Textbook" DD



Offline ecwinters

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Re: 2-1 transition worries (and we haven't even really started yet!)
« Reply #59 on: September 16, 2016, 19:25:55 pm »
Hello!  I've just found the 2-1 thread so have been reading that too :)

Well today he refused the 9am catnap - so I put him in the buggy and walked him into town (only about 15 minutes away) - we walked around town for a bit then came back home (no signs of falling asleep in the buggy!).  Big snack, and then he was handing me his sleeping bag at 10:30 so I put him in his cot.  He was asleep in a couple of minutes! 
But still only did 1 hour 20 - that would have been a GREAT nap when we were on 2 naps, but on one nap it's not so good is it?

So his A time was 5.5 hours (but that did include some time in the cot this morning before i got him up). 
Didn't try for an afternoon catnap as it would have needed to be at 4:30 or later - making bedtime about 7/7:30pm even if he'd have gone down.  He was tired around that time though so may have, but I could have only given him 20 minutes and he would have been miserable until bedtime.  It's so hard to know what's best.

I'm not really thinking about it as EWUs - more that I've screwed up his schedule so he's about an hour earlier than I would like.  If it had been:
WU - 6:10
Nap - 11:35-1:00
Bedtime - 6:30 and asleep by 6:40pm
then I would be happy enough despite the rubbish amount of day sleep. 

I'm so glad your DD is waking later (at least for a while) - but it's not fun having her miserable in the day.  Hope she gets used to childcare soon.

DS is 18 months in a few days time!  So probably could handle 1 nap days - I suppose they do get tired at first and it might be just a case of pushing through?  DH gets back from the US this weekend and is braver than me with DS and his sleep so might well just tell me to go for it!  I feel changing everything around is confusing DS at the moment.

We began this whole saga with long AM short PM but what happened is he refused the PM nap and then I put him down early. However, even with 11/11.5 hour nights a 5:30pm bedtime only gets you back to 5am the next day...