Author Topic: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months  (Read 5210 times)

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Offline Wiki

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Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« on: March 13, 2006, 11:10:50 am »
Hi, this is my first post here, as I'm totally confused by my nearly 12 week old son!

We haven't been following EASY exactly, but a similar kind of routine that my son has really put himself into, 3 hourly feeds etc. He started to sleep long stretches from 3 weeks old, then for the last 6 weeks he has had a dreamfeed at 11pm and has slept til 7am. He has bath, bottle, bed at 7pm and goes off to sleep easily, as he does for (most) day time naps. But suddenly, he's waking in the night - 2am, 5am, 4.30am, but he's not hungry! He chats to himself for up to 30 mins before calling for us - we then try to get him back to sleep but end up feeding him as he is of course hungry by that point. Why is he suddenly waking up now?

How old is your child? 12 weeks
What’s his/her daily routine? 3 hourly
What’s nap routine?  4 per day.
How long are naps? From 45 mins to 1.5 hours
What's bedtime routine? Time? Bath, massage, bottle, bed. 7pm
Do you bottle or breastfed?? Bottle
How much? or how long? 5 bottles during day (7-8oz) and a 4oz dreamfeed
If breastfed.. one side or both?? (at each feed)
How many wakes per night? Usually none, now 1-2.
What’s your LO like when waking at night? How long is he/she up? Pretty calm. An hour (if fed).
When you go to him/her is she fussing or crying? Or is it a mantra cry? Fussing really. What's a mantra cry?
What have you tried to settle?? Doesn't like PU/PD or shhs/pat. Cuddle, then end up feeding.
What do you do for A time and how long is it?
Are there developmental issues such as teething or milestones? Growth spurt???
Have you introduced cereal? Why, how much, and how many times a day? (for LO’s under 6 months) No
Do they have a prop? If so what is it? No, hates dummies.
Do they have a lovie? No.

Offline brightside

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2006, 17:30:46 pm »
OMG! I could have written the exact same post. Can't wait to see what answers you get. My DS also isn't hungry. He just wants soothing back to sleep. I'm beginning to wonder if I'll ever get a full nights sleep!
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Offline brightside

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2006, 12:47:12 pm »
We are already on 4 hour feed because at every 3 hours DS was just messing with the bottles as if he wasn't hungry. He has been much better at every 4 hours. Makes EASY a bit more difficult though. His awake time is catching up though now. Currently 1hr45 mins.  I also try to limit his day time sleep to 4 hours so that he sleeps for about 11 at night.

We did have some success last night. Tried w2s at 2am because I felt that the 3am and 5.30am wakings were habitual. Thought I'd work on the 3am first. Well, he slept ALL night!!!!!  :o :o :o ;D could be a fluke. Going to try it again tonight to see what happens. Unfortunately I am now an habitual waker at 5.30 so I didn't get a full nights sleep! LOL!

Wiki: are your wakings always at the same time. If so, try doing w2s an hour before the first waking.
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Offline Wiki

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2006, 09:37:49 am »
Hi all,

Well, a bit of a crazy update from me. I had a look at Tracy's book at a friends house yesterday, and decided that the sudden random wakings last week were a growth spurt, as they were at random times, and once he was fully awake, he would take a full bottle and settle!

HOWEVER, before I read that, we decided that maybe the dreamfeed was disturbing his sleep patterns, as he really only takes 3-4oz then, compared to 7-8oz every three hours during the day. So we let him sleep, the first night he did 8.15pm-6.45am, then 7.15pm-6.35am, and last night, 7pm-6.55am!! So we're not sure what was causing him to wake up, but I'm sure at least this week its not hunger. He was 12 weeks yesterday!!!!!!

We are getting the messing about with bottles thing though now, at the 10am and 1pm feeds. Maybe I need to hold him off a bit longer and move towards 4hours? He wouldn't finish his 7am bottle today though either, maybe the Commonwealth Games was distracting him!

Regarding sleep, his naps aren't for consistent times, but he probably gets 3-4 hours a day total, sometimes 5.

Thanks for all your advice, if I move towards 4 hour EASY, do I just put 1oz more in each bottle, so he gets the same amount? I find his hunger cues the hardest to spot, as he has never really ever yelled for food. And he doesn't have the newborn cues anymore really.

Wiki

Offline lemuelpitkin

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2006, 09:19:49 am »
Hi There

I have a very similar problem. I have been on EASY since birth and when my DS was 13 weeks old I decided to drop the dreamfeed as digesting it seemed to be keeping him awake at between 2.30-6am. Always made a straining noise and he tended to get annoyed that I woke him to feed him at 10.30 (unfortunately he suffers with very bad wind/reflux so could not feed him in his sleep).

For the last 2 weeks he has been sleeping 7pm to 6am with the occasional wake-up. But the last 3 nights he has been up every hour. Not hungry because I usually am able to spot that and add in extra ounces. He's unswaddled, half way up the crib seemingly trying to get back to sleep. First I thought he was cold, so I wrapped him up but an hour later he had shimmied up his bed. He repeated this several times. Is this a developmental thing? Is he practicing a new skill? Does he not like being swaddled anymore?

My DH is going to buy a baby sleeping bag today so we can begin a process of elimination (always seems to be a process of elimination doesn't it?).

I have been logging his days for the last 9 weeks and noticed that the last few days we have slipped backwards from a 4 hours EASY which we were working towards (we'd got to 3 3/4 hours between feeds) to 3 hours 15 mins or 3 1/2 hours. His naps also seem too long and he cannot stay awake. So here is my plan of attack so to speak.

1) I think I need to fix the time between feeds issue so he is fed at 6, 10, 2 and I cluster at 4.30 and 6.30 (in bed by 7pm). Then I can truly gauge the amount he takes normally 6-7oz and whether he needs more - to rule out growth spurt

2) Then I need to keep him awake more to practice his new found shimmying skill which allows him to travel short distances on his back (hasn't mastered rolling on his side yet). This may cut down on the need to practice at night. Interestingly I have been following Tracey's idea of catching him at the first few yawns. I take him to his room have some down time for 15 minutes then put him down and he fusses but eventually goes off. But today I tried keeping him up longer than his first few yawns and he was quite happy to stay up another 1/2 hour before getting cranky. He then was much easier to put down as he was dead tired. Perhaps I have been putting him down too soon for fear of him being overtired but really he needs to be a bit overtired.

3) I need to make sure his daytime naps are not too long (currently around 5 hours with 11 hours at night).

4) Need to move from swaddling (he did have his hands swaddled to his face), which up to now he has been fine with ( a little resistance but not much) to a sleeping bag (we tend to like our bedrooms cool) so that we cannot factor out discomfort.

I just hope I get my sleep through the night baby back one day. Doesn't like sometimes, just when you think you are totally tuned in to them. You wake up and someone has put a completely different baby in the crib and you have to start over!

Jo

Offline elliotlove

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2006, 14:52:18 pm »
Jo & girls ! Wow - this sounds just like elliot.
He just turned 4mos and is up all the time in the night. He is up all the time, last night 9:30, 10:30, 12:30, 2:00, 3:30, 4:30 , 5:00, 6:00. Its been like this for 3 weeks and I am seriously beginning to loose my mind.

I, like you, see the yawns and think "uh oh better get him down for a nap" Elliot goes down so easy I always thought it was the right thing to do. We have also been on a 3 hour schedule (because I didnt think he could stay up long enough) and I dont think he gets enough awake time or enough food.

 I am always afraid he will be overtired just like you! He gets 5hrs of naps (sometimes a little more) and goes to bed at 6:30 and we start our day at 7am. Guess this is too much sleep, right?

Normally for his first nap he'd only be up for an hour and 10 minutes or so. Today I pushed it to an hour and 45min and he was really tired, but went down in his crib so fast it was great!

I still swaddle elliot, he loves it, and I dont feel this needs to be changed yet for him - but let me know how it goes for you.

Offline elliotlove

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2006, 15:24:30 pm »
Stacy
thank you! can you tell me when and for how long your son naps?
3 naps a day? About an hour each?
Thank you.

Offline sinye

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2006, 15:29:23 pm »
This sounds completely like my Jed!!

He is 3 1/2 months old and was sleeping 6 hours a night.  The last week he's been waking up earlier and earlier.  And finally last night he woke up every hour from 11 pm to 5 am.  I finally gave up and fed him at 5 am, instead of holding out until 6.  He's been on the 3.5 hr EASY.  But it's been tough because he can't take more than a 30 minute nap (w2s has been pretty tough).  I want to cluster in the evening but I don't know how since I do notice that he wakes up more if I feed him more.  I've tried the dream feed, but I think it messes up his digestion since he's had a little bit of reflux.  

I've been feeding him (both sides since he seems more content) at 6 am , 9:30, 1pm, 4:30 and 8 pm (bath time at 7:30pm) dream feed at 11 pm or 11:30.  He doesn't ever seem super hungry at any of those feeds.  When he wakes up he cries a lot and it's hard to settle him down these past few days with pat/sh. 

I feel like he's not getting enough sleep during the day because his naps are so short and he's overtired.  But I just can't get him to sleep longer.  I'd LOVE to see what everybody else is doing and how you cluster at this age at night.

THanks!!

Offline elliotlove

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2006, 15:37:09 pm »
sinye
I had the same thing - elliot just seemed like he was regressing with his sleep. He went from 8 hours to7 to 6 and 5 really fast. It was awful! Now he doesnt even do 5. I need to push a 4 hour routine...
I wonder if I should do the DF as it seems to disturb his sleep? Advice anyone?
I would love to hear advice for sinye as her feeding schedule seems okay???

Offline lemuelpitkin

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2006, 16:24:26 pm »
Dear All

Seems we have all or are all experiencing this mysterious 3 to 4 month problem. On reading Tracey's books she does specify that this window of transition is a difficult one but I don't think I appreciated just how demoralising it would be after we had such a good routine going.

At the moment our routine is 6, 9.45, 1.30 then clustering at 4.30 and 6.30. I'm loathe to put the dream feed back in as so many nights he has quite happily slept 11 hours. We prefer the 6 am start which  can make implementing a four hour EASY a little tricky sometimes.

I am wondering if he is in some kind of pain though, which is keeping him up at night. Everytime I went in last night it he was crying with his eyes closed and his legs really drawn up to his stomach and had managed to get himself up to the top of his bed with no covers on, like he'd been writhing. We have always had a problem with wind and silent reflux. 3 out of 5 bottles seem to cause him discomfort during a feed. A friend recommended a local chiropractor who offers the McTimoney technique for babies and I thought I might try that.

There are so many things it can be, it's difficult to know which to try first. Maybe riding it out and accepting that I'll not get good quality sleep until he leaves for college is the way forward ;)Jo

Offline ryan's mum

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2006, 16:29:31 pm »
the way you describe your son writhing to the top of his crib , this is what Ryan did a lot at that age , his refux peaked at 5 months where he was no longer coping with the pain , he started waking in the night. he used to draw his legs up in the night and cry with his eyes shut , he never wanted picking up he just wanted to go back to sleep.
[img width= height=]http://tac.families.com/tickers/tdb.php?tid=1032165&ignore=1[/img]Ryan James 9 Nov 2003

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son , I may have silver in my hair but you are the gold in my heart .

Offline sinye

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2006, 17:04:45 pm »
I'm sort of confused by the cluster feedings because in Tracy's book she says not to cluster feed after 8 weeks.  What is everyone's thoughts on this?

ElliotLove: I'll try cluster feeding him today.  I fed him at 5 am, and 9am, and I'll feed him at 12:30, 4,6, and 8 and see what happens.  Is that too much??

Regarding pain - this has been an ongoing discussion in my house.  My mother-in-law sometimes comes over to help out at night.  She's convinced that my lo just has gas and is in pain and just needs to be cuddled at night.  I think his reflux has really calmed down since he rarely spits up anymore.  My lo is often a screamer and it's hard to tell if he's tired or hungry or in pain, though I am inclined to think he's tired because he can just drop off into a heavy sleep after a crying spell.  I think that he just doesn't know how to selfsoothe and put himself to sleep.  any thoughts?

btw - Jed just took a 40 min nap after a w2s.  A 5 minute improvement!!

Offline elliotlove

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2006, 17:52:00 pm »
stacy
thanks for posting your schedule. Right now I am just concentrating on eating spaced 4 hours (or 3.45) apart. I just have to let the naps fall where they may and keep him up for at least 1hr45minutes between times. what do you think?

I am cognisant of the "EAS", but I cant possibly have it all work out perfectly, right?

Poor guy, he is really tired today.

Also, he has only had 10 oz total  :-[
He ate 4oz at 8am
6oz at 12am

Im really hoping he'll have 7oz for his next feeding
Anymore thoughts or advice is appreciated.


Offline elliotlove

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2006, 18:12:54 pm »
Id love to think that he is teething.....but no, its just his schedulle and how wrong it is for him.
Today he has cut both his naps short (it figures)
First nap - 1 hour
Second nap  - he was so tired and went down at 12:35 and woke at 1:05. I just went in and held him for a minute and now he is back down. Hopefully he'll nap for a good hour.

Thank you for all of your advice. The last 1/2 hour he's been up today I have kept very low key. Just holding him or walking around the house...etc....and so far he goes down with no fuss.

Offline Inlovew/Charlie

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Re: Sudden night wakings - at 3 months
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2006, 20:05:05 pm »
Hi !

I feel so encouraged that others are having the EXACT same problem as me. My son is now 4 1/2 months and we are still trying to do 3 hr easy.
Ok well that is all starting to change after reading this thread. These night wakings have been going since he turned 3 months. He was sleeping 7hrs, then regressed by an hour regularly..ugh! I have been experimenting with things since then, and am exhausted. Now we pray for a 4 hour stretch before we begin the two hour wake ups all night long. I just felt the same as Elliot's mom that he was tired after 1 15 mn. It will be interesting if we all post updates to see if our babies have improved in a week or two ! Keep me updated !!